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  1. #1

    Mistweavers need help!

    Hey guys,

    Mistweavers are in a weird spot right now. They are pretty much the only Healer without a raid benefit. This video really sums it up. I hope that they get some kind of attention soon.


  2. #2
    Mystic Touch and a raid-wide dispel (and instant heal) doesn't count anymore? Coulda fooled me. Life Cocoon might not be Guardian Angel, but it also isn't useless, even in Mythic raids.

  3. #3
    Mystic touch can be brought into the raid more easily with a brewmaster (which is fantastic at the moment) and revival is just not as strong as a shamas spirit link or any other utitly it brings on top of output. On top of that they have mana issues that other classes don't have.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    Mystic Touch and a raid-wide dispel (and instant heal) doesn't count anymore? Coulda fooled me. Life Cocoon might not be Guardian Angel, but it also isn't useless, even in Mythic raids.
    That's also not even including yu'lon. Unfortunatly, people don't seem to know how to use her right. Getting an innervate whilst popping yu'lon and going to town with enveloping breath healing is just funny.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    Mystic Touch and a raid-wide dispel (and instant heal) doesn't count anymore? Coulda fooled me. Life Cocoon might not be Guardian Angel, but it also isn't useless, even in Mythic raids.
    How often is a raid wide dispel actually useful? And revival’s heal is very low. Compare to shammy which has three good raid cool downs. That’s one of those niche abilities that they don’t expect every raid to have so they don’t design encounters around it and it’s effectively useless.

    Re: mystic touch, that’s a crutch to keep one monk in the raid. I’d rather play a class that is designed well enough to make it in on its own, and (gasp) even have more than 1 sometimes because it’s good!

    As is mistweaver has the worst cooldowns of any healer, it’s the most mana hungry healer, throughput is mediocre, and its dps is lower than disc and pally. It’s shockingly, stunningly bad.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by FuujCraft View Post
    On top of that they have mana issues that other classes don't have.
    Only if you don't know how to manage mana. Mistweaver has very high sustain healing which is balanced by high mana use. Learn to control mana, and use the right spells is key to MW.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommi View Post
    Getting an innervate
    Key part of that statement highlighted.

    Why are we the one healer whose kit seems to be built around requiring innervate to do good throughput?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    How often is a raid wide dispel actually useful? And revival’s heal is very low. Compare to shammy which has three good raid cool downs. That’s one of those niche abilities that they don’t expect every raid to have so they don’t design encounters around it and it’s effectively useless.

    Re: mystic touch, that’s a crutch to keep one monk in the raid. I’d rather play a class that is designed well enough to make it in on its own, and (gasp) even have more than 1 sometimes because it’s good!

    As is mistweaver has the worst cooldowns of any healer, it’s the most mana hungry healer, throughput is mediocre, and its dps is lower than disc and pally. It’s shockingly, stunningly bad.
    I haven't done Nathria yet, but saying Revival is useless is silly. Literally does twice as much healing as Healing Tide does over its 10 second duration, and it's instant. The dispel is just a bonus, but it's invaluable when it's needed.

    Plus, you're comparing to the one healer with literally the strongest raid utility of them all (Resto Shaman) - why not compare to Holy Paladin (Sacrifice, BoP, auras)?

    If you'd rather play another class, then go ahead. Mistweaver is fine though.

    As for throughput being mediocre, https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/st...y=4&metric=hps are you literally saying you need to be higher than top 3 to be good enough?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    Key part of that statement highlighted.

    Why are we the one healer whose kit seems to be built around requiring innervate to do good throughput?
    Because it's a team effort? Healing teams should support each others weaknesses and strengths.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    I haven't done Nathria yet, but saying Revival is useless is silly. Literally does twice as much healing as Healing Tide does over its 10 second duration, and it's instant. The dispel is just a bonus, but it's invaluable when it's needed.

    Plus, you're comparing to the one healer with literally the strongest raid utility of them all (Resto Shaman) - why not compare to Holy Paladin (Sacrifice, BoP, auras)?

    If you'd rather play another class, then go ahead. Mistweaver is fine though.

    As for throughput being mediocre, https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/st...y=4&metric=hps are you literally saying you need to be higher than top 3 to be good enough?
    It is mediocre. The ranking might show it in 3rd place, but it’s barely above the other classes that bring far more utility. It’s also massively below shaman, and because close to 40% of mythic healers are shammies at this point, it’s obviously not in a good spot throughput wise.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post

    As is mistweaver has the worst cooldowns of any healer,
    Debatable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    it’s the most mana hungry healer,
    For a reason. MW sustain healing/cleave healing is amazing. The balance of that is higher mana costs. Renewing Mist being a smart heal for vivify cleaves is amazing imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post

    throughput is mediocre,
    I keep up pretty well with our resto shaman and druids.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post

    and its dps is lower than disc and pally.
    Healer, not a dps.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post

    It’s shockingly, stunningly bad.
    Matte rof opinion tbh.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    It is mediocre. The ranking might show it in 3rd place, but it’s barely above the other classes that bring far more utility. It’s also massively below shaman, and because close to 40% of mythic healers are shammies at this point, it’s obviously not in a good spot throughput wise.
    Right, so the issue is that Shaman is overpowered, because Mistweaver is actually above the healers with comparable utility and as such is doing just fine.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommi View Post
    Because it's a team effort? Healing teams should support each others weaknesses and strengths.
    I mean, every healer could use more mana. Why give it to the shitty mistweaver when you can give it to the shammy who’s blasting? Sure, if you give it to the mistweaver how is that more beneficial than giving it to the shaman?

    Are you saying that every time you have a mistweaver in the raid, you must also have a Druid there to innervate them? What other class works like that? It’s crazy.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    Right, so the issue is that Shaman is overpowered, because Mistweaver is actually above the healers with comparable utility and as such is doing just fine.

    Comparable utility? Where?

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    Comparable utility? Where?
    Was my post too long to read? Holy Paladin. Resto Druid is another, and let's not even mention Holy Priest. Why should Mistweaver get buffed when there are other healers that are worse off?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    I mean, every healer could use more mana. Why give it to the shitty mistweaver when you can give it to the shammy who’s blasting? Sure, if you give it to the mistweaver how is that more beneficial than giving it to the shaman?

    Are you saying that every time you have a mistweaver in the raid, you must also have a Druid there to innervate them? What other class works like that? It’s crazy.
    Umm, Yu'lon. If you had any idea of how much healing you can push out when you have yu'lon up, with an innervate? As I said, too many mistweavers have no idea how the fuck yu'lon, and chi'ji, works.

    Enveloping Breath
    Requires Monk (Mistweaver)
    Requires level 58
    While active, Yu'lon and Chi'Ji heal up to 6 nearby targets with Enveloping Breath when you cast Enveloping Mist, healing for [(30% of Spell power) * 6 / 1] over 6 sec, and increasing the healing they receive from you by 10%.

    Pop yu'lon, get an innervate, spam enveloping mists, laugh in HPS. The whole reason you ask for an innervate is so you can spam EM's into people. It turns yu'lon into an actual raid cooldown. Best part of it is it's a smart heal. All you need to do is target the tank/melee for HPS lols.

    This is all assuming you're mistweaving and not kickweaving. If you're kickweaving and having mana issues, then I dunno wtf to tell you except stop spamming EF on cd. Learn how kickweaving works and L2P.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    Was my post too long to read? Holy Paladin. Resto Druid is another, and let's not even mention Holy Priest. Why should Mistweaver get buffed when there are other healers that are worse off?
    Resto Druid has ironbark (arguably better than cocoon), and several strong raid CDs. Holy pally has much stronger cds including bop and does better dps. Yes, holy priest is bad too.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    Resto Druid has ironbark (arguably better than cocoon), and several strong raid CDs. Holy pally has much stronger cds including bop and does better dps. Yes, holy priest is bad too.
    Ironbark is comparable to Cocoon for sure, better in some cases (on a tank for a high damage section), worse in others (oh-shit button to save a life). Tranquility is very much comparable to Revival, and that's all they have. Saying "several" doesn't make it so.

    Holy Paladin does have stronger throughput CDs, true. They also have strong DPS. But stronger utility? No. BoP is decent, Sac is comparable to Ironbark and therefore Cocoon. They also have no raidwide CDs, which matters a lot more in raids. BoP + Aura Mastery vs Revival and Mystic Touch. Holy Paladin wins on some fights, Mistweaver wins on others.

    Furthermore, Mistweaver is literally third best healer DPS, so you're again just complaining about not being OP. Mistweaver is maybe the most balanced healer in the game.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Segus1992 View Post
    Ironbark is comparable to Cocoon for sure, better in some cases (on a tank for a high damage section), worse in others (oh-shit button to save a life). Tranquility is very much comparable to Revival, and that's all they have. Saying "several" doesn't make it so.

    Holy Paladin does have stronger throughput CDs, true. They also have strong DPS. But stronger utility? No. BoP is decent, Sac is comparable to Ironbark and therefore Cocoon. They also have no raidwide CDs, which matters a lot more in raids. BoP + Aura Mastery vs Revival and Mystic Touch. Holy Paladin wins on some fights, Mistweaver wins on others.

    Furthermore, Mistweaver is literally third best healer DPS, so you're again just complaining about not being OP. Mistweaver is maybe the most balanced healer in the game.
    If we're gonna use BoP and Sac as cd's, Monk also has Ring of Peace and Tiger's Lust, a CC that can be used on ANY kind of target with Paralysis.....

  19. #19
    Shamans spent the entire last expansion bottom of the barrel. Let em have their moment.

    Anyways, shamans will always be highly represented when people are under geared trying to do content because they’re loaded with utility. When people can outgear things they’ll be less represented.

    In the mean time, poor monks.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommi View Post
    If we're gonna use BoP and Sac as cd's, Monk also has Ring of Peace and Tiger's Lust, a CC that can be used on ANY kind of target with Paralysis.....
    Not really relevant for a healer in raids in the vast majority of cases (Tiger's Lust is fine, but it's not by any means a major addition to Mistweaver's kit). BoP has uses, and Sacrifice is almost as strong as Pain Suppression but with the added damage sharing aspect. Mistweaver is fine, but let's not exaggerate - they're not OP either.

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