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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by Mardux View Post
    And its not as practically cheating as you want it to be. Its not even close. There are exactly zero rules (implied or otherwise) that say one group can't use a strat that another group used. That comes with the territory of streaming something like the RWF. They made the choice to stream their attempts and kills, which means they made the choice to "risk" another group seeing it and saying "hey! That worked! We should do that."

    But based on your judgement of using a strat that someone else came up with and tested, its safe to assume that you dont read any guides or watch any videos before stepping into a raid or 5man, right? Since, as you say, thats practically cheating.
    Then don't talk about fairness when echo was copying limit's strategies... If limit wasn't streaming their progression Echo would still be stuck on 8/10 or worse.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by NabyBro View Post
    Why wouldn't it work?

    All it needs is an agreement between WF raiding guilds that they would respect the wait until the EU reset. That is all.

    From a technical standpoint there is no issue here. Would they be willing to do this? Probably not because they would have done it already.
    But it's a solution until Blizz actually merges the resets.
    The main problem with this, especially since there is a world wide release at the same time, is that this would just reverse the advantage to EU guilds. For example, the game comes out say on a Wednesday and everyone levels and starts grinding gear from the available sources and then the following Tuesday the raid comes out for NA. Now, because of this agreement, they're just sitting around with their thumb up their ass while EU guilds still have an entire day to finish up whatever content is available. This is specifically talking about content you get loot locked on for a week. While there isn't more sources of gear available for EU guilds for that day they do have an extra day to get things done. This may seem like small advantage but when the current practice is to gear up multiple characters then this extra day is pretty big.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Eapoe View Post
    Doesn’t matter. All players get to play at the same time starting Sunday and deal with the same down time on maintenance.
    blizzard isnt gonna change the way they do maintenance its not gonna happen
    Quote Originally Posted by Jedi Batman View Post
    Sounds like a euphemism for real life. We throw money at the rich, in hopes that we will someday be rich, and then we get hookers to piss on us. That's what trickle down economics really is.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    blizzard isnt gonna change the way they do maintenance its not gonna happen
    Yup, and the people doing the race aren't all that worried about it either.

    https://twitter.com/echoguild/status...67326380060673

    Fairly obvious the people that seem to worry about it the most aren't actually participants. Just people looking for a reason to be bitter and spiteful on the internet to other people.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by youswas View Post
    It's just not that simple unfortunately. You would need a LOT of rules to make something like this work. What if one region has more maintenance than another? What happens when a boss is bugged and the leading guild can't actually progress during that time period? How do you factor in the time gained from being able to watch another guild's strategies for every early boss? You would need someone to specify and the guilds to agree on all these rules before starting and still there would be controversy.

    It's just much simpler, and probably more fair to just say whoever gets it first, wins.

    Echo killed the boss just over 16 hours after Limit. Combine this with the amount of time Limit lost due to maintenance and bugs and the advantage of EU being able to watch their strats for the first few bosses and you can absolutely make the argument that Limit won this race straight up.
    It's true that there are more factors to consider here, to make it "truly fair". But it would still be a better basis to count from the raid opening. It wouldn't completely solve the problem due to other aspects also influencing the result, I agree, but it would still be better than doing nothing about it.

    The issue with guilds streaming their progress is a risk they can theoretically avoid, but they don't because it gets them a lot of viewers, subs, reach and so on. They know fully well that they have a disadvantage in the race when they stream their progress and strategies, and technically they don't have to, but they do because it's more important to them that they get more financial support from their streaming.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by JavelinJoe View Post
    How people can consider it world first is beyond me. People need to use their brains lol. Worlds fastest is the only way to measure skill in the current situation. You cant consider anything a race unless you either start everyone at the same time, or you go by fastest time. End of story.

    Thats not to say Limit arent the best, if they complete it fastest regardless then obviously they are the best, but if Echo complete it in a faster overall time then they are world first in the eyes of anyone intelligent.
    The NA guilds waste a lot of time beta testing broken boss mechanics that EU then doesn't have to deal with (stalling at bosses with broken or overtuned mechanics), so under that metric, the guilds that start first are actually at a disadvantage. There's no perfect metric. As all the top guilds say: world first is world first.

  7. #207
    I'm from the EU and the amount of hurt the EU region has over this is pretty hilarious.

    Limit had to face sludgefist being bugged, it was so bugged they went for split clears instead.

    If that boss hadn't been bugged, they probably would have an advantage greater than 24 hours on Echo.

    Echo played poorly (for their own standards and they very well know that), there's no excuse for that.

    Time to face reality or you're gonna be even more triggered when they lose again next race because global lockouts are not happening.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by NabyBro View Post
    The easier solution than begging endlessly.
    Easier? How do you figure itd be easier to get hundreds of people to agree on something, when theres no beneficial reason for some of them to?
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaHandsB View Post
    The NA guilds waste a lot of time beta testing broken boss mechanics that EU then doesn't have to deal with (stalling at bosses with broken or overtuned mechanics), so under that metric, the guilds that start first are actually at a disadvantage. There's no perfect metric. As all the top guilds say: world first is world first.
    How you can follow that logic is just plain ridiculous. You cant say that bugs are equal to 1 day, they could be equal to 7 days, they could be 2 hours. You cant start a fucking race without teams starting at the same time, no amount of issues any given side has to deal with can be considered equal. You cant say, Oh let's do a 100m race but you start 2 seconds early and ill just run 80m that is equal. World first is not world first and anyone who thinks that is.............

    And for the record I literally don't give a fuck who wins, Im not biased to either side, I watch it just to enjoy I couldn't care if US or EU wins, but it tilts the fuck outa me to see people follow 0iq logic like this sorry.

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