Capitol Insurrection / rebellion thread

[Kaleredar]

I am more interested if they do indict him, if he suddenly pulls out a sealed pardon, lmao.

If they do manage a conviction, and Trump is like "nah fam I totally pardoned myself back when I was president!" and the supreme court upholds Trump being able to pardon himself (I don't think they would; the GOP has been looking for a way to cut themselves free of Trump and this would be a very clean one) I imagine that the conviction would be a pretty damning first swing at convicting him of criminal election tampering in various states, which... yeah, he can't pardon.

[Adam Jensen]

I am more interested if they do indict him, if he suddenly pulls out a sealed pardon, lmao.

I'm fairly certain the president can't pardon himself. You can't be your own judge and jury.

But we have a SCOTUS justice married to a QAnon so . . . Endus, how easy is it for an American to emigrate to Canada? Asking for a friend.

[Kaleredar]

I'm fairly certain the president can't pardon himself. You can't be your own judge and jury.

But we have a SCOTUS justice married to a QAnon so . . . Endus, how easy is it for an American to emigrate to Canada? Asking for a friend.

They haven't been favorable to Trump in... well, any of their previous rulings. I don't think they'd do so on this, either, were the question of if the president can pardon himself to come up.

I think the supreme court, like the GOP establishment, would love nothing more than to cut trump loose so that they can keep pursuing their dogmatic crusade under a less "controversial" banner. One whom they could control more. They got what they wanted out of him... to pack the court with right-wing zealots and to rubber stamp tax cuts for their wealthy friends.

And, as I noted, even were all that to happen, the court ruling that Trump maliciously interfered in the 2020 election could easily then transfer to criminal cases for specific states, which Trump could not "have pardoned" himself out of.

[Poopymonster]

They haven't been favorable to Trump in... well, any of their previous rulings. I don't think they'd do so on this, either, were the question of if the president can pardon himself to come up.

I think the supreme court, like the GOP establishment, would love nothing more than to cut trump loose so that they can keep pursuing their dogmatic crusade under a less "controversial" banner. One whom they could control more. They got what they wanted out of him... to pack the court with right-wing zealots and to rubber stamp tax cuts for their wealthy friends.

And, as I noted, even were all that to happen, the court ruling that Trump maliciously interfered in the 2020 election could easily then transfer to criminal cases for specific states, which Trump could not "have pardoned" himself out of.

Part of me believes you.
Another part thinks when it comes to Really Important Things (Guns, Roe V Wade, Self Pardons of Trump) they'll do what they were put there to do. They can 5/4 with a revolving cast of who "sided" with the liberals to keep up appearances on lesser issues while still pushing a regressive agenda until something major comes up. Then it's dryfisting Lady Liberty.

[PhaelixWW]

Part of me believes you.
Another part thinks when it comes to Really Important Things (Guns, Roe V Wade, Self Pardons of Trump) they'll do what they were put there to do. They can 5/4 with a revolving cast of who "sided" with the liberals to keep up appearances on lesser issues while still pushing a regressive agenda until something major comes up. Then it's dryfisting Lady Liberty.

Why would SCOTUS care about Trump?

They really have no incentive to diminish the scope of checks and balances that the judicial branch has over the executive branch.

[gondrin]

Part of me believes you.
Another part thinks when it comes to Really Important Things (Guns, Roe V Wade, Self Pardons of Trump) they'll do what they were put there to do. They can 5/4 with a revolving cast of who "sided" with the liberals to keep up appearances on lesser issues while still pushing a regressive agenda until something major comes up. Then it's dryfisting Lady Liberty.

Problem is, if they allow Trump to pardon himself, then Biden could do the same exact thing. Literally rig the upcoming election in his favor, get found guilty and preemptively pardon himself so he cannot be prosecuted.

Hell, he could start doing something like assassinating political enemies, preemptively pardoning himself and outside of impeachment, never see a day in prison. Let that sink in.

[Poopymonster]

Problem is, if they allow Trump to pardon himself, then Biden could do the same exact thing. Literally rig the upcoming election in his favor, get found guilty and preemptively pardon himself so he cannot be prosecuted.

The GQP has been playing the game that way. Biden and the Dems won't because they are hampered by things like the appearance of "Duty".
Could be stalled until President DeSantis (Or other nominee) possibly in 2024 starts shooting out pardons like they're bullets at an elementary school.

[Paranoid Android]

As far as my last post about indictments and my incoming Hot Take could also go in the Trump thread.

It's interesting if prosecuted or even now some Republicans are trying to distance even saying Trump is culpable for Jan 6th. My take is watch out! I think most Republicans are very interested and like how Trump acted. They just believe he was a totally, bumbling idiot, who was lazy. In short they want Trump gone and find someone who is competent in getting this fascism going.

[Fugus]

If they do manage a conviction, and Trump is like "nah fam I totally pardoned myself back when I was president!" and the supreme court upholds Trump being able to pardon himself (I don't think they would; the GOP has been looking for a way to cut themselves free of Trump and this would be a very clean one) I imagine that the conviction would be a pretty damning first swing at convicting him of criminal election tampering in various states, which... yeah, he can't pardon.

I truly hope that would be the case and then watch Trump respond with all the dirt he got on the GOP (Partially from Russia) and then nuke them on his way down. Especially if he talks about how he got his nominations. Then watch us stare at Garland waiting on him to look or act.

[Poopymonster]

I truly hope that would be the case and then watch Trump respond with all the dirt he got on the GOP (Partially from Russia) and then nuke them on his way down. Especially if he talks about how he got his nominations. Then watch us stare at Garland waiting on him to look or act.

Krieger said it best.

[Paranoid Android]

2 takes.

Fox News, Chris Stirewalt, the Fox political editor called Arizona and had to be unanimous in Fox news room. He was fired but more importantly Fox carried this lie until, when? Think they still carrying but was months after January 6th and until lawsuits I believe.

Second is Bill Barr covering his ass like a mofo. I agree he knew the election like was bs but remember all he did before. Also Trump was calling him for legal advice and Barr quickly in his deposition say the DOJ was separate and could not give legal counsel. Hmmmmmmm? Sure didn't stop him before when he no doubt before.

Before the election, Barr and others backed Trump's claim that he would lose only bc of voter fraud. Barr told the media and Congress that an election with a lot of mail in votes would not be secure, calling it a conclusion backed by "common sense"
https://t.co/wbngZ4u2Vh

https://twitter.com/ktbenner/status/...DS34kJ8Mg&s=19

Also noted if he knew and believed Trump was crazy, Barr never went public.

[alach]

Years of the Trump thread has led to this. So many times he would do something horrible, and it was posted brilliantly here - only to see no real action take place.
Well, other people have been paying attention now it seems it is time for team Trump to pay the piper. I cannot see how he escapes justice from this, and they haven't even started on how he has been swindling the public yet.

Netflix has a new docu out on the FLDS church and how those people felt so sure of things when they were part of the cult, only to look back today and realize just how horrible it actually was.
I expect the same will soon be happening with vast numbers of conversatives sometime soon - at least I sure hope so.

Trumps head must be absolutely exploding right about now.

[Edge-]

https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3pm...giuliani-drunk

“The mayor was definitely intoxicated, but I do not know his level of intoxication when he spoke with the president,” Jason Miller, a senior adviser on Trump’s reelection campaign, said during his videotaped deposition played by the committee.

Trump advisor Jason Miller on drunk Rudy Giuliani telling Trump to just declare victory in the 2020 election that he lost.

How many drunk, old, senile men with bad teeth were running this country?

[Kaleredar]

https://www.vice.com/en/article/y3pm...giuliani-drunk

Trump advisor Jason Miller on drunk Rudy Giuliani telling Trump to just declare victory in the 2020 election that he lost.

How many drunk, old, senile men with bad teeth were running this country?

I don’t imagine “my lawyer was drunk when he told me to break the law” is a very valid defense

[Edge-]

Reading a thread on the hearing today, holy shit did Trump just buy into literally every possible conspiracy he could in a desperate attempt to get the whole fraud thing to be true lol One conspiracy debunked? Let's move to the next one!

One of my faves...

Epic grift is epic.

Didn't we already know that none of the money was being spent on the "defense" to begin with? I feel like finding out the "fund" was just a marketing tactic is new at least.

Not that it will matter for the idiots that gave him their money.

[Ripster42]

Didn't we already know that none of the money was being spent on the "defense" to begin with? I feel like finding out the "fund" was just a marketing tactic is new at least.

Not that it will matter for the idiots that gave him their money.

I'm going to laugh if what gets him is wire fraud. The testimony from all the people who told trump directly that there was no evidence of fraud essentially proves that trump knew the election wasn't stolen, which means he was soliciting all that money under false pretenses.

[Edge-]

I'm going to laugh if what gets him is wire fraud. The testimony from all the people who told trump directly that there was no evidence of fraud essentially proves that trump knew the election wasn't stolen, which means he was soliciting all that money under false pretenses.

Seems straightforward, but I doubt it is. There's enough "reasonable doubt" for this to be something gross, but not illegal.

Not that I care about people getting their money back. They threw it into the fire, their fault if it burns up.

[Ripster42]

There's enough "reasonable doubt" for this to be something gross, but not illegal.

There was until we saw evidence of person after person telling him it's nonsense, and his own AG testifying that he wasn't interested in the factual basis for his claims. There's not really much wiggle room there. If he doesn't face charges for this, the sole reason will be because he was president.

[Edge-]

There was until we saw evidence of person after person telling him it's nonsense, and his own AG testifying that he wasn't interested in the factual basis for his claims. There's not really much wiggle room there. If he doesn't face charges for this, the sole reason will be because he was president.

Doesn't matter how many people told him it was bullshit. If he "honestly" believe it, he's got legal grounds to stand on that "he believed it despite everyone else telling him he's wrong."

I'm no legal expert, but from what little I know it seems like he's got a fairly solid defense against fraud. Because he usually does.

[solinari6]

Seems straightforward, but I doubt it is. There's enough "reasonable doubt" for this to be something gross, but not illegal.

I don't think that "whether he believed it was stolen or not" matters in this case... the "Election Defense Fund" that they said all this money was going into didn't exist. It just went into their SuperPAC and was spent on all sorts of random things. That's straight up fraud (probably!)