Capitol Insurrection / rebellion thread

[Shadowferal]

Fox anchor: Jan. 6 witnesses outlining ‘huge, stunning, clear’ lack of voter fraud evidence

Fox News anchor Martha MacCallum on Tuesday said that witnesses testifying before the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol are laying out a “huge, stunning and clear moment” showing a lack of evidence to support former President Trump’s claims of an unfair election in 2020.

MacCallum said Democrats on the committee are likely to use division among Republicans about whether to believe Trump’s claims about the election as a political tool in the coming midterm and presidential contests.

“It will be extremely useful in coming campaigns, especially the presidential, when you look back at what we have in terms of the Mike Pence part of all of this,” MacCallum said. “So it is a political discussion. It is very compelling and the lack of evidence is the huge stunning clear moment here where these people are saying look I supported you, please give me something to work with, and it simply doesn’t materialize.”

[postman1782]

I wonder if these people committed "insurrection" too...

I have an answer for you, no it isn't. Jesus fucking christ, are you fucking ignorant on purpose? Did they try to overthrow democracy when they lost?

[PhaelixWW]

insurrection
noun
an act or instance of rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance against civil authority or an established government.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/insurrection

There's enough here to make the argument successfully that Martin Sheen and his ilk could have been accused of insurrection.

How are they resisting civil authority? A majority of states (including most red states) don't have faithless Elector laws. The duly appointed Electors have it within their power to vote differently than what the state popular vote indicates.

What the people in the video are not doing is trying to find a way to ignore the duly appointed Electors and foist off a panel of fake Electors as legitimate in an attempt to circumvent the established election process.

You have no argument here.

[postman1782]

@Breccia You know it's pretty bad when you have one of the so called "legal experts" from the National Review saying that Trump is unfit to serve as president, and that he "may have committed a crime". Same with one of the so called "legal experts" from Trump's impeachments, Johnathan Turley.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-news...ty-of-a-crime/

[Kaleredar]

I'm really sorry to burst your bubble but I've said this ages ago.

This DoJ will absolutely not bring charges on any elected Republican. Neither for the January Coup nor for anything else for that matter.

There is no long game here.

Matt Gaetz is not going to prison not matter how many children he has sex with. Trump is untouchable and could murder and rape the corpse of someone on national TV and wouldn't be prosecuted.

Idiots like Bannon and Guiliani don't count. But even those are likely to walk.

The Democratic establishment in DC is absolutely useless. Nothing will come of these hearings. It's a waste of time.

Come November the GOP will take Congress and proceed to impeach Biden once every 2 weeks for everything from breathing to falling off his bycicle. There will be no future judicial appointments and they will use their legislative powers to neuter and defund the DoJ, the FBI, DHS and possibly even the DoD.

Like honestly. Do you guys live on the same planet I'm living on? I've said all this literally years ago, while everyone was fantasizing about how Garland is going to go get Gaetz, MTG etc.

Lol guys.

And you vehemently predicted that in 2020 Biden as a morally degenerate candidate would inevitably lose to Trump. That maybe Biden would win the popular vote and that Trump would still win the electoral college, or that SCOTUS would hand Trump a victory. Neither of those two things happened, and the election wasn't even particularly close.


Also, this is all an odd sentiment coming from you, considering you said, in the 2020 election thread:

Assuming Biden wins, attempting to prosecute Trump for whatever crimes committed prior Biden's inauguration will be perceived by his base a witch hunt. Considering his base's sheer fanaticism and numbers, combined with his cult of personality attempting to prosecute Trump will likely mobilize Republicans politically for the midterms and 2024, and possibly cause violent retaliation by the violent fringes.

Going after Trump would be a massive tactical and even greater strategic error. The best thing this administration can do for the next 4 years is to COMPLETELY IGNORE Trump. Assuming they can take the Senate in the Midterms and retain the House, they need to pick their fucking battles and focus on fixing the judiciary and winning in 2024, after that we can discuss going after Trump (if he's still alive) and his entire family.

Trying to do anything before that would be phenomenally counter productive.

Prosecuting the Trump's for anything they might do, if they do something shady (which they likely will) after January, that's a different conversation, but even then, the DoJ should steer clear as much as possible from any direct involvement, using state prosecutors.

I understand the pessimism, but it's damn, damn tiresome. We don't know what the DOJ is going to do, as they haven't said a single thing. Maybe they actually think like you do, and that attempting to prosecute Trump so close to the 2022 elections will only "rile up his base..." and you're jumping down their throats for not acting immediately against the very thing you said they shouldn't do.

Nor is the DOJ the only body capable of prosecuting Trump for his roll in attempting to bungle the 2020 election, and indeed it isn't the only one pursuing such an avenue (like the aforementioned state prosecutors)

And whether they secure a conviction or not, because Trump either directly so adamantly argues his own ignorance and meat-headed belief that he genuinely won the election such that "no criminal intent was possible," or that such a notion is thought to be the likely conclusion by a jury, the optics are still there... an increasingly manic old man having to expend his depleted time and money rallying against criminal charges, instead of against his opponents or in support of various sycophantic politicians (another prospect that's going poorly for him,) in an increasingly unhinged series of rants that we've seen developing since it became clear he lost. Sure Trump's followers wont care, but this has never been about changing their minds.


But if all you've to offer is "we're fucked, everyone be sad" then... well, keep it to yourself? Because that defeatism doesn't do anything for anyone.

[Mihalik]

sip.

1. Biden's victory was uncomfortably close in the context of the electoral college. Literally it was down to a tens of thousands of votes in 3 states.

I honestly expected he would lose. Him not losing was a pleasant surprise.

2. What I wrote about prosecuting Trump, and you snippy quoted out of context, I wrote before January 6. That honestly changed everything. It went from "Use state prosecutors to pursue corruption cases" to "Holy shit this mother fucker literally tried to organize a coup and make himself a dictator".

After January 6 the Biden administration should have used the Federal government to prosecute everyone involved in that insurection. Including elected officials.

Instead we got this. An impotent DoJ and zero political will to tackle the problem of the GOP going full insurectionist party.

What I have to offer is simply the fact that if people are expecting the Democratic Party and the Biden administration to save them from the coming fascist America, then they are betting on the wrong fucking horse.

People should be protesting in mass, demanding the Biden administration and the DoJ to prosecute. And if the GQP goes for their guns...well ...that's what we have the FBI and the Army for.

[Kaleredar]

1. Biden's victory was uncomfortably close in the context of the electoral college. Literally it was down to a tens of thousands of votes in 3 states.

I honestly expected he would lose. Him not losing was a pleasant surprise.

What I wrote about prosecuting Trump, and you snippy quoted out of context, I wrote before January 6. That honestly changed everything. It went from "Use state prosecutors to pursue corruption cases" to "Holy shit this mother fucker literally tried to organize a coup and make himself a dictator".

After January 6 the Biden administration should have used the Federal government to prosecute everyone involved in that insurection. Including elected officials.

Instead we got this. An impotent DoJ and zero political will to tackle the problem of the GOP going full insurectionist party.

I'll reserve my judgement for when the DOJ actually weighs on what they think they should do. The committee certainly thinks that there is ground to move forward, and various state prosecuting bodies are doing so in their own ways as well as Trump's interference pertains to their elections.

Though of course, if you're looking for something to "rile up Trump's base," I can imagine few things more effective than Trump standing trial... and being found innocent because the DOJ sprung too early and too eagerly. It's obvious that the grounds for a case arguing that Trump interfered in the election and spurred on the insurrection are there, and it's obvious that... yeah, he did it, to anyone paying attention. But the jury might not be filled exclusively with people who have been "paying attention" (Trump's lawyers would certainly work to make that the case.) If ever there was a case where dotting one's i's and crossing one's t's on uncovered smoking gun pieces of testimony were necessary, it'd be attempting to indict a former president.

[Breccia]

@Breccia You know it's pretty bad when you have one of the so called "legal experts" from the National Review saying that Trump is unfit to serve as president, and that he "may have committed a crime". Same with one of the so called "legal experts" from Trump's impeachments, Johnathan Turley.

Let's add FOX News to the list.

Fox News anchor Martha MacCallum on Tuesday said that witnesses testifying before the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol are laying out a “huge, stunning and clear moment” showing a lack of evidence to support former President Trump’s claims of an unfair election in 2020.

MacCallum said Democrats on the committee are likely to use division among Republicans about whether to believe Trump’s claims about the election as a political tool in the coming midterm and presidential contests.

“It will be extremely useful in coming campaigns, especially the presidential, when you look back at what we have in terms of the Mike Pence part of all of this,” MacCallum said. “So it is a political discussion. It is very compelling and the lack of evidence is the huge stunning clear moment here where these people are saying look I supported you, please give me something to work with, and it simply doesn’t materialize.”

Of course, FOX News is merely conceding the inevitable. The evidence today was especially damning. So damning, in fact, that random Trump cultists are now suggesting Martin Sheen committed insurrection. Because they don't have any reasonable defense anymore, they're resorting to word salad.

[postman1782]

Let's add FOX News to the list.



Of course, FOX News is merely conceding the inevitable. The evidence today was especially damning. So damning, in fact, that random Trump cultists are now suggesting Martin Sheen committed insurrection. Because they don't have any reasonable defense anymore, they're resorting to word salad.

Yep, Hammer is delusional.

[Kaleredar]

Let's add FOX News to the list.



Of course, FOX News is merely conceding the inevitable. The evidence today was especially damning.

Perhaps they see the writing on the wall of "if we keep saying the insurrection was a hoax/implying that Trump really won we might start to find ourselves in actual legal trouble" and are attempting to duck their responsibility in all this.

I look forward to Trump personally condemning all of them as liberal shills, to the detriment of their viewership numbers.

So damning, in fact, that random Trump cultists are now suggesting Martin Sheen committed insurrection. Because they don't have any reasonable defense anymore, they're resorting to word salad.

I hear Martin Sheen killed a colonel in Cambodia.

[Edge-]

https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...rts-2022-6?amp

More on the documentary footage that none of the Trump aides know was being filmed on Jan. 6 -

According to the Times it had been organised by Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, and was conceived of as a "legacy project" for Trump.

Man, it's like Jared's trying to get kicked outta the family with his hilarious incompetence. Which is fortunate for us.

[Drutt]

As far as the DOJ going softly on prosecutions goes, I assumed it was tactical to give the Republicans no optics to twist to their advantage. Wait for the material from the hearing to be out in public, request transcripts, action based on what the committee finds.

Like it or not, the pursuing any elected (or former) official on the opposite side of the aisle is going to get messy, and I can see the logic in giving them the shortest length of rope possible to try and string you up with.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...rts-2022-6?amp

More on the documentary footage that none of the Trump aides know was being filmed on Jan. 6 -



Man, it's like Jared's trying to get kicked outta the family with his hilarious incompetence. Which is fortunate for us.

LMAO, that's beyond hilarious.

[Paranoid Android]

Key Jan. 6 witness says he’d vote for Trump again

Rusty Bowers, the Arizona House Representative, who had devastating testimony on Jan. 6th Committee how he was pressured to replace electors of course came out with a resounding endorsement for Trump 2024.

“If he is the nominee, if he was up against Biden, I’d vote for him again,” Bowers said. “Simply because what he did the first time, before COVID, was so good for the county. In my view it was great.”

Always remember who these people are and remember Pence will say this too. Once more as we say they would rather have fascism than our Constitutional democracy choosing a Democrat. Going further they don't want any party elected but them. So the One-Party authoritarian is on people!

[Lenonis]

Yep, Hammer is delusional.

Hammer is a lot of things.

Including a representative of no small amount of people out there. Conservatives are doing everything possible to come to terms with Jan 6th and it's implications including, but not limited to:
- Claiming it was really a left wing group that stormed the capital.
- Deciding Trump had nothing to do with it.
- Deciding that 2020 was fraudulent so Jan 6th was actually justified and the morally right thing to do.
- Deciding that democracy isn't worth it if it lets lefties in power, so anything to stay in power is acceptable.

These people are lost. Beyond lost. The only solution is to do everything to keep them out of power until they all die off. Honestly.

[Edge-]

Key Jan. 6 witness says he’d vote for Trump again

Rusty Bowers, the Arizona House Representative, who had devastating testimony on Jan. 6th Committee how he was pressured to replace electors of course came out with a resounding endorsement for Trump 2024.



Always remember who these people are and remember Pence will say this too. Once more as we say they would rather have fascism than our Constitutional democracy choosing a Democrat. Going further they don't want any party elected but them. So the One-Party authoritarian is on people!

Just a reminder that even the "good" Republicans aren't actually good Republicans.

"Sure Trump tried to subvert our democratic process, but did you see how great Obama's economy was in his first few years!?"

[Paranoid Android]

Hahahaha! Democracy is going to die.

Pence says Democrats using Jan 6. to ‘distract attention’

In an interview with Fox News on Monday, Pence called Jan. 6 a “tragic day,” but also said that he and former President Trump “parted very amicably” on the last day of their administration despite what the committee laid out was a weeks-long campaign by Trump to pressure his vice president to overturn the 2020 election results.

Amicably?!? I so want to say what maybe should have happened with Pence on Jan. 6th to change his mind, but that might be TOS. It's crazy tho, that if someone would have maybe edgelord it up and say this on a news cast that Republicans would be so offended.

[jonnysensible]

imagine trump is cheering his crowd to hang you and you still bootlick. pence needs an autopsy doing when he goes, surely has no spine.

[zEmini]

I'm really sorry to burst your bubble but I've said this ages ago.

This DoJ will absolutely not bring charges on any elected Republican. Neither for the January Coup nor for anything else for that matter.

There is no long game here.

Matt Gaetz is not going to prison not matter how many children he has sex with. Trump is untouchable and could murder and rape the corpse of someone on national TV and wouldn't be prosecuted.

Idiots like Bannon and Guiliani don't count. But even those are likely to walk.

The Democratic establishment in DC is absolutely useless. Nothing will come of these hearings. It's a waste of time.

Come November the GOP will take Congress and proceed to impeach Biden once every 2 weeks for everything from breathing to falling off his bycicle. There will be no future judicial appointments and they will use their legislative powers to neuter and defund the DoJ, the FBI, DHS and possibly even the DoD.

Like honestly. Do you guys live on the same planet I'm living on? I've said all this literally years ago, while everyone was fantasizing about how Garland is going to go get Gaetz, MTG etc.

Lol guys.

.
Sadly this might become true. However I expect mob justice in the forms of massive riots, destruction of federal property, burning down trump owned property, and civil disobedience. And if these fucks get reelected, then far worse.

[Lenonis]

imagine trump is cheering his crowd to hang you and you still bootlick. pence needs an autopsy doing when he goes, surely has no spine.

He knows he has no political future without at least some of the Trump brigade so he's trying to court them as much as he can to try to capture the 2024 spot if Trump doesn't run.

Which -- he's screwed because the Trump brigade is going to pick DeSantis. Pence's political future is over.

[Mihalik]

He knows he has no political future without at least some of the Trump brigade so he's trying to court them as much as he can to try to capture the 2024 spot if Trump doesn't run.

Which -- he's screwed because the Trump brigade is going to pick DeSantis. Pence's political future is over.

I for the life of me don't understand what Pence is doing to be honest.

He has lifetime Secret Service protection...unless the MAGA crowd gets in power again. They might not forgive him for his little "treason" no matter what.

Here's the problem with the alleged "sensible" GOP crowd. Every time they have a window to reign in the MAGA monster they created even just a little bit, they either fail to do so, or if they do, they quickly apologize and undo the little good they might have done.

Which raises the question in my mind, just how much do they want to reign the MAGA monster in?

I think it's more a case that deep down they agree with the MAGA monster, they are just surprised what the MAGA crowd can get away with. They do the "right thing" out of fear, but once they realize there's nothing to fear because there will be no consequences they go right along with it.