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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Let’s ignore the 1-2 pro tournament player maybe ? Who have a perfect team at all times at hand who can help to fight on even foot ? Because again mes being number 1 doesn’t solve that dk still is under represented and that no one wants to play with them.

    Also the first place is dk..... and the only one in the top 100 Us and the only top 100 dk in Eu is 36

    Let’s look at statistics instead

    Dk Frost above 1800 rating = 173
    Dk Unholy above 1800 rating = 146
    Arms warrior over 1800 rating = 1295
    Windwalker over 1800 = 997
    Sub rogue = 973
    RET Paladin = 761
    Protection paladin = 179

    TANK PALADIN IS MORE PLAYED THEN FROST DK

    In no world are this numbers balanced
    LMFAO, what a dumb post by an equally intriguing OP name

    None gets carried to number 1 spot by their healers; he's number 1 because it can be done with his class - DK has obvious number 1 potential so stop whining and just go watch their vids on tips

    Tired of people complaining and waiting for Blizzard to buff their classes further to help overcome personal limitations because they're too lazy to read around and learn

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    I'm actually surprised there are so many Warriros above 1.8k rating and not so many Prot paladins - Prot paladins are currently OP.
    And why is prot "OP" its not even viable anymore lol. Ret does more healing due to HP generation and prot takes 40% more damage than ret in a stun. Like many of these comments it comes back to learn the game.
    Warrior: even if you ignore it's defensive capabilities it's possible to outdamage all free casting healers except for rsham on a warrior due to dmg+mortal strike. Add the insane defensives and it's clear why it's got so many on the leaderboards.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Destro is even worse then dk currently.

    Balance is playing tanky rot comps / or just goes for anything tanky as they can’t be focused by meele in most scenarios

    Fire mage plays with rogue which get set ups through rogues.

    However any comp with shadow / affliction / boomy is far more dominating through their strong split pressure over time with Druid heals being rather low on the tier list who can usually compat such comps. No healer can handle multiple 2-5k dot ticks on 3 targets

    - - - Updated - - -



    Wow pvp is about arena. Can’t change that

    - - - Updated - - -



    I am not complaining about not getting rating. I will push no matter what. I probably won’t go for gladiator or anything if my class isn’t top tier, but that’s not the issue.

    The issue is that because of the current lack of balance dk , a whole class can’t find random groups to even take them. Even if Iam at 1,8 people who are 1,6 don’t want you.

    A healer I pushed 2.3 with in the past straight up told me to reroll or don’t bother him until dk is playable. It’s annoying and even more since blizzard doesn’t seem to care
    It is about arena, I agree. And that is the primary reason why it's less popular than in it's hey day in MOP. Arena has been around for nearly 15 years and it's still not popular with the fan base. That says everything. The minute Blizzard does something smart like abandon arena for a 5vs5 or 6vs6 objective and competitive based game play mode Wow Pvp will start gaining the audience and accolades it deserves.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Ast1982 View Post
    LMFAO, what a dumb post by an equally intriguing OP name

    None gets carried to number 1 spot by their healers; he's number 1 because it can be done with his class - DK has obvious number 1 potential so stop whining and just go watch their vids on tips

    Tired of people complaining and waiting for Blizzard to buff their classes further to help overcome personal limitations because they're too lazy to read around and learn
    You can really see which people on here play warrior / rogue. And are just used to be good every season / people who don’t even play arena and think random bg count as pvp

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Literally 1 person. Who is lifted up by the world best healers and years of world champion level games as deathknight.

    All the other R1 deathknights also need to l2p?

    People pick every other meele between 7-11 times as often , just by chance ? Yeah for sure.

    That’s the whole elemental shammy thing all over again where number 1 of the ladder was elemental and the next 999 ranks there was none. But in your opinion that would make the class good and strong?

    Look at the statistics and tell me why else deathknight is the least played meele currently ? Even feral is played double as often who has no real comp out side of jungle and hunter aren’t doing to good either.

    Low key I assume you play sub rogue or warrior
    I mean, there’s lots of tournament level players in the top 100, your argument makes no sense. I agree that balance patches are needed, but your argument for DKs screams a lack of experience.

    The top classes that you’ve listed are just super strong in the meta right now, but DKs aren’t bad.

    And before you smack me for being a certain class or of a certain xp - https://check-pvp.fr/eu/Draenor/Dechcjc is my char, I was a week 2 glad with a high of rank 92 and am on a month break while my partner is away on work before I start R1 pushing.
    Last edited by Zypherz; 2021-01-02 at 11:04 AM.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Zypherz View Post
    I mean, there’s lots of tournament level players in the top 100, your argument makes no sense. I agree that balance patches are needed, but your argument for DKs screams a lack of experience.

    The top classes that you’ve listed are just super strong in the meta right now, but DKs aren’t bad.

    And before you smack me for being a certain class or of a certain xp - https://check-pvp.fr/eu/Draenor/Dechcjc is my char, I was a week 2 glad with a high of rank 92 and am on a month break while my partner is away on work before I start R1 pushing.
    I was 2,6 as highest rating on my dk but it was season 1 of Legion so take that with a grain of salt as we both know Dk was just no skill broken at the time.

    But again it’s not even the point of Dk being able to get potential rank one or gladiator or anything.

    The legendary they have is really strong, Ams is strong and they have a decent burst. The maldraxxus covenant is if used right low key insane.

    However, you still can’t find people to play with you because other classes do everything better. Why take a Dk over a warrior at any situation ?

    That’s why saying Dk is place 1 and fine isn’t right. If playing with a dk doesn’t lock you out of rating but it will make it a lot harder then with ANY other meele.

    As healer give me a reason why someone would take a dk ?

  7. #27
    DKs are not weak - there are just too many classes at the moment that are over-tuned. Once they're brought into line, DKs will definitely see more representation. I've come up against plenty of DKs in both specs and they almost always top the charts in DPS despite this season being a burst meta.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Unholy dk are hilearious easy to kill. Ice born is a 20% dmg reduce on 3 min cooldown. Ever 1:30 minutes they can make their pet explode ( which is their whole damage) for 20% health and spam 2k healing deathstrikes. Which will make their damage drop even more.

    You can now argue they are tanky vs caster with anti magic shell. Specially if they take the legendary for it. However that only works vs high burst caster which need cds to go for kills, the current meta doesn’t have such, which makes ams a lot weaker.
    You can't argue about something you don't even know about. IBF is 30% not 20% (and generally less than 3 mins CD because people tend to pick the conduit), Sacrificial Pact is 2 mins CD 25% health not 20% 1min30. Sacrificing your pet is completely irelevent damage wise as you can summon it again instantly after and finally AMS is exactly weak against burst damage, not the other way around. It only protects you for 30% of your max health (39% talented), so a Fire Mage or a Boomy will destroy it in 1 or 2 GCDs max, but because it prevents magic debuff application, it is very strong against Affliction and SP if you can use it before they use their dots on you.

    DK are nearly always bottom tier, but they are also less represented because they don't have access to many comps. They are a class that focuses on tunneling and pressuring people, but lack a Grievious Wound effect, which means they can only play with Arms or WW most seasons. While these two classes, because they provide the Grievious Wound effect + they can peel more effectively, can be played with a shit ton of other classes, which increase their representation rate. An Arms Warrior for example, synergise well with Ret, DK, Shaman, Hunter, DH, Boomie, Lock, SP, Mage, basically every other DPS in the game with the exception of Rogue.

    It is time for Blizzzard to give a 15% Grievious Wound to DK to increase their comp diversity.

  9. #29
    Warriors and Windwalkers are currently pushing Hunters and DKs out of what normally are their comps. You barely see Hunter/Ret and WW/DK because Warrior Ret and WW/Warrior are just better. Warriors and Windwalkers also counter almost all Lock comps. That's why representation numbers are the way they are atm. Blizz needs to tone down Warriors, Rets, WW's for sure and probably Firemages and Moonkin burst bit as well. Then they need to buff MW's and Frost Mages.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumble View Post
    Ignore the fact that they are literally number 1? That's asinine, just because you can't and not a lot are, doesn't mean it can't be done, clearly. I thought enhancement had a lot of issues in pvp, because in beta they did, but now on live, they are doing quite well in certain comps. My issue is clearly a l2p issue, as with most people. If they spent time balancing the game around my ability to play classes, this game would be an absolute shit show.
    Looking at the top 100 players in the game at 2700+ rating and saying HEY X SPEC IS THERE doesn't compute to balance. I mean Frost is playable but it isn't anywhere near to what other classes are, by a HUGE marging. Keep in mind those players are playing with fellow pro players playing top tier classes carrying them. Mes would be top 10 even if DK was dogshit. Tired of people saying this to undermine the point that clear unbalance is there. It evades the issue.

    The problem I see right now is huge rating discrepancies solely on what fucking spec you play in the 1600-2100 range. If an above average player playing with above average teammates can't break rating barriers because every other game he gets slapped by enemies just pressing the same buttons in the same order every game for 4x his damage and none of his abilities or his teammates can help counter it there's a massive problem.

    It's like rating brackets have become brackets of classes you face not brackets of increasing skill level of players.
    Last edited by stigz; 2021-01-03 at 04:40 AM.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by stigz View Post
    Looking at the top 100 players in the game at 2700+ rating and saying HEY X SPEC IS THERE doesn't compute to balance. I mean Frost is playable but it isn't anywhere near to what other classes are, by a HUGE marging. Keep in mind those players are playing with fellow pro players playing top tier classes carrying them. Mes would be top 10 even if DK was dogshit. Tired of people saying this to undermine the point that clear unbalance is there. It evades the issue.

    The problem I see right now is huge rating discrepancies solely on what fucking spec you play in the 1600-2100 range. If an above average player playing with above average teammates can't break rating barriers because every other game he gets slapped by enemies just pressing the same buttons in the same order every game for 4x his damage and none of his abilities or his teammates can help counter it there's a massive problem.

    It's like rating brackets have become brackets of classes you face not brackets of increasing skill level of players.
    I understand what you are saying completely, I just disagree. If the spec was not viable, they wouldn't be using it, period. Has anyone asked him why he's playing dk? There has to be a reason, it obviously works well for what they are doing. I get that they are pros, but that's my point, when played by the best its obviously viable, if it wasn't, he wouldn't play it.

    [Banhammer, Kungen's Bane]

    1.60 sp mace
    150 str
    268 sta
    77 defense
    80 dodge
    93 parry
    "As you look upon the mace, you hear the whining of a thousand fanboys. Something deep with in your soul makes it impossible to think anything but 'lol.'"

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by FlashingSilver View Post
    I mean, mes is literally #1 on the 3s ladder playing frost dk so this is just not true.
    Im not a DK player but Mes said on stream that he is useless and that he is carried by Trill (monk).

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by d00mh4cker View Post
    Im not a DK player but Mes said on stream that he is useless and that he is carried by Trill (monk).
    Well there we have it, from the pro himself.
    @Tumble

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Let’s ignore the 1-2 pro tournament player maybe ? Who have a perfect team at all times at hand who can help to fight on even foot ? Because again mes being number 1 doesn’t solve that dk still is under represented and that no one wants to play with them.

    Also the first place is dk..... and the only one in the top 100 Us and the only top 100 dk in Eu is 36

    Let’s look at statistics instead

    Dk Frost above 1800 rating = 173
    Dk Unholy above 1800 rating = 146
    Arms warrior over 1800 rating = 1295
    Windwalker over 1800 = 997
    Sub rogue = 973
    RET Paladin = 761
    Protection paladin = 179

    TANK PALADIN IS MORE PLAYED THEN FROST DK

    In no world are this numbers balanced
    Stats might lie. Many DK mains have rolled arms warrior or even windwalker just because they are more valuable in arena now.
    Mes plays all three, DK, ret and warrior.
    Whaaz plays rogue, warrior and monk.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by enigma77 View Post
    Well there we have it, from the pro himself.
    @Tumble
    Their term for carried, and our term for carried are two completely different things. Those 2 couldn't carry me to #1 even if I was playing the most OP spec.

    [Banhammer, Kungen's Bane]

    1.60 sp mace
    150 str
    268 sta
    77 defense
    80 dodge
    93 parry
    "As you look upon the mace, you hear the whining of a thousand fanboys. Something deep with in your soul makes it impossible to think anything but 'lol.'"

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumble View Post
    Their term for carried, and our term for carried are two completely different things. Those 2 couldn't carry me to #1 even if I was playing the most OP spec.
    Just stop. Statistics, words of pros and any numbers tell you different. But you still try to fight for how balanced dk is. Did one one shot you in skirmish because you stacked under chain chill?

    Dk cant hit higher then 4-5k while warrior spam 8k covenant attacks as 40% of their dmg. The only reason you will see dk dmg being even at the end of games is because the aeo did small damage to every little pet

  17. #37
    Herald of the Titans msdos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tumble View Post
    its obviously viable, if it wasn't, he wouldn't play it.
    This is a logical fallacy and it's also not true. Mes will play Frost DK because he likes Frost DK.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumble View Post
    I understand what you are saying completely, I just disagree. If the spec was not viable, they wouldn't be using it, period. Has anyone asked him why he's playing dk? There has to be a reason, it obviously works well for what they are doing. I get that they are pros, but that's my point, when played by the best its obviously viable, if it wasn't, he wouldn't play it.
    He's playing DK because it's his main. He's getting rating for gear and waiting for nerfs to actually feel like he can play the game and have fun.I mean he could probably get rank 1 as Blood playing with Trill and an S tier healer. WW monk is SO STRONG that it can carry a B tier class to rank 1.That's another side of the argument that nobody is saying

  19. #39
    We now reached a new trend. There are day for day less Dk over 1,8 then the day before. -12 Frost dk -5 Unholy dk. But good news another 100 Warrior replaced them. Now passing 1400 over 1,8 !

    But there is also good news BM was able to get +5 stonks now having 37 player over 1,8 in Na and Eu together

  20. #40
    Dk is fine, the only reason they are not played so often is fast meta and they dominate in pve.

    Their are only some little tuning in pvp and everything is fine.
    Heal from prot and hybrid class nerf.
    Ww and fire mage nerf to the burst.
    A tiny nerf on kyrian rets for pvp and everything is fine.
    I play dh, warrior and dk all 3 classes atm between 2100 and 2400.
    VS some combs warrior is shit
    VS some combs dk is shit
    Vs some combs dh is shit

    For me shadowlands pvp Arena is so much more fun than this 40 mins arena lame play in bfa. In bfa arena was slow.

    The problem is in bfa it was so easy to get high rankings because you have so much time to decide which reaction is right or wrong. You could make 20 mistakes in a row and the game wasn't lost.
    In shadowlands 1 mistake the game is lost.

    But every class could play higher than 1800 so the balance is OK. Some classes have 3 specs viable others only 1.
    But dk has 2 specs high rating viable.
    Warri has only one
    Dh has only one

    I think you aren't a good dk so you can't handle the fast meta.
    I'm a bad dk but play atm at 2k with him. I'm a okay dh and warrior and play only 200 rating higher with them.
    But my skill with dk is the problem that I don't get higher not the class

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