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  1. #981
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Depends on period. I gave few months of break. Before that, I'd run keys around 10. I'd say 10-15 runs a week. So that's ~2 runs a day. "Every single day" might be an exeggaration, but I do see toxicity (including leavers) quite often. It's not rare for me.
    It's so much different from my experience, tho I havent done anything below 15 in months, but I just have absolutely different experience. Leavers only happen when it's clear that we won't time it (only reason to do keys above 15). Some people being asses are more common, one case in 20 keys at most

  2. #982
    Quote Originally Posted by Alroxas View Post
    Wait didn't Ion just cover this that it's a matter of "get gud"? Isn't that basically what you're saying? These players are "bad" because they need more gear (or nerfs to dungeons) so they can do the same content that others can do without the extra gear.

    Alternatively, maybe players should learn to accept their limitations and "move on" instead of trying to do content that they can't do. Also it's important to realize that there is no shame in that. Not everyone is a Limit or Method Mythic raider and that's 100% OK.
    i guess Ion moved too accepted that he cannot get carried and ignores m+ - because he didnt do dungeons like SD and PF even on +2

  3. #983
    Quote Originally Posted by Raava View Post
    People are trying to help https://wowrep.io/ gain some traction. It lets you review players. Short of that, the next best thing would be adding a karma system like the one from Garys Mod if anyone has seen that.

    Start with 1000 karma, it can max out at 1500 if you do well and once it goes down to 800 or lower you do less damage. For M+ it could be similar, but have no effect when the karma goes below 1000 other than showing people that they have been downvoted a hell of a lot. If they manage to get into groups, that have to claw their way back to higher karma. It's literally 10~ lines of code max.
    That's probably the worst version of this idea I have ever heard, and that takes some doing. The very nature of a rep system is flawed ab initio in WoW. It having a material impact on your characters performance is some Black Mirror shit.

  4. #984
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    It's so much different from my experience, tho I havent done anything below 15 in months, but I just have absolutely different experience. Leavers only happen when it's clear that we won't time it (only reason to do keys above 15). Some people being asses are more common, one case in 20 keys at most
    most people are rude in +15/16 when they do them for weekly - only "forgot " to write it in order to lure in good players under pretense its push key.

    there is 0 reason to stay in like +16/17 when not timed so its natural that people leave once timer cannot be met.

  5. #985
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Dude...

    I am doing +10

    >>>>>> +10 <<<<<<<)
    But even though you only are doing "10's" you still manage to consistently get groups that give you a bad in-game experience.
    Other people, and I will say it too, are telling you that we very rarely have a bad in-game experience.

    So the obvious answer is that it is either you that is causing all those problems, as you are the common factor, or that you aren't prudent enough when you pick members for your keys or what keys you join.
    This is most certainly a you-problem, and not a "them-problem".

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrys View Post
    That's probably the worst version of this idea I have ever heard, and that takes some doing. The very nature of a rep system is flawed ab initio in WoW. It having a material impact on your characters performance is some Black Mirror shit.
    I wonder who will have the most pleasant and efficient experience: Those that pick their group based on objective data that shows a players experience (raider.io) or those that pick their group based on subjective and non-verifiable "anonymous reports" as in wowrep.io?

  6. #986
    Quote Originally Posted by Aphrel View Post
    If a group maliciously kick someone, that person can hold the dung hostage. and that then becomes a lose/lose (wich is what we already have with todays system, in other words, a plus minus 0).
    No, if you get kicked now - you get loot if the party still completes the dungeon if it's malicious kick (+), and (-) if you were kicked for being ass hat as you should not be rewarded for that. No extra time wasted and no shady abuse for boosting intentions. Sum 0. You can add another (-) for time wasted and get a sum -

    Hostage/Invites would open way more (-):
    Wasting your time so malicious party can't get boost client/friend in
    Being unable to finish the dungeon because griefer left the party but keeps pulling shit/griefing.
    Not getting loot if kick was malicious and party decided to finish the last boss
    People selling dungeon lockouts
    Absolutely not possible to police this unless competent M+ player reviews each complaint about griefing (toxicity is easy to spot)
    Massive rule set on what happens if (party leader leaves/key holder leaves/who gets loot)
    Do you give a credit towards the vault if you finish the dungeon with new members? If yes that's a boost problem, if no, why even bother?
    Key selling (put the key in and leave)


    for just one (+) (able to invite someone after leaving)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    most people are rude in +15/16 when they do them for weekly - only "forgot " to write it in order to lure in good players under pretense its push key.

    there is 0 reason to stay in like +16/17 when not timed so its natural that people leave once timer cannot be met.
    Well, that's a common reason for toxicity - different interests/abilities in that case.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Raava View Post
    People are trying to help https://wowrep.io/ gain some traction. It lets you review players. Short of that, the next best thing would be adding a karma system like the one from Garys Mod if anyone has seen that.

    Start with 1000 karma, it can max out at 1500 if you do well and once it goes down to 800 or lower you do less damage. For M+ it could be similar, but have no effect when the karma goes below 1000 other than showing people that they have been downvoted a hell of a lot. If they manage to get into groups, that have to claw their way back to higher karma. It's literally 10~ lines of code max.
    Duuuuude, this is some really bad takes.
    I am fairly "good" at the game, but boy...Casuals downvoting key pushers, key pushers downvoting casuals And people think rio is bad.

  7. #987
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    Duuuuude, this is some really bad takes.
    I am fairly "good" at the game, but boy...Casuals downvoting key pushers, key pushers downvoting casuals And people think rio is bad.
    Heeey, would be so cool! Would need to downvote almost every player in most keys, as there is always someone that does less dps than someone with 15+ ilvl less ; or not using his kick, or not using CC, whatever the reason is.
    Would be pretty hard to get a score above 1100, so you know that those people are actually really good!!

  8. #988
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyleech View Post
    Heeey, would be so cool! Would need to downvote almost every player in most keys, as there is always someone that does less dps than someone with 15+ ilvl less ; or not using his kick, or not using CC, whatever the reason is.
    Would be pretty hard to get a score above 1100, so you know that those people are actually really good!!
    Well, I have been called noob for planning prides for big pulls on forty weeks so we can save 90sec on trash instead of 30sec on boss, I'm by no means "godlike" but having 2k io I would think I am fairly competent

  9. #989
    Kinda wishing I was a leaver last night on my alt. Doing a simple SoA +8. Ilvl 201 mage. Double the dps of the next guy. Next guy was a 213 dk. Pulling overall 2k dps. I won't even talk abt the dh. I just don't understand how you can do such low dmg. Still could've possibly timed it but 2 wipes on final boss lol

  10. #990
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrys View Post
    That's probably the worst version of this idea I have ever heard, and that takes some doing. The very nature of a rep system is flawed ab initio in WoW. It having a material impact on your characters performance is some Black Mirror shit.
    I agree on it having an actual impact on your character. The RIO community is bad enough to strangers as it is, the last thing they need is to be weaponized. And I say this as part of it.

    And as a moderator on one of the largest subreddits, karma systems are a mixed bag depending on what kind of audience they're used with. Putting them in a game full of angry or devious people may not be the greatest idea either. It's bad enough we've had people try kicking people from LFD/LFR with comments like "bad" or "lmao!", imagine people downrating others just for kicks.

  11. #991
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromantic View Post
    I agree on it having an actual impact on your character. The RIO community is bad enough to strangers as it is, the last thing they need is to be weaponized. And I say this as part of it.

    And as a moderator on one of the largest subreddits, karma systems are a mixed bag depending on what kind of audience they're used with. Putting them in a game full of angry or devious people may not be the greatest idea either. It's bad enough we've had people try kicking people from LFD/LFR with comments like "bad" or "lmao!", imagine people downrating others just for kicks.
    For what should people be downrated then? For higher content you need people that have knowledge about their own character + the content they are doing.
    Not knowing what to kick, or not using kick at all is HUGE in higher content. I'd instantly vote anyone down if I see that casts get through and their kick is not on cd. That's a freakin no-go. There isn't even a "but..." I'd allow, as there is no reason (except sudden RL) to not use kick.
    And this can be used on any stuff that is important. Stuns, short-taunts (via bm, earth ele..) are just 2 many people do not use.

  12. #992
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyleech View Post
    For what should people be downrated then? For higher content you need people that have knowledge about their own character + the content they are doing.
    Not knowing what to kick, or not using kick at all is HUGE in higher content. I'd instantly vote anyone down if I see that casts get through and their kick is not on cd. That's a freakin no-go. There isn't even a "but..." I'd allow, as there is no reason (except sudden RL) to not use kick.
    And this can be used on any stuff that is important. Stuns, short-taunts (via bm, earth ele..) are just 2 many people do not use.
    The obvious intention would be to downrate people for 1) poor performance 2) leaving (if it will let you once they're gone) or 3) being a rude/obnoxious person. We have people now who will ruin keys for fun (and fully admit to doing it) or are just overall awful people who will downrate anyone regardless of their performance. It's the same as the people who misuse forum downvote features. They're designed as "this does not contribute to the conversation" buttons but are used as "I don't like you" "I disagree with you" or "lol" buttons.

  13. #993
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromantic View Post
    The obvious intention would be to downrate people for 1) poor performance 2) leaving (if it will let you once they're gone) or 3) being a rude/obnoxious person. We have people now who will ruin keys for fun (and fully admit to doing it) or are just overall awful people who will downrate anyone regardless of their performance. It's the same as the people who misuse forum downvote features. They're designed as "this does not contribute to the conversation" buttons but are used as "I don't like you" "I disagree with you" or "lol" buttons.
    Your first point is exactly what I discribed. Not kicking is poor performance, or missing any of their own classes basics/toolkit. But you said in your other post "imagine people downrating others just for kicks.".. So..?

  14. #994
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyleech View Post
    Your first point is exactly what I discribed. Not kicking is poor performance, or missing any of their own classes basics/toolkit. But you said in your other post "imagine people downrating others just for kicks.".. So..?
    I'm not understanding the disconnect. The reasons I listed were actual reasons. "For kicks" means for no reason or just to troll people, which 80% or more of downvotes in forums are just that.

  15. #995
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromantic View Post
    I'm not understanding the disconnect. The reasons I listed were actual reasons. "For kicks" means for no reason or just to troll people, which 80% or more of downvotes in forums are just that.
    I understood it the way that you could not understand people voting down for not using their kicks. Maybe you meant kicking people out of the group? Then it makes more sense, ofc.

  16. #996
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodyleech View Post
    I understood it the way that you could not understand people voting down for not using their kicks. Maybe you meant kicking people out of the group? Then it makes more sense, ofc.
    No, not for not using the kick feature. I meant "for kicks" as in "$hits and giggles".

  17. #997
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromantic View Post
    No, not for not using the kick feature. I meant "for kicks" as in "$hits and giggles".
    Alright, got it now. This should not happen, but it will happen, nothing we or blizzard could do with this system. That's just how some humans work.

    My neighbour thinks he is the top of society and just turns his music absolutely loud even at 3am. He doesn't care at all for others - those people would ruin any system.

  18. #998
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aphrel View Post
    If a group malicously kick someone, that person can hold the dung hostage. and that then becomes a lose/lose (wich is what we already have with todays system, in other words, a plus minus 0).
    As long as they're doing it for either gold or for friends, it probably doesn't matter *when* they finish up, just that they have a key ready to finish quickly. Just keep one guy in there for an hour or two while everyone else goes out doing something else. You want to be petty for an hour or two? I sure don't

    The improvement is in the first line. The most common case has been improved. Thats the change. If i had a feasable solution for griefing id give ut, but nothing practical comes to mind.

    If you got a better idea lets hear it.
    I don't have a better idea, because one doesn't exist. And your idea is open to exploitation in ways that would make the game worse for some people, while not really offering enough incentive to offset that.

  19. #999
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromantic View Post
    I agree on it having an actual impact on your character. The RIO community is bad enough to strangers as it is, the last thing they need is to be weaponized. And I say this as part of it.
    It only reminds me of league of legends where if you are 0/2 it means you are intentional feeding and will be reported.

  20. #1000
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    It only reminds me of league of legends where if you are 0/2 it means you are intentional feeding and will be reported.
    I've never played LoL. I've only heard horror stories about it. If it's worse than the FFXIV community, I can't imagine and my condolences to anyone caught in the crossfire.

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