And people called me a "crazy doomsayer".

[david0925]

You know what? I kinda wish wowhead wouldn't post these the second they find them, because it fucks up my enjoyment in narrative pacing. I'm already annoyed I have to beat/heal Kael'Thas before I even met him outside the raid. It's a personal gripe admittedly, but I wish Blizz could lock these up better

as someone that doesn't play the game, does Castle Nytharia happen before when you ferry Kael around and get rid of his Sinstone? Because otherwise it feels really awkward that you do stuff for him and gets rid of his Sinstone only for him to get captured again and gets another Sinstone for whatever reason.

[Aucald]

as someone that doesn't play the game, does Castle Nytharia happen before when you ferry Kael around and get rid of his Sinstone? Because otherwise it feels really awkward that you do stuff for him and gets rid of his Sinstone only for him to get captured again and gets another Sinstone for whatever reason.

Kael's rescue from Nathria occurs first in the chronology - when you encounter him chapter 7 of the Venthyr Covenant campaign it's after his imprisonment in Nathria and the enhancement of sinstone by the Sire, and the Accuser is overseeing his rehabilitation personally due to the delicate state of Kael'thas' soul.

[Rozz]

You do remember that the Raid encounter is narratively our first SL encounter with him, yes?

Admittedly I wasn't sure if that's the case or not, because I tried to avoid spoilers from beta. If that was supposed to be it, it still feels fumbly to me.

[Mehrunes]

I agree. Everyone tends to think 1-dimensionally and not looking at the subtleties placed in the cinematics. Everything thats happening--has been generally subtle in one way or another. It may have not been executed as GREAT as we would all like, but consider the grander picture before jumping on bandwagons. I think Blizzard succeeded this time, with how many people hate her. But, again--they should consider more than just what they see in one given cinematic.

Blizzard doesn't do subtlety though. The most they can manage in the whole subtlety-related department is misdirection made with blatant bullshit, like when they wanted to pretend that maybe someone else than Sylvanas torched the tree.

Silverpine, and darkshore/teldrassil beg to differ.

also someone, remind me when i run into Vincent Godfrey in shadowlands that i should buy him a drink

Given how getting resurrected again after that is what confirmed for her that her current path (i.e. the path of Jailer apparently, thanks to Shadowlands' glorious reveals) is right, if anything you should spit on him.

You know what? I kinda wish wowhead wouldn't post these the second they find them, because it fucks up my enjoyment in narrative pacing. I'm already annoyed I have to beat/heal Kael'Thas before I even met him outside the raid. It's a personal gripe admittedly, but I wish Blizz could lock these up better

I don't think you meet Kael before the raid. The first part of Venthyr campaign involving him happens after Denathrius' defeat in the story. And while I don't have an alt of each Covenant yet (only Necrolords so far), I doubt he'd pop up in another Covenant campaign earlier than he did in the Venthyr one.

[BrintoSFJ]

Ah! But you dont get it. It will end up as Kerrigan or maybe Severus Snape type story with arbitrary forgiveness of a villain because she did some good in the end. Maybe she will only "partially" enslave Andy Boi, making sure he can shake it off in a right moment or entirely fake the enslavement to allow him to undermine the Jailer.

Snape however did not do anything remotely as horrible as Kerrigan. But yeah, I am really not looking forward to a Sylvanas "redemption" story. It will only show that blizzard doesn't know how to write a proper story, banking on same type of trope over and over again.

[prwraith]

Smh if we get our 500th redemption arc.

[Rozz]

I don't think you meet Kael before the raid. The first part of Venthyr campaign involving him happens after Denathrius' defeat in the story. And while I don't have an alt of each Covenant yet (only Necrolords so far), I doubt he'd pop up in another Covenant campaign earlier than he did in the Venthyr one.

Several other users informed me of this as well. But I'm still not sure I like it. Seeing him a bit awkwardly later is at least better than way too early.

[Mehrunes]

It's not even sound logic since Frostmourne was meant to be crafted by Not!The Primus, not a random Maw mook. Random Maw weaponry doesn't look like Frostmourne. The sharp edges are reminiscent, but the heavily glowing runes and the magical feel is far more toned down and gritty.

Yeah, but that was when it was Not!The Primus' secret. The Jailer stole his memory of his "grandest design" (that got shattered by a mortal-crafted Light-enchanted Dark Naaru blade, fucking over Jailer's equally grandest design for the Lich King that involved 7D underwater checkers on fire with the Legion in the process) so now his mooks can make it. Maybe he wants to mass-produce them.

[AcidicSyn]

I don't like the story blizzard chose to tell. I don't like this character.

If any of you don't agree with me you're clearly not seeing the big picture.

I hate Sylvanas.

Blizzard is dumb.

Did I miss anything?

[huth]

Admittedly I wasn't sure if that's the case or not, because I tried to avoid spoilers from beta. If that was supposed to be it, it still feels fumbly to me.

The Venthyr campaign this week literally starts with stating that it happens after he got freed from the castle.

[LuminaL]

All I see is two villains getting desperate. They lost Denathrius, they lost Muehzala, we are gonna free Primus the Runecarver very soon and the last target is the Jailer with Sylvannas probably being one of the raid bosses. In any case Sylvannas is gonna be confronted by the Alliance and the Horde at some point. I don't see how they can pull that redemption crap. Also nice parallel. Having a runesword now playing Arthas. It's so cute if not pathetic.

nah dont you worry about that a bit, we will confront her, then tyrande wants revenge, but because in blizzard writing revenge = evil then we kill tyrande instead for trying to kill devs.. I mean our beloved character.

[huth]

Yeah, but that was when it was Not!The Primus' secret. The Jailer stole his memory of his "grandest design" (that got shattered by a mortal-crafted Light-enchanted Dark Naaru blade, fucking over Jailer's equally grandest design for the Lich King that involved 7D underwater checkers on fire with the Legion in the process) so now his mooks can make it. Maybe he wants to mass-produce them.

His mooks probably made the first one, too. That's what he stole those designs for in the first place, after all, which also included the Helm. The Runecarver made neither.

[Rozz]

The Venthyr campaign this week literally starts with stating that it happens after he got freed from the castle.

Yeah I did the raid earlier, so that's why I'm saying it felt awkward regardless. Of course, soon it'll be more or less seamless but too late for that. What's done is done and I'm happy to see one of my favorite characters.

[Kaindragon]

"The boy-king serves at the master's table. Three lies will he offer you.".

Anduin will play by the game of Jailer/Sylvanas "accepting" the power she is offering, he will tell us(players) lies so we can truly believe that he is a bad guy. And when at the right moment he strike back. And will be hard for him to control his emotions and all the shit that he believes so he can play this game.

Would be awesome

[TigTone]

"The boy-king serves at the master's table. Three lies will he offer you.".

Anduin will play by the game of Jailer/Sylvanas "accepting" the power she is offering, he will tell us(players) lies so we can truly believe that he is a bad guy. And when at the right moment he strike back. And will be hard for him to control his emotions and all the shit that he believes so he can play this game.

Would be awesome

“The Light has made a pact with the enemy of all.” ... “The crown of light will bring only darkness“.

The void doing what they do best predictions of the future.

[Daemos daemonium]

you mean in the same place where Calia said they should join the alliance?
Calia is the reason they got killed.

Except you know the part where she kills even those’S coming back and says no one who was on good terms with there human relatives could live as she didn’t want that hope spreading.

[Darth-Piekus]

Except you know the part where she kills even those’S coming back and says no one who was on good terms with there human relatives could live as she didn’t want that hope spreading.

I guess for some it's always the others fault. It's the Fault of the Horde traitors, it's the fault of the Civilians. They must have been traitors. It's the fault of Theramore, Dalaran or insert random city. I guess also the Tree had it coming :P

[Daemos daemonium]

Yes, but Faol was Random Killed Person From Lordaeron no. 38292, not the Ranger-General of Silvermoon, who was punished for standing on Arthas' way.

She was made a pawn during unspeakable tortures. Arthas took care for her suffering. He killed her, unmake her, and then made her kill her own people. She witnessed not only the Quel'Thalas fall, he forced her to participate. And even after, Balnazzar was saying that her heart is still elven. Until Wrath of the Lich King, she was mostly sad, sometimes suffering and angry, remembering everything. After that, she commited suicide.

None of this is really an excuse for the way sylvanas acts. thalassian For example pretty much went though all fo the same stuff baring being made a banshee and he’s still good.

The maw is really the only excuse but sylvanas was doing evils stuff before that so it doesn’t really fit.

[Darth-Piekus]

One thing I do not understand is why Sylvannas didn't ask for their help if she wants to make that change instead of causing all of this? If she knew of the way to the Shadowlands I am pretty sure a solution could be found.

[Gelannerai]

None of this is really an excuse for the way sylvanas acts. thalassian For example pretty much went though all fo the same stuff baring being made a banshee and he’s still good.

The maw is really the only excuse but sylvanas was doing evils stuff before that so it doesn’t really fit.

The thing is, Sylvanas wound up in the Maw before the afterlife was broken, so she got there the “right” way (unless Blizzard pulls something out of their ass involving the Jailer somehow circumventing the Arbiter specifically to drag Sylvanas to hell back in Icecrown, which would be yet another internal inconsistency from Blizz’s writers).