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  1. #21
    Stood in the Fire LuckyOne's Avatar
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    There are some edge cases where secondary stats can overtake mainstat but as already said above, in most cases higher itemlevel wins (except trinkets and rings/necklace).

    I've already seen this several times that players are either misinformed or take secondary stats way more important than they usually are for their class/spec, does someone know where that thinking came from?

    Like, optimised secondary stats will make a difference of course on the same itemlevel but for most dd's i'm aware of it won't make the difference of someone being able to do 20% or more damage than before, the effectiveness gap, diminishing returns and the natural distribution due to how gear works and there being no reforging won't allow that.
    Last edited by LuckyOne; 2021-01-05 at 07:53 PM.

  2. #22
    Having a choice between a selection of random items is much better than having no choice in a randomly assigned item. Yes, you'll still hit streaks of bad luck, but your potential luck will always be much higher with a selection of choices than with the old system.
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  3. #23
    Some choices where complete garbage. I got the cloak I got in the raid the same day and then got the exact same cloak in my time walking chest.

    If there is no upgrade you’re either super unlucky or overheated already

  4. #24
    Pandaren Monk Villager720's Avatar
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    You get that you’d still be getting shit with just one option like BFA, right?

    Now you have a reduced chance at getting worthless shit. If you roll six dice you might still get six 1’s. But the odds were significantly higher that you wouldn’t.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    I've already seen this several times that players are either misinformed or take secondary stats way more important than they usually are for their class/spec, does someone know where that thinking came from?
    I'm pretty sure that in Legion and BfA secondary stats were valued much higher than they are now. We saw some crazy corruption stacking (Mages+Mastery, Rogues+Haste were stupid OP) in Ny'alotha and that depended much less on ilevel and much more on the secondary stats.

  6. #26
    Pandaren Monk Villager720's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelangel View Post
    I'm pretty sure that in Legion and BfA secondary stats were valued much higher than they are now. We saw some crazy corruption stacking (Mages+Mastery, Rogues+Haste were stupid OP) in Ny'alotha and that depended much less on ilevel and much more on the secondary stats.
    They also have put in diminishing returns for secondaries if you start stacking them beyond a certain threshold - which they covered in a post.

  7. #27
    So far i've only gotten big upgrades. Loving the vault due to the amount of options...big upgrade from chest.

  8. #28
    It's better than what we had before. That's literally all there's to it.
    It's not a revolutionary new gearing system, it's not a fail proof fallback system, it's not a solution to the gearing problem... it's just a slightly better chance to get something useful compared to BFA where you were almost guaranteed to get only rubbish after like week 2 of a content.

    It's absolutely nothing. And what it 100% certainly isn't, is a replacement for the like 50%+ reduced loot quantity we have compared to prior expansions. It's not rubbish, it's not great, it's just entirely whatever.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    I don't think you understand. The guy you quoted has the totally reasonable request for the game to not only provide rewards for minimal effort but also provide more rewards for the same amount of effort. Hello?
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ya fuck playing the game. Lemme log in, get epics, log off til next week
    You both misunderstand. You would do the same thing you did for a weekly chest in BFA, having 3 options baseline would just be bad RNG protection. You aren't getting more rewards or doing nothing to get them.

  10. #30
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    I think you're going to be hard pressed to convince most people that choosing from up to nine pieces of random higher ilvl gear is bad when we just came from an expansion where we were given one piece of random gear with zero choice or control, and that they have a variety of content they can choose from to get it, instead of just one.

    Personally I haven't had a week yet on any character where there wasn't an upgrade among the choices. Sure, it might not be an exciting upgrade, it might not be for the slot I need most, but at least it's not vendor trash. And now I'm getting a vault reward both on my character that only raids as well as my mythic plus character. Last expac at this time, the former would have gotten nothing, and the later would have already been vendoring pieces in certain slots.

    I could find things to complain about if I tried, but this system is a clear upgrade across the board.
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  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by LDancer View Post
    So I was open minded about the Great Vault being an interesting addition to the end of week rewards. It sounded like an interesting evolution to the weekly chest.

    But now, 2 weeks running I’m thinking it’s either broken or just complete garbage.

    2 weeks running, I’ve had 6 unlocks in the vault for 6 choices, and of those 6, 5 are just an ilvl upgrade of something I’m wearing that I want to replace, and 1 is some other piece of rando gear.

    With having 12 choices the last 2 weeks, I think I’d have been lucky to have gotten 1 piece of gear with haste. But no, it’s all the same crappy crit gear I’m trying to replace with haste gear.

    Anyone else noticing extraordinarily bad “luck” when it comes to the vault choices? What are the odd of it offering me 5 choices of the exact item I’ve already equipped if the selections were completely random?
    If that is true, you'd have had to wait 6 weeks instead of 2 in legion/bfa for the same result.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    When they originally said you'll have more options, I thought they were just going to keep the weekly chest as is, but you open it and have 3 options available. Not this shit where you have to grind X things to get the option.
    So you don't like that you play more than 30 minutes for the vault?

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    You both misunderstand. You would do the same thing you did for a weekly chest in BFA, having 3 options baseline would just be bad RNG protection. You aren't getting more rewards or doing nothing to get them.
    Unlocking 3 options takes maybe a couple hours. From anything besides basic lowest casual content. If you arent doing rated pvp, m+, or raids anyway, why would you even need the gear?

    1 raids is 3 options. Takes 2ish hours.
    1 m+ is 30 mins, 4 is 2ish hours.
    Doing your conquest cap each week is enough to get at least 1 reward. Thats 5 hours throughout the week for 6 possible options. Or 2 for the 3 they want baseline. Dont need the gear if u aren't even doing 2 hours of content a week.

  13. #33
    I have gotten amazing gear the 2 weeks prior to this on my Dk 3 weeks ago it was the PVP 2H axe which saved me an assload of Conquest and then last week I got the perfectly Itemized Sword from De Other Side in 216ilvl which was super sexy. And this week it was a crappy itemized PVP chest that I also gladly took as it again saves me conquest in the long run. I got my Holy Pally to max this past week and had 4 unlocks 1 raid finder, 1 M+ and 2 PVP both PVP were cloaks and would have been upgrades, but were only a 29 ilvl upgrade and the M+ chest piece was a 42ilvl upgrade so I went with it.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyOne View Post
    There are some edge cases where secondary stats can overtake mainstat but as already said above, in most cases higher itemlevel wins (except trinkets and rings/necklace).

    I've already seen this several times that players are either misinformed or take secondary stats way more important than they usually are for their class/spec, does someone know where that thinking came from?

    Like, optimised secondary stats will make a difference of course on the same itemlevel but for most dd's i'm aware of it won't make the difference of someone being able to do 20% or more damage than before, the effectiveness gap, diminishing returns and the natural distribution due to how gear works and there being no reforging won't allow that.
    Which one? Show me the sims please.

  15. #35
    They should switch back to Justice/Valor Points and let us save and chose what we want.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Gasparde View Post
    It's better than what we had before. That's literally all there's to it.
    It's not a revolutionary new gearing system, it's not a fail proof fallback system, it's not a solution to the gearing problem... it's just a slightly better chance to get something useful compared to BFA where you were almost guaranteed to get only rubbish after like week 2 of a content.

    It's absolutely nothing. And what it 100% certainly isn't, is a replacement for the like 50%+ reduced loot quantity we have compared to prior expansions. It's not rubbish, it's not great, it's just entirely whatever.
    Man, with the gearing of bfa, and no tf, people would be done with gear already.

  17. #37
    It's a massive improvement over the weekly chest. That doesn't mean it's without it's flaws, but let's appreciate the upgrade.

  18. #38
    Herald of the Titans msdos's Avatar
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    You need friends who play with you in order for the Great Vault to be an actual fun thing. Outside of that it's just chores.

    "Okay, I do this many dungeons now, even though I would never do this many, just for the sake of vault"
    "Okay, now I grind this much extra honor, vault"
    "Okay, now I kill the same bosses again, just on a different difficulty now, the Vault silly"

    If I'm not having fun doing the content in the first place, by myself, I'm not gonna wanna do more of it. I'll admit I don't have anyone to play with this xpac.
    But people saying this is better than BFA? Nah, it's the same, not better or worse. Same being: I still don't want to to the content, therefore the chest is meaningless lol.

    My vote: remove the Vault because you can see it's now more a carrot on a stick than ever before.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    You both misunderstand. You would do the same thing you did for a weekly chest in BFA, having 3 options baseline would just be bad RNG protection. You aren't getting more rewards or doing nothing to get them.
    ...is that not exactly what I said?

    You want more options for the same amount of effort. This defeats the entire purpose of the Vault system.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by msdos View Post
    My vote: remove the Vault because you can see it's now more a carrot on a stick than ever before.
    "I don't like it therefore it should be removed."


  20. #40
    One thing that sucks about it is that LFR Raiders are getting the shaft until the next wing opens. You need 7 kills to get the next tier and yet there is only 6 bosses you can access right now.

    Other then that I like it, Nice chance at loot.
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