The Great Vault is rubbish.

[RobertMugabe]

Getting one item from a choice of up to 9 is far better than getting up to 1-2 items per week (like in legion and bfa) or none (pre-legion).

This is literally a thread about you whining that you had bad rng and that's it. Like srsly, maybe WoW just isn't for you, considering that loot has virtually always been primarily acquired through rng.

[Jastall]

Its like legendaries on Legion. There is nothing you can do to choose which slot you get, but its really important for your raid team to random a weapon. Its just annoying to see other people outperforming you cos they got lucky and from 1 weekly m+ got better reward then me running 10x 14+ for being able to choose some trash item...

Been like that since forever. RNG is RNG and lucky drops play a big factor early in progression.

[kaminaris]

Getting one item from a choice of up to 9 is far better than getting up to 1-2 items per week (like in legion and bfa) or none (pre-legion).

This is literally a thread about you whining that you had bad rng and that's it. Like srsly, maybe WoW just isn't for you, considering that loot has virtually always been primarily acquired through rng.

I still can't wrap my head around why people ignore all other decisions and say "choice is good", is it so easy to get scammed now?

Like saying its a good thing because you got a $100 raise in job...

While ignoring that free daily meals are gone
Office was moved few km away so you have to travel longer
paid bonuses are totally gone, that alone could be way higher than 100.
daily break was reduced from 45 minutes to 15.

So it's not good if we consider all the things.

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Been like that since forever. RNG is RNG and lucky drops play a big factor early in progression.

No? You had master loot and/or TF, bonus rolls, badges. Literally in entire wow history RNG didn't have so much too say about you gear than now.

[otaXephon]

And what exactly is your argument? At least he has some, for him game doesn't bring enough enjoyment to justify cost.

You know, picking up some random arguments while ignoring every other properly formulated doesn't make you win in conversations.

What the fuck are you even talking about, dude? You can point out the flaw in somebody else's reasoning without creating an argument of your own. I'm not trying to "win" anything.

[kaminaris]

What the fuck are you even talking about, dude? You can point out the flaw in somebody else's reasoning without creating an argument of your own. I'm not trying to "win" anything.

But you haven't. Thats the thing. You simply said that for you its worth the money, elaborate way.

Hes argument was pretty clear, perhaps you didn't understand it?
If so, let me translate it: He doesn't want to grind arbitrary shit for completely random reward. That may end up not being even a reward in the end.

[otaXephon]

But you haven't. Thats the thing. You simply said that for you its worth the money, elaborate way.

Hes argument was pretty clear, perhaps you didn't understand it?
If so, let me translate it: He doesn't want to grind arbitrary shit for completely random reward. That may end up not being even a reward in the end.

???????????

You really need to step up your reading comprehension skills because I did not say this at any point in this thread. I disagree with what I view as non-arguments with bullshit reasoning like, "I don't like this system therefore it should be removed" but I never said it was better or worse than my position.

[kaminaris]

???????????

You really need to step up your reading comprehension skills because I did not say this at any point in this thread. I disagree with what I view as non-arguments with bullshit reasoning like, "I don't like this system therefore it should be removed" but I never said it was better or worse than my position.

It's clear that you didn't even read his posts dude.

1st one: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post52923909

his complaints explained:
1. Pugging is not enjoyable experience - perfectly valid complaint
2. GV feels like checklist not like playing game and being rewarded - perfectly valid complaint
3. Missed one boss on heroic? Have to kill one boss on normal to get 3rd option unlocked - perfectly valid complaint

So if you simplified all his valid complaints to "i dont like it so it should be removed"
Then its you who needs to step up with reading with comprehension.

[ablock87]

Got a 220 Inscrutable Quantum Device last week.

Yeah, the Great Vault is awesome. Dependent on doing content, the more you do, the bigger chance you'll get a clear upgrade.

[otaXephon]

It's clear that you didn't even read his posts dude.

1st one: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post52923909

his complaints explained:
1. Pugging is not enjoyable experience - perfectly valid complaint
2. GV feels like checklist not like playing game and being rewarded - perfectly valid complaint
3. Missed one boss on heroic? Have to kill one boss on normal to get 3rd option unlocked - perfectly valid complaint

So if you simplified all his valid complaints to "i dont like it so it should be removed"
Then its you who needs to step up with reading with comprehension.

None of the complaints he provided have a God damned thing to do with the intended purpose of the GV which is exactly why I said what I did in the first place. And then when somebody rightfully called him out on this bullshit, his response was, "WELL IT'S NOT MY FAULT YOU'RE TOO ADDICTED TO UNDERSTAND ME!!!" This is also not a valid complaint nor is it a reasonable observation to make. With that said, would you kindly stop trying to defend somebody else's shitty position by implying I said something I didn't and actually, I don't know, have something meaningful to contribute to the conversation?

[kaminaris]

None of the complaints he provided have a God damned thing to do with the intended purpose of the GV which is exactly why I said what I did in the first place. And then when somebody rightfully called him out on this bullshit, his response was, "WELL IT'S NOT MY FAULT YOU'RE TOO ADDICTED TO UNDERSTAND ME!!!" This is also not a valid complaint nor is it a reasonable observation to make. With that said, would you kindly stop trying to defend somebody else's shitty position by implying I said something I didn't and actually, I don't know, have something meaningful to contribute to the conversation?

Stop dude. His complaints about GV are valid whatever you like it or not. Being cynical doesn't make you win conversations which by the way you just hijacked.
He was replying to some insane comment of dude calling people "monkey brain".

The whole purpose of GV is flawed. It shifts rewards away from content to weekly click-lootbox with checklist style similar to mobile game design. Not to mention you have no control whatsoever about the outcome.

[Lolites]

Will so weak? This is a bad argument. I'm paying 15$ sub either way. If I'm not getting my 15$ worth that's not weak will, that's just a bad product.

I want to play more, but I don't want to grind and that is something you obviously can't understand, none of you addicts can, because you will just arbitrarily grind for anything placed in front of you for any reason, so yeah, I can see how you would be delusional enough to think that people who don't want to arbitrarily grind for random rewards are "weak willed", that is just pathetic addict cope lmao.

lol, sure i do how much dungeons i want, you feel "forced to grind" 10 bcs there is another option for that, but its ME whos at fault...
not sure if you are troll or just not too bright, or why the hell do you contradict your own previous comments, but its pointless to argue with people like you...

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And what exactly is your argument? At least he has some, for him game doesn't bring enough enjoyment to justify cost.

he said he feels forced to play due to vault and in next he said he wants to play more but everyone who plays more due to vault is addict... how is that argument?! that doesnt even make sense and contradicts itself...

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I still can't wrap my head around why people ignore all other decisions and say "choice is good", is it so easy to get scammed now?

Like saying its a good thing because you got a $100 raise in job...

While ignoring that free daily meals are gone
Office was moved few km away so you have to travel longer
paid bonuses are totally gone, that alone could be way higher than 100.
daily break was reduced from 45 minutes to 15.

So it's not good if we consider all the things.
.

as far as i can tell, only removal of pvp chest is worse, everything else is far better than weekly chest from BFA
so please enlighten us then, what is so bad about vault?

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He was replying to some insane comment of dude calling people "monkey brain".

"monkey see monkey do" is pretty much spot on description of people seeing 9 options in vault and think "i HAVE TO do all of this" if you cant comprehend it, well world is much brigther when you are not too bright for it, so good for you, but im done wasting time arguing with someone who ignores point of view of others and keeps hammering the same bullshit point without any arguments whatsoever...

[Nite92]

I think it's a negative though, before your primary upgrades came from doing the content directly. With the vault you're encouraged to do a metric tonne of content to avoid the frustration of getting bad or multiple repeat items, but because direct content now drops less loot and M+ loot quality is lower you're actually relying on that end of week reward as your main way to gain ilvl.

Now imagine you were a player who came home from work, raided and went to bed, maybe do 2-3 dungeons a week or even just the one for the cache. This kinda player is literally screwed, and the more hardcore (fill out every option) guys have an astronomical advantage. I lived and breathed on raidlogging in the past, it was the only way I could do it, and in TBC/Wrath/Cata/MOP/WOD my char was geared to the balls and all I had to do was show up to a raid 2x a week.

Now I'm like a peasant while friends who live inside the game do more dungeons in a week than I can do in a month. And I think I try to squeeze out 2-3 vault options a week while picking up no upgrades along the way and I get the same items several times over, 2 weeks with ilvl 216-223 items in cache and no upgrades.

I dunno what you want. How else would you treat repeatable content? You cannot just "farm" 226 ilvl items, without making all other content irrelevant reward wise.
And if you don't have the time (or dont want) to complete 4 dungeons a week, you just have to change your expectations, or play a different game.

[czarek]

So I was open minded about the Great Vault being an interesting addition to the end of week rewards. It sounded like an interesting evolution to the weekly chest.

But now, 2 weeks running I’m thinking it’s either broken or just complete garbage.

2 weeks running, I’ve had 6 unlocks in the vault for 6 choices, and of those 6, 5 are just an ilvl upgrade of something I’m wearing that I want to replace, and 1 is some other piece of rando gear.

With having 12 choices the last 2 weeks, I think I’d have been lucky to have gotten 1 piece of gear with haste. But no, it’s all the same crappy crit gear I’m trying to replace with haste gear.

Anyone else noticing extraordinarily bad “luck” when it comes to the vault choices? What are the odd of it offering me 5 choices of the exact item I’ve already equipped if the selections were completely random?

Weekly chest was pure RNG. Secondary stats are random yes that can hurt but imo better to chose 1 of a few than get 1 totally random >< For me its ok. Much better than weekly chest.

[kamuimac]

You won't get more than 1-3 for entire season, let alone full gear. And if you do, you should play lotteries. Math, do you know it? Probability calcs, ever heard of?

If we take just great vault as standalone system then yes it's better than just chest, but we don't unless we are susceptible to scam.
People need to realize that in context of overall gearing system, GV doesn't save them from bad RNG. In fact, it does the complete opposite because of:
1. Lack of any alternatives (badges, tf, coins, master loot), literally lack of any bad luck protection system
2. Gigantic disparity between rewards from actual content vs vault rewards.

So all and all, GV is shit.

technically GV is brilliant as it premiums the most vocal crowd - streamers and youtubrs get carried plus they play like 80 hours a week so ofc they get bis

while 90 % of playerbase who dont get carried / dont play 80 hours a week get rubbish choices , get screwed by rng and will take a year to gear up .

so streamers/youtubers do the PR job sayin how brilliant expansion is while your average player ? either he accepts being 2nd rate citizen or leaves game

1 thing is certain - streamers certainly won this expansion - even though its killing this game

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Stop dude. His complaints about GV are valid whatever you like it or not. Being cynical doesn't make you win conversations which by the way you just hijacked.
He was replying to some insane comment of dude calling people "monkey brain".

The whole purpose of GV is flawed. It shifts rewards away from content to weekly click-lootbox with checklist style similar to mobile game design. Not to mention you have no control whatsoever about the outcome.

im just waiting patiently for blizzard to introduce in 9.1 option to pay 20 euro for access to 3 choices a week without playing any content

we are literaly 1 tiny step away from such system

and such system makes perfect sense in SL doesnt it ?

[Bigbazz]

I dunno what you want. How else would you treat repeatable content? You cannot just "farm" 226 ilvl items, without making all other content irrelevant reward wise.
And if you don't have the time (or dont want) to complete 4 dungeons a week, you just have to change your expectations, or play a different game.

Well more reliable gearing, offer a currency as a secondary option. I've farmed 2-3 vault items from M+ weekly so far, had a lot of duplicates (bracers/neck/rings) and while the 3rd duplicate ring was the lower ilvl option this week, the highest option was another ring and my ideal legendary slot is a ring.. A currency would have been great, to spend towards something at least remotely targeted.

And I also think M+ nevermind the vault the dungeon drops themselves are too low for the difficulty of the content. It's like a +14 up is mythic raider territory and the loot is like normal mode raiding, I think a M10-12 should be dropping 210 and a M+15 should be 213-216 ish. The vault'd be great if it had some protections in place, like not allowing 3 of the same slot or eliminating the item from the pool for a few weeks after it's chosen as an option.

Lets not forget the new Vault was meant to be bad luck protection but they bundled it with less loot from all other content, actively nerfing drops. They even nerfed timewalking drops because people were getting 2 items for a full clear.

[cparle87]

Anyone else noticing extraordinarily bad “luck” when it comes to the vault choices? What are the odd of it offering me 5 choices of the exact item I’ve already equipped if the selections were completely random?

They're not completely random. The pvp options offer you gear from a pool of pvp gear. The raid options offer you gear from the raids. And the keystone options offer you gear from the 5-mans.

[crusadernero]

I like the idea of the great vault. With that said.. Am I the only one thinking the requirements are a bit steep? Many of the activites requires time to complete, especially if you want to take part in several aspects of the game.

Personally I would love a return of justice/valor system along with the GV. Make GV generate random good gear while badges could serve as a means to buy decent enough gear. It also sucks running dungeons/raids without getting jack shit. Atleast give me something.

PvP actually feels decent enough atm, cause win or lose, you get honor that you can spend on something.

[xlord]

You need friends who play with you in order for the Great Vault to be an actual fun thing. Outside of that it's just chores.

"Okay, I do this many dungeons now, even though I would never do this many, just for the sake of vault"
"Okay, now I grind this much extra honor, vault"
"Okay, now I kill the same bosses again, just on a different difficulty now, the Vault silly"

If I'm not having fun doing the content in the first place, by myself, I'm not gonna wanna do more of it. I'll admit I don't have anyone to play with this xpac.
But people saying this is better than BFA? Nah, it's the same, not better or worse. Same being: I still don't want to to the content, therefore the chest is meaningless lol.

My vote: remove the Vault because you can see it's now more a carrot on a stick than ever before.

I don't hate the vault, but totaly agree with this.
I enjoy doing some arena with a friend, but atm I'm mainly doing arena to get at least 2 choices while I also 'need' to keep up with the campaign, renown and torghast.
Maybe I should just stop seeing everything as a "I must do all this before the weekly reset" and just do the stuff I enjoy

[ReD-EyeD]

The vault is one of the best things about Shadowlands hands down

[Xalvia]

So I was open minded about the Great Vault being an interesting addition to the end of week rewards. It sounded like an interesting evolution to the weekly chest.

But now, 2 weeks running I’m thinking it’s either broken or just complete garbage.

2 weeks running, I’ve had 6 unlocks in the vault for 6 choices, and of those 6, 5 are just an ilvl upgrade of something I’m wearing that I want to replace, and 1 is some other piece of rando gear.

With having 12 choices the last 2 weeks, I think I’d have been lucky to have gotten 1 piece of gear with haste. But no, it’s all the same crappy crit gear I’m trying to replace with haste gear.

Anyone else noticing extraordinarily bad “luck” when it comes to the vault choices? What are the odd of it offering me 5 choices of the exact item I’ve already equipped if the selections were completely random?

sounds like someone is salty af