The Great Vault is rubbish.

[Faesroll]

What exactly are you expecting from the vault if ilvl upgrades aren't it?

[Lightforged]

Are people really complaining about the Vault? It is great!

[Jastall]

No? You had master loot and/or TF, bonus rolls, badges. Literally in entire wow history RNG didn't have so much too say about you gear than now.

Badges gave you inferior gear always, and can we stop with this fiction that the bonus roll was so awesome? Most of the time you got AP, weehee. Or it was the item you didn't want. I would like them back still, but they don't do much to fix a gearing problem. Blizzard should just up the drop rates to what they were previously and done, system fixed.

[phattsao]

Some of the restrictions are dumb. Like if I do enough for one PvP reward and one raid reward, I should get two items, not just one, since they're itemized for different purposes.

[Argorwal]

I like the idea of the great vault. With that said.. Am I the only one thinking the requirements are a bit steep? Many of the activites requires time to complete, especially if you want to take part in several aspects of the game.

Personally I would love a return of justice/valor system along with the GV. Make GV generate random good gear while badges could serve as a means to buy decent enough gear. It also sucks running dungeons/raids without getting jack shit. Atleast give me something.

PvP actually feels decent enough atm, cause win or lose, you get honor that you can spend on something.

What item level gear do you think badge gear should drop, and from what loot table should it pull from or if it creates it’s own loot table how many slots should it cover?

[Gorsameth]

Some of the restrictions are dumb. Like if I do enough for one PvP reward and one raid reward, I should get two items, not just one, since they're itemized for different purposes.

No, because then you would be 'required' to do all 3 activities. Instead of just what you are willing to do because you only get 1 item anyway.

[kaminaris]

Badges gave you inferior gear always, and can we stop with this fiction that the bonus roll was so awesome? Most of the time you got AP, weehee. Or it was the item you didn't want. I would like them back still, but they don't do much to fix a gearing problem. Blizzard should just up the drop rates to what they were previously and done, system fixed.

But they did give you gear you wanted. And as for bonus rolls, they did work, usually I got 1-3 items per tier I wanted. Just had to roll them on bosses you knew they don't have too high loot table. They did work, especially when they got BLP attached. Still better than current system, and somehow you forgot master loot.

Plus, upping droprates won't fix shit by itself because that's not a problem. Problem is lack of any deterministic sub-system and gigantic gear disparity for M+ vs great weekly bingo lottery.

[crusadernero]

What item level gear do you think badge gear should drop, and from what loot table should it pull from or if it creates it’s own loot table how many slots should it cover?

I cant give you those numbers, cant be bothered right now to find out all the current top ilevel gear.

Maybe something around raid finder ilevel? Thats 187 atm I think? Or maybe normal raid gear level at 200. PS! Not sure about ilevel numbers.

The loot table for badges can be more or less the loot tables from dungeons or unique so people farm them for apperance to.

Its not needed to drop ALOT of badges everyday or every week, but something would be nice to gain from dungeon spams. The honor gear upgrade is rather nice and a good example. You start off with buying the blue gear and after getting enough honor, you can upgrade that gear to a certain ilevel. Makes doing random BGs worthwhile instead of just the one daily for 40 conquest.

[Argorwal]

I cant give you those numbers, cant be bothered right now to find out all the current top ilevel gear.

Maybe something around raid finder ilevel? Thats 187 atm I think? Or maybe normal raid gear level at 200. PS! Not sure about ilevel numbers.

The loot table for badges can be more or less the loot tables from dungeons or unique so people farm them for apperance to.

Its not needed to drop ALOT of badges everyday or every week, but something would be nice to gain from dungeon spams. The honor gear upgrade is rather nice and a good example. You start off with buying the blue gear and after getting enough honor, you can upgrade that gear to a certain ilevel. Makes doing random BGs worthwhile instead of just the one daily for 40 conquest.

If the gear isn’t that strong to me it becomes kind of pointless.

Valor never included weapons, and we already get a free set of just below normal raid of 200 in 8 slot covenant armor.

[Mightytasty]

Also not a fan of the great vault. It’s an RNG mess and not much better than the BFA version.

I agree with other posters that boss reroll tokens are a better system. And for PvP, just raise the conquest cap instead, 550 is hilariously low.

[Jastall]

But they did give you gear you wanted. And as for bonus rolls, they did work, usually I got 1-3 items per tier I wanted. Just had to roll them on bosses you knew they don't have too high loot table. They did work, especially when they got BLP attached. Still better than current system, and somehow you forgot master loot.

Plus, upping droprates won't fix shit by itself because that's not a problem. Problem is lack of any deterministic sub-system and gigantic gear disparity for M+ vs great weekly bingo lottery.

I didn't forget Master Loot, Blizzard did and they made it clear it ain't coming back like it or not, in large part I think due to being a lot less stress on their CS team.

Lack of deterministic system? Great Vault is more deterministic than anything since badge gear itself. Coin wasn't deterministic (or I guess Azerite vendor, for all of 3 slots, yay), it was still heavily reliant on RNG and people complained about coin all the time.

[kaminaris]

I didn't forget Master Loot, Blizzard did and they made it clear it ain't coming back like it or not, in large part I think due to being a lot less stress on their CS team.

Lack of deterministic system? Great Vault is more deterministic than anything since badge gear itself. Coin wasn't deterministic (or I guess Azerite vendor, for all of 3 slots, yay), it was still heavily reliant on RNG and people complained about coin all the time.

And this is how people got scammed.

Do the math first. GV is nothing more tha additional random guaranteed drop. Coin was far more deterministic.

[Aresk]

And this is how people got scammed.

Do the math first. GV is nothing more tha additional random guaranteed drop. Coin was far more deterministic.

Do you have the probability that a coin returns an item instead of something else? Without those numbers, I don't see how the math can be completed.

[Yooginava182]

its been a god send. I got ilvl 158 boots when I dinged 60 and started gearing. Since I never saw a pair of boots until this week in my vault I got my BiS boots mythic 5 210 ilvl. So far i've gotten BiS gear from the vault i didn't get from raid / mythic +

[Toybox]

LOL, how is this possible??? What an analogy!

TGV is way better than the old chest, its not even compareable. You are bringing 7 more arguments int your posts because you know you can't argue against that fact.

He's making an interesting point to be fair. Gear drops from raids & dungeons are very limited, & while PvP gear is relevant again, the amount of conquest gear you can get is totally hardcapped. We've gone from raids where you might expect 2-3 drops over the course of a night (with a bonus roll chance on top) to probably getting a single piece from 10 bosses.

The great vault as a standalone system is obviously a huge improvement, but if loot from every other PvE aspect of the game is noticeably worse, is it really better overall? All I can really compliment (and criticise) the vault for is that it keeps the item level disparity to a minimum between different tiers of raiders. So long as you're doing some M+, you're probably never going to be too far behind. As an example, my friend is 216 having done 15~ heroic bosses total & some M+ with guildies. I'm only a single item level higher having cleared heroic every week since week one & likely to kill a 5th mythic boss tomorrow.

[kaminaris]

Do you have the probability that a coin returns an item instead of something else? Without those numbers, I don't see how the math can be completed.

Coin is a static drop 1 of out X where X is the number of items you coin for. Bosses had 1-4 items usually.
GV is is the same static drop but (1-3) out of Y where Y is the number of ALL items from that content.

Number of actual rolls you had to do with a coin doesn't matter as you had 2-3 coins per week and with BLP that meant 0.5-0.8 items per week. Out of pretty small pool.

[Utrrabbit]

One thing that sucks about it is that LFR Raiders are getting the shaft until the next wing opens. You need 7 kills to get the next tier and yet there is only 6 bosses you can access right now.

Other then that I like it, Nice chance at loot.

"LFR raiders"

If you only do LFR you are not a raider. Your a just trying to play the game as single player.

- - - Updated - - -

Coin is a static drop 1 of out X where X is the number of items you coin for. Bosses had 1-4 items usually.
GV is is the same static drop but (1-3) out of Y where Y is the number of ALL items from that content.

Number of actual rolls you had to do with a coin doesn't matter as you had 2-3 coins per week and with BLP that meant 0.5-0.8 items per week. Out of pretty small pool.

I love the bad napkin math that some people try. It always amuses me.

[roahn the warlock]

So I was open minded about the Great Vault being an interesting addition to the end of week rewards. It sounded like an interesting evolution to the weekly chest.

But now, 2 weeks running I’m thinking it’s either broken or just complete garbage.

2 weeks running, I’ve had 6 unlocks in the vault for 6 choices, and of those 6, 5 are just an ilvl upgrade of something I’m wearing that I want to replace, and 1 is some other piece of rando gear.

With having 12 choices the last 2 weeks, I think I’d have been lucky to have gotten 1 piece of gear with haste. But no, it’s all the same crappy crit gear I’m trying to replace with haste gear.

Anyone else noticing extraordinarily bad “luck” when it comes to the vault choices? What are the odd of it offering me 5 choices of the exact item I’ve already equipped if the selections were completely random?

I don't want this to come across as mean, but the reason it's not working for you, is because you play enough to get 6 choices across the board. You're playing too much, the vault is for casual players to kinda be able to keep up with you.

[Snowfunk]

The Vault is a stroke of genius.

Kind of wish the third raid drop would stay a 207 option, for a full NM clear, even after you convert to first to a HC drop though.

[Lolites]

I love the bad napkin math that some people try. It always amuses me.

i think calling what he did "math" is an overstatement... he literaly pulled number out of his ass and write it in a way it seemed he did something to actualy calculate it...

now back to reality, if the coin remained it would have roughly the same chance as raid drop itself have (why would they give it higher if their own goal is to give us less loot) so you should get aprox 1.5 items per raid now (10 bosses), so lets say you would get 1 item per 6 coins, 3 coins a week that means one random item from chosen boss per two weeks, and he consider that better than one CHOSEN item from you options each week...
i think there is no need to say more

tbh other than people dissapointed they lost second (pvp) chest, only people saying GV is shit seems to be (at least from comments) people who want to be rewarded for doing nothing