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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggressive View Post
    LoL. This means nothing because when a class is shit, people still buy the product even though the class is trash. The percentage for the class being played is just low.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    Yes they do.

    Oh I forgot, we're in the super srs forum.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Xjan View Post
    Oh I forgot, we're in the super srs forum.
    What are you suggesting here?

  3. #23
    Isn't Assassination receive buff soon +8%. I don'y know about M+15, but on lower keys I have no problem keeping up with other classes. Only negative I think dungeons are not very melee friendly, but this just might be my feeling. When they buff Assa, moving around shouldn't be such a big problem. I'm not anymore hardcore player, more casual one - I don't feel there is anything wrong with Rogues.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by the-quick View Post
    Isn't Assassination receive buff soon +8%. I don'y know about M+15, but on lower keys I have no problem keeping up with other classes. Only negative I think dungeons are not very melee friendly, but this just might be my feeling. When they buff Assa, moving around shouldn't be such a big problem. I'm not anymore hardcore player, more casual one - I don't feel there is anything wrong with Rogues.
    I hate to be that guy, but if you're playing assassination and are keeping up with people during raids or mythic+, you're playing with terrible players.

    Sin rogues are underperforming across the board, whether it be burst dps, sustained dps, target switching, cleave or AoE, we're really shitting it, and i doubt an 8% overall buff changes a lot except maybe our sustained single target.

  5. #25
    always blows my mind how people who play rogues,an S tier class since DAY 1 OF WOW,can complain about it....there has never been an expansion where atleast one spec of rogue was not top tier in pve and pvp,often times it was broken op

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbselle View Post
    Yes I did. Show me the opposite. I'm curious what you found.
    The first rogue spec to show up is Outlaw at 10th. Sub is 17th and Assassin is 19th. Right now rogues are trash in pve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    always blows my mind how people who play rogues,an S tier class since DAY 1 OF WOW,can complain about it....there has never been an expansion where atleast one spec of rogue was not top tier in pve and pvp,often times it was broken op
    Right now there are no S-tier rogue pve specs.

  7. #27
    just had a quick look. there are 2 entire classes who are worse than rogues worst spec. and rogues best spec is better than 5 classes. you're fine.

    i will say we did bench rogues for some bosses, but that was more because we needed the other classes than that there was anything wrong with the rogues. but i can't say i have much pity for rogues in that regard seeing how often cloak of shadow has been just as OP in the past.
    Last edited by Hellobolis; 2021-01-09 at 04:14 PM.

  8. #28
    I feel like you guys are arguing about the wrong thing. Outlaw damage is fine, and therefore the rogue class is fine at the moment. The REAL problem for rogue right now isn't damage, it's every other melee bringing a buff or AMZ to the raid, while rogue still only brings damage. Half the problem right now is why bring a rogue when you can stack DKs and have 4 AMZ and more dps. The literal issue for Rogue is it's the only melee that brings nothing that can't be achieved with the more meta hunter.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Dessicuus View Post
    I feel like you guys are arguing about the wrong thing. Outlaw damage is fine, and therefore the rogue class is fine at the moment. The REAL problem for rogue right now isn't damage, it's every other melee bringing a buff or AMZ to the raid, while rogue still only brings damage. Half the problem right now is why bring a rogue when you can stack DKs and have 4 AMZ and more dps. The literal issue for Rogue is it's the only melee that brings nothing that can't be achieved with the more meta hunter.
    I've been maining a combat rogue since EU launch, this is literally our problem every time rogues are "in trouble". This expansion especially also has a lot of anti-melee bosses in the dungeons (haven't raided, so can't speak for Castle Nathrias), forcing a lot of movement and therefore dropped DPS. So when your class only brings DPS, and other melees bring the same DPS + buffs, you're going to drop the class that only brings one thing. A lot of packs have true sight mobs too, making sapping targets quite difficult, which doesn't help either.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by MrMatticus View Post
    The first rogue spec to show up is Outlaw at 10th. Sub is 17th and Assassin is 19th. Right now rogues are trash in pve.

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    Right now there are no S-tier rogue pve specs.
    wile rogues atm are not broken as they almost always have been,m+ and arena ladders have plenty of them in the top
    Last edited by deenman; 2021-01-09 at 04:53 PM.

  11. #31
    Dreadlord
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    Yeah sin in m+ needs bug fixing and higher mastery values + azerite and essence dmg and we are good to go ^^
    They also stated that the 8% will not be enough. I would not be surprised if more buffs are kn their way

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Proper Ninja View Post
    the class is officially unsupported now. what ever fun you can derive from the remains of sub or any spec is now in your court. just don't get mad when blizzard decides to nerf your class again.
    Lemme guess you only play 1 of the 3 specs and complain about anybody who hints you should switch to outlaw or sub

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Bhalial View Post
    what game are you playing?
    the one where rogues are trash in every regard.

    Rogues genuinly suck at pvp, literally the only rogues in top 50 on both EU and NA are Blizzcon contenders. meanwhile we have people like Quin up there on his paladin now keep in mind Rogues are one of the most popular pvp classes in the game, so when their representation isnt great, it really speaks volumes, unlike DK's who only have 1 in the top 50 on both NA and EU, but he is also rank 1, just not a particularly popular class in the high end.

    Does this mean they are unplayable? evidently not, but when people like Whaaz literally drop their rogue to go and play a warrior and a monk, theres usually a reason for it.

    PvE this is the first time rogues are underperforming, like ever. they bring very limited utility unlike classes like Ret, or DK's with Bops, Freedoms, and Anti magic zones, which are all pretty fucking huge, and they dont bring a battle shout, or 5% phys damage like monks.

    then theres the gearing situation, if you want to play a rogue right now u want to be Sub for PVP and for Single target, Outlaw for cleave and M+. their gear is not compatible. they want different everything. which is incredibly aids in Shadow lands particularly with its weekly gated bullshit. Weapons? no problem im 2.4k rated, sadly i have to wait 2 weeks for every weapon I want, and it also means giving up on other items, so Ive just gone casual, afking till ive gotten all my weekly shit to play both speccs, so i can actually play the damn game.

    Im not even a rogue player, only picked rogue cuz I considered it a safe pick, what a joke. in general the balancing of this expac is atrocious, casters already topping meters left right and center in the first raid tier while scaling better than all melees? poggers...

    also rogue scaling is literally trash compared to every other class in the game atm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Have you looked at the mythic raid logs and how many rogues there was?
    ?? do you have a point or did u just throw some random sentence out there? or was it supposed to mean that rogues are fine? cuz that is not how you do statistics, if anything you should be comparing the percentage representation in comparison to previous raid tiers, and even that would be a weak argument.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NabyBro View Post
    Sub is still pretty above average and outlaw is S tier.

    What are you on about?

    In fact, the last 3 expansion rogues always had one spec in S tier in every single patch.
    S tier according to who, and in what content?

    They are most certainly not S tier when none are brought by any top guilds. thats some wack shit to say. if you're on about M+ then yes, right now they are taken over stuff like Monks because of Mind numbing poison, and Shroud, but since rogue scaling is trash compared to for example monks, they are most likely gonna phase out. its already happening, every top key had a rogue early on, and every day the representation of yellows in top keys is dropping.

    In PVP? they are C tier at best atm, only reason rogues are even C tier is because their setup is still perfect for Fire mages, and fire mages are busted. if mages were nerfed rogues would become irrelevant completely in PVP. literally every top rogue agrees they are in a super bad spot atm, Whaaz, Pika etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notthebees View Post
    Imagine thinking rogue is ever in a bad place, pve or pvp. Peak hilarity.
    thats why i picked rogue for this expansion, what a meme that was. if you dont think they are in a bad spot then you're either clueless or delusional. So much for my safe pick.

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    Quote Originally Posted by prwraith View Post
    Lemme guess you only play 1 of the 3 specs and complain about anybody who hints you should switch to outlaw or sub
    you obviously know fuck all about rogue, theres a multitude of issues with what u just said, Sub can ONLY single target, and bring 0 raid utility atm, while doing dog shit ST Dps considering it is literally all it can do.

    which means u need gear for both Outlaw and Sub, sadly SL is weekly gated as fuck so getting both is gonna take months.

    and they both still suck in pvp lel, facerolling my 190 ilvl boomkin on higher rating than my rogue atm, its such a meme, literally only able to play RMP, and granted, dont have any "good mages" to play with but not like the mage has to know how to play in RMP. cant even stay above 2.4k as Thug, and RPS is genuinly just a meme at the effort and difficulty to make it work while i just randomly convoke my way to 2.6k on my zero gear boomy omegalul

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by kodemonkee View Post
    Have you looked at the mythic raid logs and how many rogues there was?
    And who cares why? Just because some logs show some things based on raid comp and how easy they are to play means nothing to the vast majority of the wow population.

    Unless, of course, you're the kind of person who thinks that because some neckbeard who plays at a level higher than you has X spec you should have the same spec or it's all trash because fuck having fun right?

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumile View Post
    and they both still suck in pvp lel, facerolling my 190 ilvl boomkin on higher rating than my rogue atm, its such a meme, literally only able to play RMP, and granted, dont have any "good mages" to play with but not like the mage has to know how to play in RMP. cant even stay above 2.4k as Thug, and RPS is genuinly just a meme at the effort and difficulty to make it work while i just randomly convoke my way to 2.6k on my zero gear boomy omegalul
    I mean PvP is a deadgame so non-issue there dawg

  16. #36
    Why rest in peace? what did i miss? Dps wise is top 10 with a small difference in power between 10-4 damage wise, except the obvious Balance/Unholy/MM, so number wise it's in a good spot, really high chance it will not get nerf, i can't touch pvp wise but I assume rogue is rogue, I sincerely don't see what is the problem

    I feel a lot of people here are heavily overestimating the level they are playing at

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by mitre27 View Post
    I hate to be that guy, but if you're playing assassination and are keeping up with people during raids or mythic+, you're playing with terrible players.

    Sin rogues are underperforming across the board, whether it be burst dps, sustained dps, target switching, cleave or AoE, we're really shitting it, and i doubt an 8% overall buff changes a lot except maybe our sustained single target.
    Sin rogues are underperforming sheet wise because no S-Tier-Player is willingly to play it. If more of the better rogues would decide to play assa and min-maxing the gear and rotation out of it, the difference would be marginal or rather non existant in practise.

    But this is the problem with the "meta mentality". Because some Bot has told us like couple month even before shadowlands release that sub is better than assa, pretty much all rogues are following this one direction without questioning. This is the biggest mistake a player can do. A S-Tier-Assa-Rogue outperforms a F-Tier-Sub-Rogue by far. Individual player skill matters.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbselle View Post
    Rogue is a disaster right now, especially pve wise. How can someone deny that?
    You are right, they are broken

    Killing players in a blink of an eye because of high burst. If anything they need a nerf (Together with Palaidn and Druid)

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Tumile View Post
    cuz that is not how you do statistics
    LOL are you serious? Based on logs is not how you do statistics when this is the only base? Tell me, how do you do statistics then?

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragnarohk View Post
    You are right, they are broken

    Killing players in a blink of an eye because of high burst. If anything they need a nerf (Together with Palaidn and Druid)
    This doesn't happen @ high rated arena. And if you're speaking from BG pov, that really doesnt count.

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