What is bloody wrong with people?

[burek]

What about people with low IO

It's not really relevant because even high rio doesn't get you invited. You have to pass the class test more than ever before.

[Penegal]

What about people with low IO, cause they simply run like 1-2 max M+ dungeons per week, if they are lucky to find a group (since they can't dedicate more time to it), and not because they are necessarily awful?

I can assure you, there is a plethora of such players in WoW. I work 5 / 7 (stock manager / staff director), have a lot of responsibilities IRL, have family, write a fantasy novel (atm 12/30 chapters done, already found a publisher), etc... If I find time to play several hours, its usually late in the night. I I'm super lucky and guild members can bother to take me along to some M 7-8-9, its great. If not, I'm getting denied with my ilvl 204 even for M+ 5-6 cause Im both Ret and have around 300 IO (since I've completed maybe 8-9 M runs entire SL).

How am I supposed to get better or even prove myself, if I'm not given any opportunity to begin with? Spec filtering also plays major role here, since pugs prefer 190 boomie or hunter to 204 Ret. And few guildmates who run higher keys, prefer meta classes and quick clearings. There are 7-8 people constantly running 12-13+ keys, but they don't really take others along.

I believe I'm not the only player having troubles like that, and yes, I partially blame R.IO for this trouble. Otherwise (if people would just check armory and ilvl in my case) I could at least get the spots I believe I deserve in some moderate level M+ runs, but IO is the reason I actually have a hard time to. Sorry, getting declined for, say, Tirna 5 with 204, when you overgear it by a mile, is pathetic.

First off, you might think you deserve a spot but from my perspective in the LFG, you don't deserve anything and I don't owe you anything. No one in this game or outside of it is entitled to anything from strangers.

Before I say anything else, I agree that a +5 can be timed with monkeys. You can literally take the first 2 dps, tank and healer in the LFG and you will time it unless someone decides to spam die and ninja pull the entire run.

If you don't have time, push your own key. Simple as that. You make your own group. Then you get to pick the people. However, I can assure you that after getting burned a few times by the same low rIO players you invite trying to be considerate, you will find out the hard way that rIO is correct 95% of the time, if not more. This isn't strictly relevant to, say a +5 but you get the point.

Also, yes, you can time a +5 or a +10 even even without any issue with your gear. That is true. People completed all 8 15s in week 1 in 190-200 gear. Gear is not the issue here. Experience is. If rIO shows a lack of experience I cannot be sure you have any idea what the mechanics are. What the priority on the targets is. What to interrupt when you have 2 abilities going off and only 1 kick. But guess what? Chances are the boomie does more DPS than a ret in lower gear, which in turn allows for faster clear time and more skipped mechanics. You automatically lose.

Pugs prefer "meta" classes because they increase the success rate at any given skill level. Yes, the boomie I invite might turn out to be retarded. However, on paper, comparing a boomkin to a ret paladin with the same IO score, similar iLvl and no other information, the boomie wins 100% of the time. It's just expected they'll do more damage than you with similar or even lower gear and they will also be more useful than you in nearly every other situation. They bring a CR, a root, a typhoon / vortex, a soothe, have stealth, regular ressurection, Innervate for the healer and Stampeding Roar.

And what does a ret bring? A 6 second stun, a regular 10 second ressurection and a BoP they can use to help out sometimes. You tell me who you would choose given the information I have given you and you only knowing both people's iLvl in the LFG tool. I bet you'd pick the boomkin, too.

If I know you and know you're a good or at least decent player I can time the dungeon with, you can bet your ass I'll invite you over a random boomkin with double your IO. However, if I don't and I have a pool of literally 50+ people to choose from, you're likely not making the cut.

If you want to practice and get better, push your own key. I know I'm repeating myself but this is the way to do it if you are an unwanted class / spec in pugs. It's nothing personal towards you. It's just everyone else wants to make it as easy as possible on themselves and minimize the risk of wasting their time.

My time is just as precious as yours. Just because you can't set aside enough time to play the game enough, be it due to RL or other reasons, I am not obligated to play with you. It is not my problem. I have absolutely no idea who you are. It's very presumptious of you to expect of me or any pug in the LFG to put their faith in a stranger without having any way to get an indicator of their skill or experience. More often than not, RIO is very accurate. Every chance I've taken on a low RIO player has made me regret it.

I'm well aware that there are good players with shit rio due to various reasons but that is not my problem - it's theirs.

The game is an MMORPG, if your real life does not allow for you to spend time in game doing the activities you want, you have a few options:
1. you either try your best to figure out a way to sneak in more time when possible
2. do different activities that do not require people
3. find players that are willing to play with you whenever you can be online
4. simply move on to games with a much more lax time requirement, such as FPS or a MOBA games.

I know it sounds harsh but no one in the game owes you anything. You may be the world's best ret paladin but to me you're a nobody in a pool of, quite literally, hundreds of people to choose from.

The sooner you drop that mentality and start doing your own key and taking matters into your own hands, the sooner you will begin to have fun with M+ and the game in general.

[munkeyinorbit]

I will actively whisper warlocks apps after denying them and say stop being trash and reroll hunter, boom or mage. Same thing to all warriors of any spec. report them for trolling

No you don't. You don't do anything of the sort. This is one of the weaker baits I've seen lately.

I think there's a lot of confusion in this thread. OP IS making their own group. He is just sick of having to do that. Comments of "make your own group" are not helpful and it shows you haven't even read what the OP is typed. OP is.doing all he can to get the achievement done. I think he's upset that it took ages because people won't take locks.

[Advo]

I will also add its deteriorated to the point where even 'make your own group' is becoming unviable, I have been making my own groups, and having people leave immediately after being invited because they do not want to run with locks.

[erifwodahs]

Don't blame Blizzard at all. Because in reality, it's the boosters who are to blame. People with high raider.io scores that have absolutely no idea how to play the game. But then there's people who expect high raider.io because they just want a carry. The entire pve community has become so toxic.

People with high rio are boosted and don't know how to play the game. Who are boosting them if people with high rio are boosted?!

I am aware of boosts, but if you think that people have that much gold to be boosted to high rio... It's over 1M gold for timed +15

[Gasparde]

You're an off meta class. That's literally it.

Fuck, I'm playing a Resto Sham that I intentionally only progress via PuGs because I'm stupid or some shit. 215 and 1250 r.io doesn't seem to be enough to get into groups atm. Like, you only have a timed 14 of the particular dungeon in question? No thanks. Sorry, we're only looking for 1350 big pumpers. So what usually ends up happening is that I get into groups of single DPs players after wasting 20 minutes trying to get into a semi-full group - and once I'm in that group it's just people spending 20 minutes forming groups, just literally fucking waiting for Jesus to show up on his 230 equipped 2.3k r.io Mage or MM or Moonkin to carry their asses through a fucking 15 Mists. And then the dungeon begins and their mentally challenged DH tank with their awesome 1.3k r.io score jumps into 5 packs, gets globalled, calls out the healer and leaves.

Same shit on my paladin. I have a 223 ilvl Pally tank with a 1120 r.io score. Absolutely no one is willing to take me to a 15. Bring a DH or go fuck off. I have absolutely never had that on any class. During all of BFA it didn't matter what class or spec I played as long as I had ilvl. I can distinctly remember playing Feral in m+ during the first weeks of BoD m+ - and no one fucking cared because I came in there with mythic Jaina gear in week 2 and swept the floor with absolutely everything. Nowadays? That's just no longer enough.

I'm all for making your own groups, pushing your own keys, playing with your guild and all that shit. But holy fuck is this community destroying itself over the most recent months. I have never seen meta fotm bitching as bad as it is right now. And I know it's probably because Blizzard keeps making these dungeons more and more stupidly hard to the point where a 220 tank still has to resort to kiting on a constant basis in a dungeon that drops 207 gear... so you kinda have to be a meta bitch if you're just not that good at the game... but holy fuck, the community standards are just absolutely absurd right now - and it's made worse by people not being able to up their ilvl at all to overcome these shitty dungeons because all you get past 210 is like 1 avg ilvl per week unless you're getting obscenely lucky... and guess what, people obviously only want to play with the obscenely lucky.

Basically, Blizzard shitting the bed with scaling and the reward structure and the community going more mental with every new season. Because, obviously, if Gingi isn't playing with a Warrior in his group then you just can't fucking bring a Warrior past +10. Obviously.

[ztkraptor]

- - - Updated - - -



I would call you toxic but I think you have other things going in your life would triumph any bad thing I could say for you. Hope it get better for you in the future!

You can call me toxic, but your class is useless. If a fact upsets you sorry bud.

[anon5123]

Just roll a tank/healer, never get turned down

[Jinpachi]

Make your own fucking group and quit bitching ffs. Nobody is obligated to choose you for their runs. Deal with it.

[ztkraptor]

You're not just toxic. You're genuinely stupid and quite possibly terrible at the game.

Yeah, can you tell me the reason why there isn't a warlock with a 2k IO score? Please explain this to me.
You are clueless.

[TheRevenantHero]

People with high rio are boosted and don't know how to play the game. Who are boosting them if people with high rio are boosted?!

I am aware of boosts, but if you think that people have that much gold to be boosted to high rio... It's over 1M gold for timed +15

I've seen a large handful of people with high raider.io but have absolutely no idea what they're doing. People absolutely have that much gold to burn. And then they destroy groups because they basically scam themselves into a non-boosted group and ruin everything.

[Jastall]

You're an off meta class. That's literally it.

Fuck, I'm playing a Resto Sham that I intentionally only progress via PuGs because I'm stupid or some shit. 215 and 1250 r.io doesn't seem to be enough to get into groups atm. Like, you only have a timed 14 of the particular dungeon in question? No thanks. Sorry, we're only looking for 1350 big pumpers. So what usually ends up happening is that I get into groups of single DPs players after wasting 20 minutes trying to get into a semi-full group - and once I'm in that group it's just people spending 20 minutes forming groups, just literally fucking waiting for Jesus to show up on his 230 equipped 2.3k r.io Mage or MM or Moonkin to carry their asses through a fucking 15 Mists. And then the dungeon begins and their mentally challenged DH tank with their awesome 1.3k r.io score jumps into 5 packs, gets globalled, calls out the healer and leaves.

Same shit on my paladin. I have a 223 ilvl Pally tank with a 1120 r.io score. Absolutely no one is willing to take me to a 15. Bring a DH or go fuck off. I have absolutely never had that on any class. During all of BFA it didn't matter what class or spec I played as long as I had ilvl. I can distinctly remember playing Feral in m+ during the first weeks of BoD m+ - and no one fucking cared because I came in there with mythic Jaina gear in week 2 and swept the floor with absolutely everything. Nowadays? That's just no longer enough.

I'm all for making your own groups, pushing your own keys, playing with your guild and all that shit. But holy fuck is this community destroying itself over the most recent months. I have never seen meta fotm bitching as bad as it is right now. And I know it's probably because Blizzard keeps making these dungeons more and more stupidly hard to the point where a 220 tank still has to resort to kiting on a constant basis in a dungeon that drops 207 gear... so you kinda have to be a meta bitch if you're just not that good at the game... but holy fuck, the community standards are just absolutely absurd right now - and it's made worse by people not being able to up their ilvl at all to overcome these shitty dungeons because all you get past 210 is like 1 avg ilvl per week unless you're getting obscenely lucky... and guess what, people obviously only want to play with the obscenely lucky.

Basically, Blizzard shitting the bed with scaling and the reward structure and the community going more mental with every new season. Because, obviously, if Gingi isn't playing with a Warrior in his group then you just can't fucking bring a Warrior past +10. Obviously.

It gets really bad, yeah. In my key range (10-12) I'm even starting to be wary of MM hunters and Boomkins that don't have really high IO and thus are good, because a lot of them are FOTM rerollers that want free keys and are terrible. Just did a +12 ToP that we failed because the MM hunter was pretty bad, facepulled twice and I out-DPSed him with my Fury warrior despite having worse gear. And he had the gall to say we didn't time because Fury is trash. This is exactly the kind of player I loathe. And good luck even getting good MMs/boomies in that key range when they're off getting free invites in +15.

If you ask me the dungeons, while more fun than BFA's, are just punishing this time around. The bosses especially can become one error = wipe affairs as early as +10 on Tyra (fuck the third boss in NW, seriously). Yeah, yeah, people who play this game for a living did their +15s at ilvl 200, whoopee doo, the game still shouldn't be designed around them for pete's sake, we mere mortals would like to have fun too.

I'm not usually one for nostalgia, but jeez the M+ meta during Legion was the best and never got anywhere near as toxic even if it wasn't perfect, and I'm convinced it's because it was overall quite a bit easier than the BFA/SL one.

[Thalrend]

Yeah, can you tell me the reason why there isn't a warlock with a 2k IO score? Please explain this to me.
You are clueless.

Considering you are obviously trolling, I should not try to even argue with you, but here it goes. There is 46 people above 2 k raider io atm. Or 46 characters. Even if there is a warlock here, it doesn't mean that the class is bad. People in this rio atm is %0.001 fucking game. There is a warlock at 1950 raider io, which is prolly doubles your rio score . Just because a class is performing as good in top %0.001 of the m plus content, it doesn't mean the class is thrash. At that level where there is quite literally 9 groups in whole fucking world, they will get every single small advantage they can possibly get because it becomes night impossible to time keys even with the smallest of the small mistakes.

Imagine non ironically comparing a class performance at +22 keys and saying class is thrash in general. Imagine being this toxic, ignorant and miserable of a human being.

- - - Updated - - -

Make your own fucking group and quit bitching ffs. Nobody is obligated to choose you for their runs. Deal with it.

Since you haven't read anything in this thread and just wanted to make the generic "MakE YoUr oWn GrOuP." response , I already did. I will say this like I am explaining it to a toddler so maybe you will understand it maybe this time.

I understand nobody has to invite anyone to any key.

I understand that you have to do your own keys most of the time because most of the people in this community just sheep that listen to their favorite streamers opinions and make their groups according to that, so non-meta classes gets fucked in the arse.

Having to make your own groups only and being able to find NO GROUPS AT ALL HOWEVER, is fucking annoying. This does not only happens in high keys, where shit actually matters, one can argue +15 this week is like +10 last week due how easy are the affixes. People do this behavior at +7+8 level. Heck people sometimes do this at +5 level since they are so fucking bad that anything that is not the best of the best is to much of a risk for them because they cannot even press their own buttons for the life of them.

This creates a shit environment where people despise each other even more in this community. So the pug community devolves to a bigger shitshow . At least thats my opinion, you don't have to agree with me, but I ain't going to stop "biching" because you got annoyed at reading a thread that you can choose to, I don't know, not read.

[Super Kami Dende]

I am typing this because I am genuinely about to break my keyboard with anger. 1310 rio Warlock here, Literally need 2 more dungeons to get +15 mount, grinded 12 hours per day since this reset if not more. Why? Because I didn't get a single dungeon invite this week. Zero. I applied more than 150 dungeons, not a single invite. What does the community require from you do get bloody invites? 1.3 K rio, 215 I lvl and how does everybody expecting to you to have more? I have been only doing my keys but at this point I just cannot stand going to some of the places for the 4th -5th bloody time.

So heres my question, what do you require from your pugs to invite them to your high m+ pluses?

Have you considering in those countless hours of applying to groups to just make your own?

[Thalrend]

Have you considering in those countless hours of applying to groups to just make your own?

After 20,492 replies to threads in mmo champ did you ever read what was written in the post that you are making a 300 iq snarky comment? Thats a lot of time of your life, one would expect basic reading comprehension skills by that time.

[Navenowsky93]

Dude, you are angry that you aren't getting invited enough as a warlock?

I'm playing ele shaman, people don't think we even exist

[Vilendor]

Yeah, as a feral getting invited then instant kicked from anything above 10+ (because they think im a boomy), i couldn't care less about you missing only 2 more instances with the current top dps class on the 6th week of the expansion

This is what we call #firstworldproblems

[Thalrend]

Yeah, as a feral getting invited then instant kicked from anything above 10+ (because they think im a boomy), i couldn't care less about you missing only 2 more instances with the current top dps class on the 6th week of the expansion

This is what we call #firstworldproblems

That is also fucked up. So you are okay that people asshole to certain classes/specs but towards your one? At least you get invited before you get kicked, just saying

[Vilendor]

That is also fucked up. So you are okay that people asshole to certain classes/specs but towards your one? At least you get invited before you get kicked, just saying

I'm used to it, feral is shit since 4 expansion. Also im doing my own keys and running m+ with my guildies who know i can perfectly pull my weight. Also, you need 2 more instances only, just saying

This whole topic sounds like some rich celeb kid getting arrested for the first time and thinks the world is over and everyone is after him. Meanwhile the rest of us at poverty line just laugh at him

[Thalrend]

I'm used to it, feral is shit since 4 expansion. Also im doing my own keys and running m+ with my guildies who know i can perfectly pull my weight. Also, you need 2 more instances only, just saying

This whole topic sounds like some rich celeb kid getting arrested for the first time and thinks the world is over and everyone is after him. Meanwhile the rest of us at poverty line just laugh at him

I think you miss the whole point. I did finished the dungeons in the end and got the achi. Its not that hard to make your own keys either. Here was the problem.

When you only need 2 dungeons or 1 dungeon god forbid, you will push keys continously in order to get the dungeon you want. 8 dungeons so getting the last dungeon is 1/7 chance. So lets say you are semi lucky and get it in every 5 pushes. That is roughly 4-5 hour of your life depending on the dungeon, depending how long it took form the group, flight time etc. This to have 1 attempt on that dungeon. You might time it in 1 go and be done with it, or you might not time it because of any reason, and need to do whole thing again. Lets say this time it took 8 keys to get there. Here you have another try. Tank dced. Oh well another 5 hours. I am not complaining that farming m plus is hard. Its not.

Getting specific keys however, is a totally different story. Thats is mind numbingly boring if you don't have any drops from the said dungeon in a realistic manner, and you are literally doing those runs in order to cycle the keys in order to get the 1 missing dungeon you have. I am not complaining over not getting invited most of the time. I am complaining because I didn't get invited to any key this week that is upwards +12, which is piss easy imo since the affixes are a big fucking joke this week.

Because of the community perception of your class, when you get no invites, a 30 min ordeal can turn to a fucking 12 hour ordeal because some brainlets somehow thinks a fire mage and a boomkin will solve all of their issues regardless of the situation. I think its a garbage situation be in, regardless if you are a druid/warlock/warrior/rogue or whatever the fucking class/spec combo that is not meta and have a stigma attached to it.