Talent: Damnation -- Should be a 15s CD not 45s

[Nyel]

Outside of bgs, you don't take void torrent for pvp lol. You take damnation. It's marginally lower damage than void torrent, yes, but it's also not interruptible like void torrent is. Damnation gives you an extra, free, DP ( as well as the other dots ofc) which is where most of your burst damage lies. And burst damage is what the current meta is all about, not consistent pressure over a few minutes.

Pretty sure Void Torrent has in most situations imaginable more burst than the DP you get from Damnation. Again, Void Torrent, even if not channeled completely, gives you a Devouring Plague on top of its own massive damage. Sure, if you get kicked right away, you wasted it, but you should prepare those situations. At cast it's 15, 1s 30, 2s 45 and 3s channel duration 60 insanity. One second channeling already gives you 30/50 insanity needed for a DP. Void Torrent deals twice the amount of DPs entire damage.

I just don't see why Damnation should be better for burst. Using Void Torrent when you're swarmed by enemies might be a bad idea, but against 1 or 2 you can take out with your CCs? Not sure.

[Ryzeth]

Pretty sure Void Torrent has in most situations imaginable more burst than the DP you get from Damnation. Again, Void Torrent, even if not channeled completely, gives you a Devouring Plague on top of its own massive damage. Sure, if you get kicked right away, you wasted it, but you should prepare those situations. At cast it's 15, 1s 30, 2s 45 and 3s channel duration 60 insanity. One second channeling already gives you 30/50 insanity needed for a DP. Void Torrent deals twice the amount of DPs entire damage.

I just don't see why Damnation should be better for burst. Using Void Torrent when you're swarmed by enemies might be a bad idea, but against 1 or 2 you can take out with your CCs? Not sure.

You should tell that to literally every high-rated spriest that takes Damnation every single time, and not Void Torrent. Keep in mind using Damnation will proc Unfurling Darkness if it's off CD. And not sure what you mean by 'gives you a devouring plague' - You need to channel VT for nearly the full duration, to get enough insanity from it for DP.
eta: Also, combined with Lasting Plague, VT does not do double the damage of DP.

[sourlol]

Pretty sure Void Torrent has in most situations imaginable more burst than the DP you get from Damnation. Again, Void Torrent, even if not channeled completely, gives you a Devouring Plague on top of its own massive damage. Sure, if you get kicked right away, you wasted it, but you should prepare those situations. At cast it's 15, 1s 30, 2s 45 and 3s channel duration 60 insanity. One second channeling already gives you 30/50 insanity needed for a DP. Void Torrent deals twice the amount of DPs entire damage.

I just don't see why Damnation should be better for burst. Using Void Torrent when you're swarmed by enemies might be a bad idea, but against 1 or 2 you can take out with your CCs? Not sure.

In what world world are you getting a 4 second channel off in pvp? It’s like one of the most visible spells in the game.

If you think Void torrent is better for pvp you don’t pvp

[Sixnalia]

You should tell that to literally every high-rated spriest that takes Damnation every single time, and not Void Torrent. Keep in mind using Damnation will proc Unfurling Darkness if it's off CD. And not sure what you mean by 'gives you a devouring plague' - You need to channel VT for nearly the full duration, to get enough insanity from it for DP.
eta: Also, combined with Lasting Plague, VT does not do double the damage of DP.

Maybe he is thinking of Beta void torrent when it was going through different iterations?
It used to apply DP/refresh your DoTs.

Which if that is the case. . . this person hasn't played Spriest in many months.

[Cracked]

I agree that it's very underpowered. Leave the CD but make the dots it applies do 2x damage or something.

[Cerbz]

I agree that it's very underpowered. Leave the CD but make the dots it applies do 2x damage or something.

This would be too powerful in PvP. You can already triple DP (sometimes quad DP with a conduit and some crazy RNG) a player alongside PI/VF which would be absurdly strong along with your proposed Damnation buff, especially with Lasting Plague.

I'm not sure why this thread exists. This is essentially a PvP talent and buffing it would be a bit overkill in PvP with how strong we are right now.

[Cracked]

This would be too powerful in PvP. You can already triple DP (sometimes quad DP with a conduit and some crazy RNG) a player alongside PI/VF which would be absurdly strong along with your proposed Damnation buff, especially with Lasting Plague.

I'm not sure why this thread exists. This is essentially a PvP talent and buffing it would be a bit overkill in PvP with how strong we are right now.

I think you underestimate the importance of Void Torrent in such a scenario. Losing it is a big deal.

[Sitoy]

I think you underestimate the importance of Void Torrent in such a scenario. Losing it is a big deal.

You don't pvp if you think void torrent is a better option.

Shadow priest is one of the most fun and best specs in pvp right now. Mainly due to mind games, but also because of our burst, cc and healing.

Doing void form, void bolt , mind games, damnation , void bolt together with an arena partner and a SWD and most targets are dead. Especially if your partner cc their healer/dps and you then follow up with silence and mind bomb, mind control even if needed. That whole burst is ruined if one run void torrent and gets interrupted or ccd.

Void torrent is nearly unplayable in pvp unless one are the master of juking interrupts before casting it, which is better to do before casting void form or mind games instead. We only have one school of magic damage and it's one of the easiest spells in the game to interrupt.

In pvp instant casts are king. Damnations cooldown syncs perfectly with mind games and our ccs, making every 45 second a kill window.

Decreasing the CD would be busted in pvp and we would just get nerfed.

[anon5123]

Same shit happened with that AoE shadow healing thing in Legion, where the talent was just so bad that there was no reason to ever take it, and yet it went unchanged throughout the whole expac.

.....is it still in? I wouldn't be surprised.

[Priestyboy]

Same shit happened with that AoE shadow healing thing in Legion, where the talent was just so bad that there was no reason to ever take it, and yet it went unchanged throughout the whole expac.

.....is it still in? I wouldn't be surprised.

Damnation is a good talent tho?

[anon5123]

Damnation is a good talent tho?

I'm not talking about Damnation.

I'm talking about Shadow Covenant, and it was pure garbage. IIRC it was an instant cast AoE heal that would hit 5 people, but then absorb the next X healing on them, and the absorb amount was larger than the heal amount. It was just a complete garbage talent that was never useful in any situation, and despite how utterly trash it was, it went completely unchanged throughout all of Legion.

[Priestyboy]

I'm not talking about Damnation.

I'm talking about Shadow Covenant, and it was pure garbage. IIRC it was an instant cast AoE heal that would hit 5 people, but then absorb the next X healing on them, and the absorb amount was larger than the heal amount. It was just a complete garbage talent that was never useful in any situation, and despite how utterly trash it was, it went completely unchanged throughout all of Legion.

yeah i know, there are bunch of talents that are useless in wow that should either get removed or changed. But i dont get what it has to do with this thread?

[damneddog]

I feel Damnation is fine as it is, well balanced. In PVP its the go to talent if you are against most melee comps, and we go Void Torrent only when we are fighting most range classes.

V.Torrent against melee will always get kicked, wasting your talent. Damnation is a very strong opener especially when you can bank in enough insanity for 3x devouring plagues, which is your highest 'burst' window and when you have locked someone out with the horror/silence combo + mind games, you are a serious pumper.

Against range, V.Torrent will be better, as you can still range dot up, and V.Torrent against players who are trying to LOS or run away from you. Always bait out a range interrupt with mind blast/mindgames first, then only V.Torrent. No point to V.torrent when you know windshear is ready to kick you at range.

Mindbender will not likely be used because of root/fear on it making it a wasted talent point in pvp. Hence Damnation is the safest talent to always gain value regardless of who you are fighting. The only thing is don't suck by casting it when grounding or spell reflect is up, or tab targeting and casting on a pet lol.

I know a lot of s.priest will also tell you go verse/haste in pvp. however I find that with so many instant casts in our burst window, going crit + Ancient Madness is legit strong! Not to mention we can always up our own haste via power infusion. if you have 50+% crit with ancient madness up, the dot damage + voidtorrent will chew up their hp in a jiffy.