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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    After doing some more PvE content, i must say that Outlaw damage is basically fine if not good. Yes, no burst and terrible RNG, but in the end it's fun to look at the damage meter and see that you're slowly and consistently climbing up and up the more the fight goes on. I've yet to master the opening and the spec overall, but i'm seeing consistent numbers now and it's decent to play.

    Still hate RtB though. I kinda like the animation and fantasy behind that but mechanic wise is just stupid imho.
    We're pretty competitive ST. Kinda sucks that Blizz wanted to "target cap" and then inconsistently shafted certain classes way more than others. In an M+ setting, we don't even beat other classes at our prime mob count - 5 mobs.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by ayako View Post
    We're pretty competitive ST. Kinda sucks that Blizz wanted to "target cap" and then inconsistently shafted certain classes way more than others. In an M+ setting, we don't even beat other classes at our prime mob count - 5 mobs.
    Yet i have to see where you really need more than 5 target aoe (blade rush is uncapped but that's it). I mean, there are the occasional big pulls in M+ when you have the pride buff, or the swarm of small mobs, but in the end we have a consistent and nearly constant 5 target automatic aoe that doesn't even need interaction other than a button press.

    Outlaw may fall behind other classes that have way bigger burst like Convoke or Combustion, but we're consistent as hell also thanks to Restless Blades that makes our CDs much much shorter. I'm fine with this at this point, we're bringing our weight and it's decently fun to play.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Yet i have to see where you really need more than 5 target aoe (blade rush is uncapped but that's it). I mean, there are the occasional big pulls in M+ when you have the pride buff, or the swarm of small mobs, but in the end we have a consistent and nearly constant 5 target automatic aoe that doesn't even need interaction other than a button press.
    Did you ever do the big pull right at the beginning of De Other Side with Lust (or other big pulls of which there are many, sometimes with Pride buff)? It's like 40-60 k burst for Mages/DKs/whatever and you're dealing like 10 to 15 k dps. Gets worse when the tank starts kiting the mobs. It results in you dealing 500 k damage and in other classes dealing 1.2 m. Overall it's not that bad (still we're mostly 3rd in DPS), but it's not nice to not be able to deal any significant damage in these situations. 'Might as well do nothing, let them fight ten seconds longer and have a bio break on this pull' is what you could be tempted to think :-). At the same time you're hammering your keyboard like crazy.

    Same on bosses. Have one or two other bursty classes (in the best case classes which greatly benefit from Lust) and you're starting to question if it was the Rogue class which you've played for the last decade. A complete lack of burst is a very underwhelming experience.

    If we can believe SimulationCraft, all three Rogue Specs are at the bottom of burst: http://simulationcraft.org/reports/T26_Raid.html (click on 'Click title for burst'). For Outlaw this is true, I think, for the other specs I don't know.

    What is nice, indeed, is the short cooldown of our abilities. Due to my DPS mates bursting on the pack before, we're sometimes damage-starved on a Pride afterwards. Here you can really help your group killing it quickly by using your cooldowns. Of course, we're talking about 5 to 8 k DPS here, which is nowhere near the burst of other classes, but at the same time these other classes only deal ~4 k DPS on this mob, because they've used all their abilities on the pack before.

    To show you an example, look at this: This is the first pull of De Other Side of a top group: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ge-done&pull=1
    The real burst takes place during ~14 secs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...7&end=93275038
    Last edited by Hofazius; Yesterday at 02:01 PM.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Hofazius View Post
    -snip-
    I agree, yet we still have our place. As i said, the current top m+ team has an outlaw rogue in it so we're definitely up there. Burst necessity is definitely there, and we're dead last on it.

    However, stuff like Shroud, aoe auto slow (via crippling+bf) and enrage dispel, and the consistent sustained damage makes us valuable. In lower keys like m10, since bosses and trash have lower hp, burst is more prominent. And absolutely needed for the big pulls you mentioned. But we're still there so this means our output+utility is still top notch while not being the best.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  5. #25
    Been rogue main forever but I'm not feeling it this expac. I think it's the covernant abilities. All the rogue ones are dead boring compared to other classes. The Kyrian one ended up feeling better than I thought it would but eh... Still nothing compared to other classes this expac which have a lot more going on under the hood

    And I dunno why you would want melee over ranged. A common theme in wow that is only getting worse as blizz make raids/dungeons more and more complex/dangerous with lots of movement
    Suri Cruise and Katie Holmes are SP's.

  6. #26
    Hofazius I agree 100% with what you said here. This generally what I get.

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