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  1. #141
    Immortal Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldgeezer View Post
    I'd like something completely and utterly alien. All of these zones look like they could be found on forgotten corner of Azeroth. Give me sentient wavefunctions existing on the surface of a neutron star.
    This. As much as I hate the Maw, I must admit that it is the only zone that looks vaguely similar to what I would expect from the literal hell of Warcraft. Bastion looks like an expanded HoV, I'm not particulary interested in either HD Plaguelands or HD Ashenvale/Moonglade, and Revendreth, while it actually looks cool, it still is too "Azerothian" for my taste.

    It's sad when even the zones from Outland, more than 12 years ago, look more alien, more novel than the freaking afterlife.
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    The Jailer's first ever appearance involved chucking him [Baine] off a cliff for being too shit to even qualify as a Maw trash mob.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Yes, but people would say "his castle" not "the castle." Which was my actual argument. They do not reference the Maw as The Jailer's domain, the Maw is always just referred to as the Maw. Why wouldn't they reference directly the Jailer always ruled the Maw? Or that it was his domain.

    The Primus also describes the Maw when Zoval was bound as already "inescapable." You don't really need a Jailer if people can't escape already. And just because he held the title of The Jailer before he was imprisoned doesn't mean he ruled the Maw. The Maw isn't the only realm where jails are seen. They are also in Revendreth and implied in the other realms. So, the Maw being jail doesn't have to be true.

    My argument on the Jailer having ruled another plain is because they use ambiguous language where it can be read one way or another. There are implications the Jailer didn't rule over the Maw just as there are implications he did. When we deal with the Primus, The Archon, The Winter Queen, and The Sire they all have unambiguous language when referring to their realms. And given that we know there are infinite afterlives, the idea that the Jailer ruled another one is not out of the question.
    They never said they couldn't escape it. The way these leaders act they never seem to specifically allude to what they can or cannot do. I was just discussing how the Winter Queen seems like a really crappy leader as she's letting the drust screw up her domain and then is just fairly easily dealing with them when she engages, but then I thought maybe she's trying to conserve etc or not let on to her power so it disrupts planning. Souls cannot escape the maw except for us for some reason or those we lead away. They never said the pantheon cannot freely traverse it nor have they directly implied they cannot except for Zoval who was "imprisoned" there. They don't really need to say that term when it's the only place souls cannot leave as any other soul is said to be "sent" to the maw. Big difference. I could be wrong and would be willing to accept it later, but everything points to that being what he was responsible for back before the uprising as it currently stands.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    This. As much as I hate the Maw, I must admit that it is the only zone that looks vaguely similar to what I would expect from the literal hell of Warcraft. Bastion looks like an expanded HoV, I'm not particulary interested in either HD Plaguelands or HD Ashenvale/Moonglade, and Revendreth, while it actually looks cool, it still is too "Azerothian" for my taste.

    It's sad when even the zones from Outland, more than 12 years ago, look more alien, more novel than the freaking afterlife.
    Why does the afterlife need to look alien? Hell I mean a lot of human afterlife concepts in religion often replicate human life except for their hells.

  3. #143
    Somehwere like the Ferengi Divine Treasury from Start Trek. A place made of precious metals and jewels, filled with greedy little hoarders.

    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Divine_Treasury

  4. #144
    Immortal Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    a lot of human afterlife concepts in religion often replicate human life except for their hells.
    And that's what makes RL religion terribly boring from a narrative pov. They had absolute freedom to go with completely novel, bizarre stuff when it came to visuals, and they took the most boring approach you could think of. Especially after three or four xpacs of vanilla (not the game) vistas, neat as they may have been.
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    The Jailer's first ever appearance involved chucking him [Baine] off a cliff for being too shit to even qualify as a Maw trash mob.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    And that's what makes RL religion terribly boring from a narrative pov. They had absolute freedom to go with completely novel, bizarre stuff when it came to visuals, and they took the most boring approach you could think of. Especially after three or four xpacs of vanilla (not the game) vistas, neat as they may have been.
    I mean honestly I think what you're thinking is more from a game/story point of view whereas a lot of humans would rather have something closer to what they know or even more so something better than what they know and the "bad" afterlife be the alien unknown. Granted WoW deviates from this in terms of the fact that their afterlives are different from human religion in that they mean to change you to the afterlife versus the afterlife changing to you. There's also Blizzard catching themselves in the stupid throw away lore that there are infinite other realms and the ones we see are just the governing bodies which makes it more appropriate they match a set ideal.

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    there is just fucking vrykuls there, there is no other warriors besides you, i want to see real vanlhala, not golden vrykul bullshit
    There were supposed to be famous Warriors in the class order hall but, it was cut.

    Besides, isn't valhalla for nordic people?
    Last edited by Unbelievable; Yesterday at 10:17 AM.

  7. #147
    Titan Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unbelievable View Post
    There were supposed to be famous Warriors in the class order hall but, it was cut.

    Besides, isn't valhalla for nordic people?
    i know it was, thats why im saying halls of valor was underwhelming and was, in the end, just golden vrykul shenanigans.

    yes, valhalla is for nordic people, but that does not mean they can't take elements from it and use to englobe all races/individuals who lived a honourable/warrior-ish life.

    less gold the better too.

  8. #148
    Scarab Lord Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    They never said they couldn't escape it. The way these leaders act they never seem to specifically allude to what they can or cannot do. I was just discussing how the Winter Queen seems like a really crappy leader as she's letting the drust screw up her domain and then is just fairly easily dealing with them when she engages, but then I thought maybe she's trying to conserve etc or not let on to her power so it disrupts planning. Souls cannot escape the maw except for us for some reason or those we lead away. They never said the pantheon cannot freely traverse it nor have they directly implied they cannot except for Zoval who was "imprisoned" there. They don't really need to say that term when it's the only place souls cannot leave as any other soul is said to be "sent" to the maw. Big difference. I could be wrong and would be willing to accept it later, but everything points to that being what he was responsible for back before the uprising as it currently stands.
    Except not everything does point to it. That is only how you personally view the evidence. I don't feel it points to Zoval being in charge of the Maw.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Except not everything does point to it. That is only how you personally view the evidence. I don't feel it points to Zoval being in charge of the Maw.
    You can "not feel" like it does, but that doesn't mean you have evidence that isn't trumped by other evidence.

  10. #150
    Warchief Bwonsamdi the Dead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatgunn View Post
    Somehwere like the Ferengi Divine Treasury from Start Trek. A place made of precious metals and jewels, filled with greedy little hoarders.

    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Divine_Treasury
    Soo... a Goblin Afterlife?
    I see dead people.... Yes, kinda my ting, ya know

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Bwonsamdi the Dead View Post
    Soo... a Goblin Afterlife?
    Yeah, it'd mostly be Goblins, Ethereals, Grummles, maybe a few dragons.

  12. #152
    Scarab Lord Darththeo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    You can "not feel" like it does, but that doesn't mean you have evidence that isn't trumped by other evidence.
    There is no evidence that trumps it without assuming your view is correct in the first place.

    Stop pretending otherwise.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  13. #153
    Dreadlord Pakheth's Avatar
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    An afterlife for the Tauren races with endless plains, mountains and tundras.

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