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  1. #21
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    It seems like you are really fishing for criticisms and excuses to be outraged and aren't very interested in discussing my ideas so I'm going to disengage.
    I'm literally discussing your idea. I'm not "fishing" for anything. What I pointed out is a flaw in your ideas, and instead of trying to improve what you got by listening to the criticism and suggestions, you're instead just trying to dismiss me.

    By your same logic, I can claim that you're just fishing for praise and compliments and aren't very interested in actually discussing your ideas. Because the moment someone points out a flaw instead of complimenting you, you attack and dismiss them.

    By the way, though: I question your claim that you have a background in game design, considering the flaw I pointed out in your idea. There are other flaws, mind you, but I just decided to discuss that one.
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    So your "solution" is just to remove a bunch of stuff you dont like, with a few minor tweaks to existing systems...An interesting perspective....
    Sure sounds like he has experience in game design doesn't it?

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    If that's all you expected then why even make this thread?
    Its the norm on mmo-champion to get shut down instantly, but people can still write things if they find it fun obviously.

    I understand op comment very well.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    I had fun writing it.
    Oo there you go.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I'm literally discussing your idea. I'm not "fishing" for anything. What I pointed out is a flaw in your ideas, and instead of trying to improve what you got by listening to the criticism and suggestions, you're instead just trying to dismiss me.

    By your same logic, I can claim that you're just fishing for praise and compliments and aren't very interested in actually discussing your ideas. Because the moment someone points out a flaw instead of complimenting you, you attack and dismiss them.

    By the way, though: I question your claim that you have a background in game design, considering the flaw I pointed out in your idea. There are other flaws, mind you, but I just decided to discuss that one.
    Except I provided a detailed response to someone who had constructive criticism for me, but as demonstrated in your increasingly hostile and accusatory tone, you are clearly interested in whatever satisfaction acting like this gives you and not with the topic at hand. Bye.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  5. #25
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    your increasingly hostile and accusatory tone,
    Projection. I never once was hostile and accusatory. Whereas you:
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    It seems like you are really fishing for criticisms and excuses to be outraged and aren't very interested in discussing my ideas
    Were quite "hostile and accusatory" there.

    not with the topic at hand. Bye.
    I am literally trying to engage with the topic at hand, and you refuse to engage.
    I did a Necromancer thing. Check it out! All feedback welcome!
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Projection. I never once was hostile and accusatory. Whereas you:

    Were quite "hostile and accusatory" there.


    I am literally trying to engage with the topic at hand, and you refuse to engage.
    Because your version of "engaging" is to make me play a game of whack a mole where you take the most absurd reinterpretation of everything I say and then make me defend that strawman, then move onto the next one after I address it. It's a waste of my time, and you are not entitled to my time.

    Ask yourself why I took the time to respond in detail to the other person that provided criticism and even thanked them. Because they engaged like a normal person that wants to have a conversation, not some incredibly hostile and aggressive weirdo that throws strawmen at me like this is a deranged middle school debate club. No thanks.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    No, I'm saying the crafter should be taught to make the legendaries and the recipient should provide the memory.
    But that's effectively how the system works right now. You're just making the system more complicated for no real benefit.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    But that's effectively how the system works right now. You're just making the system more complicated for no real benefit.
    Well, I think it's already more complicated than it needs to me. These effects are actually fairly boring for the most part and should just be set or even plain item bonus on nice pieces of gear you get doing content. I'm trying to engage with the idea that these systems will exist in some form. In my ideal world, this whole legendary system doesn't even exist.

    What I am saying is that professions feel very weird when there's a huge "crafting" feature of the expansion that ultimately has very little to do with crafters. I think being the player that knows how to make the legendaries would be a fun feeling for players who like crafting. Learning those recipes would be fun. Making it a form of content for professions would be fun.

    Would it introduce more friction? Obviously, but friction can be positive and is often a worthwhile cost for some features.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  9. #29
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    Because your version of "engaging" is to make me play a game of whack a mole where you take the most absurd reinterpretation of everything I say and then make me defend that strawman, then move onto the next one after I address it. It's a waste of my time, and you are not entitled to my time.
    It's not a strawman. It's literally what you wrote: "legendary should not be sold in the auction house", and I pointed out that the auction house is the fastest way to procure a legendary, since it eliminates the need to be spamming trade chat looking for someone with the specific ranking of the specific armor piece that you need.
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  10. #30
    I am Murloc! A Chozo's Avatar
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    lmao op just wants to rollback the game into the stone age of tBC / WotLK

    forget it dude, Shadowlands is awesome, leave the past at the past.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by A Chozo View Post
    lmao op just wants to rollback the game into the stone age of tBC / WotLK

    forget it dude, Shadowlands is awesome, leave the past at the past.
    Yes, the past.... when they had... guild halls... and uh... renown.... what?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    It's not a strawman. It's literally what you wrote: "legendary should not be sold in the auction house", and I pointed out that the auction house is the fastest way to procure a legendary, since it eliminates the need to be spamming trade chat looking for someone with the specific ranking of the specific armor piece that you need.
    One more time and then I'm done: My description is intentionally a bit vague, because I obviously don't think "Take it exactly how it is but have players make it" is a good solution, but I also don't want to spend 3 hours addressing every little bit of the system when my point is broadly "Players should be crafting these in a more substantive way". What is unreasonable is to then take that vagueness, and just start popping in whatever deranged ideas you can think might fit there and expect me to address it. I made it abundantly clear that I am not hung up on very small details here, so coming in and berating me with made-up small details, demanding I address them, levying personal attacks, and then getting angry when I don't want to waste my time on you is absurd.

    You could just say "In this system, would the items still have ranks, because that might create a lot of friction with finding the right person to craft it."

    I would have responded "That's a really good point, maybe the legendaries should be automatically ilvl capped."

    That's what the normal human being version of this conversation looks like, rather than this aggressive, apoplectic nonsense you threw at me was.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    If that's all you expected then why even make this thread?
    This is a man who enjoys torture and self flagellation. If everyone agreed with him, it would make his search for sexual satisfaction difficult.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    That's all I have right now. Proceed to flame me and tell me I don't know what I am talking about. I expect nothing less.
    Haha genuine laugh from that last part, thanks.

    I have not played enough of SL to comment on the rest but the Covenant Class abilities are mostly very disappointing.
    I look at a fun ability like DK get from Necrolords (Abomination Limb) and then compare it to the utter boring bland bullcr*p that for example Mages get from all covenants.
    The design effort is nowhere near equal, some specs or even entire classes have just god awful boring covenant abilities that often are also impractical and annoying to use.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksej89 View Post
    Haha genuine laugh from that last part, thanks.

    I have not played enough of SL to comment on the rest but the Covenant Class abilities are mostly very disappointing.
    I look at a fun ability like DK get from Necrolords (Abomination Limb) and then compare it to the utter boring bland bullcr*p that for example Mages get from all covenants.
    The design effort is nowhere near equal, some specs or even entire classes have just god awful boring covenant abilities that often are also impractical and annoying to use.
    Yeah, with my Warlock is was odd because the Venthyr ability is cool (AOE CURSES ON EVERYONE) but not very powerful in practice, while the necrolord one is pretty powerful but boring (pewpew bolt on 45 second cooldown).
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    snip
    Absolutely horrid take on the expansion. Thanks, i guess?

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Absolutely horrid take on the expansion. Thanks, i guess?
    You're welcome!
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
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  17. #37
    Banned FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djuntas View Post
    Ah yes, the typical argument, just because somebody dislike parts of something they should just not partake in any way. OP has some ideas thats kinda broad, but its still some things to consider - Not like SL is perfect judging from other threads made last few weeks...
    You have a bad train of thought.

    If someone hates a fundamental part of the game, and wants it changed to something entirely different. It is a legit point to tell them "then go play another game" because no most players do not want fundamental changes to the game they love, not should blizz do such for an extreme minority.

    "Hey just make it so you don't require tanks and healers in dungeons and raids" yeah then it's an entirely different game go play that.


    If someone said "I want you to change all the classes so you can swap between them at will, also make the graphics super realistic, oh and change the Warcraft story into something way better like the final fantasy universe!"

    And someone said "just go play final fantasy 14" would you disagree? Nah cause that's dumb.
    "You should change wow into a real time strategy game!"
    So just go play warcraft....
    "No but I want WOW to become an rts in the next expansion"

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    The problem to your "solution" is that whoever doesn't have jewelcrafting, tailoring, leatherworking or blacksmithing as their profession, will end up without legendaries. So, basically, unlearn alchemy, inscription, engineering and enchanting and learn one of the first four.

    You replaced a minor issue with a major issue.
    Man... This just makes me angy....

    Engineer is not only the only armor crafting profession that can't make a legendary.
    It is also the only profession in shadowlands that does not contribute at all to crafting a legendary, meaning it is 100% disconnected from the legendary market.

    Really if this change did happen, nothing would really change for engineering. It is already as good as dead, prob preparing to remove it for when they are tinker class. Just like they did with first aid and demonology.

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