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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Orwell7 View Post
    Wait-wait-wait - you are comparing things in a vacuum.

    In SL, we are talking about the GENERAL loot scarcity in PvE.
    You are talking about "drop rates".

    1; drop rates were higher in wotlk
    2; the best gear in wotlk (277) was awarded only in ICC25 hc. In SL this is 226 in Mythic CN.
    The best pvp gear in wotlk was 270.
    ICC10HC AND ICC25 normal dropped 264. So the best pvp gear was in-between. The AMOUNT of loot for 264 was dramatically higher than right now.

    For comparison, 264 in ICC is 213 in Heroic CN.

    Now, where could you get 264+ in wotlk?
    -ICC25 hc
    -ICC25 normal
    -ICC10 hc
    -the pvp world boss
    -pvp
    AND YOU HAD EMBLEMS. From "hard" content like ICC 5-mans, ICC10-25, daily heroic, etc.
    Emblem of Frost got you 264 gear ON TOP of standard loot drops. Usually 1 targeted item per week from these.


    Where can you get 213 now?
    -PvP
    -Heroic CN
    -Mythic CN
    -1 item per week in the Great Vault

    Also ICC10-HC dropped 3 items for 10 people.
    Imagine going in Heroic CN and getting 3 items per 10 people...

    So, more loot sources which were ALSO more rewarding (and interesting, remember, ICC25 and ICC10 had different loot tables!)

    You bought 1 item a week with emblems of frost?

    Items costed 60-90 badges and you only got them from the daily heroic (2) and ICC bosses so how does that work?

    ICC 10 dropped 2 items.

    1 item per week from mythic+, which covers all slots (something emblems of frost didn’t come close to doing, nor did the world boss) is a much faster pace. And mythic+ only takes a +7 to reach that level, and can go to a weekly 226 (277 ICC equivalent) item every single week.

    Also in Wrath the PvP gear had a wasted stat with resilience, which made it worse than PvE gear despite the same item level since an entire stat was missing. In SL it doesn’t do that.
    Last edited by Argorwal; 2021-01-28 at 10:39 PM.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by ryjkur View Post
    I mean the point is if top guilds could clear HC before any nerfs with 187 ilvl and my more casual guild with 197 ilvl it's not about the gear. 207 ilvl which is +20 ilvl more (which is HUGE) than first guilds had is easily obtainable, so my point was the gear is not an issue.
    So you honestly think this thread was created by someone who is running with a top 500 raid? Like seriously?

    You comments are completely irrelevant and unhelpful in this thread. Gear is an issue for the OP because their raid is not at the same skill level. It's like an NBA player telling you that you should make millions of dollars playing basketball because it's easy and then justifying that bad advice by pointing to the fact that the top players are even better than they are and it's really easy for them. Just totally illogical.

    Nobody ever said it was impossible at a given ilvl. They said that for them the gear and lack up upgrades was a wall.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Does everyone deserve heroic raid loot? You are only skilled enough to be 5/10. Practice and get more skill / attempts in and you'll progress farther. Or slowly wait for the gear drip to push you farther
    a) That has nothing to do with anything I was saying.

    b) There has been a change due to gearing being harder, especially for non-top players. Contrary to your assumptions, I don't personally have a problem with it. But I can understand how the change can be negative for some and I don't think the "git gud" advice from top 500 mythic raiders is helpful.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Trend View Post
    So you honestly think this thread was created by someone who is running with a top 500 raid? Like seriously?

    You comments are completely irrelevant and unhelpful in this thread. Gear is an issue for the OP because their raid is not at the same skill level. It's like an NBA player telling you that you should make millions of dollars playing basketball because it's easy and then justifying that bad advice by pointing to the fact that the top players are even better than they are and it's really easy for them. Just totally illogical.

    Nobody ever said it was impossible at a given ilvl. They said that for them the gear and lack up upgrades was a wall.

    - - - Updated - - -



    a) That has nothing to do with anything I was saying.

    b) There has been a change due to gearing being harder, especially for non-top players. Contrary to your assumptions, I don't personally have a problem with it. But I can understand how the change can be negative for some and I don't think the "git gud" advice from top 500 mythic raiders is helpful.
    Dudes crying that they get less loot cause they can't full clear. You start talking about how not everyone is the same skill level. I am asking if everyone is entitled to heroic loot, regardless of skill level.

  4. #64
    Well they can bring back tokens. You have to be a major blizzard shill to look at it negatively anyway. Not like it affects anyone negatively.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Dudes crying that they get less loot cause they can't full clear. You start talking about how not everyone is the same skill level. I am asking if everyone is entitled to heroic loot, regardless of skill level.
    Of course not. Nobody said that ever.

    And I'm sorry you couldn't follow the conversation to understand the exchange. It's tough.
    Last edited by Trend; 2021-02-05 at 10:23 PM.

  6. #66
    Stood in the Fire Mightytasty's Avatar
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    Feb 2019
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    Blizzard still hasn’t figured out how to balance M+ loot with weekly raid loot? Shocker

  7. #67
    Warchief Rusken's Avatar
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    If you're outgearing normal and stuck at 5/10 Heroic, you should probably just quit because holy shit you're bad.

  8. #68
    Brewmaster czarek's Avatar
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    If u outgeared normal just jump into m+. Complete 10+ x4 per week to get more choice. +14 gives 226ilvl pick. All of you gear up a bit and u can easly finish hc. And tbh hc should be finished with 200-210 overal.

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