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  1. #1

    The STAR TREK Superthread

    Thought this would be useful here as it spans many media. While we can continue to have separate topics that focus on one particular show or movie, there is so much to discuss on all aspects of start trek that don't necessary fit in one corner.


    Quibbles you ahve with the show e.g. if transports dematerialise and materialise you filtering known pathogens, why isn't htis one of hte most effective mehthods of healing people and why can't you be reconstitutted into anything you want to be since it's a matter of resequences.

    Debats about who is best - for example, which star trek crew probably did the most impressive things.. was it Kirk's who's experiences form the backdrop for most of hte universes extended lore, or was Janeway's crew the most badass.. they did actually break the Warp 10 barrier, defeated the borg and made more first contact situations than any other crew


    What would you like for the future of star trek too and comments about how they did the shows.. did anyone notice how lame and boring most of the pictures of civilziation cities actually looked? Gosh what I would do to have some fancy looking futuristic city like the one in the star trek JJ movies, that star base city or something like Star Wars' Coruscant or the SWTOR game's hope cinematic of one of the Alderaan cities - now that stuff looks futuristic. It is just a picture, so they don't need to worry about doing expensive shots in there. Although Strange New worlds could be the chance they get to show more planet side action and alien civilizations.. rather than everywhere looking like 19th and 20th century countryside earth.

    There is so much to discuss on a whole range of things.. so ask away.

  2. #2
    90s tech and tv budgets

  3. #3
    I want future star trek to just be star trek. Mostly episodic stories of the week with threads that weave though a season with a few episodes and then some of those threads flow into other seasons from time to time. Not a 10 hour movie that just has a pair of scissors snip the film 9 or 10 times so you end up with 2-3 shows at the start of the season that have a lot of story and plot, then 6-8 shows in the middle that are just "wait until next week" episodes, and then finally 2-3 shows at the end of the season that pick up the plot and story again.

  4. #4
    Titan Val the Moofia Boss's Avatar
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    TOS was good. TNG starting with season 3 was great. DS9 was fine at the start and got better and better and became great. After DS9, the franchise goes downhill and never recovers. Everything after ENT never happened.

  5. #5
    TNG and DS9 were undoubtedly the peak. Some nice moments in VOY and ENT but overall they were disappointing. PIC looked promising but veered off course. DIS to me feels like some other SF show entirely, not Star Trek.

  6. #6
    Next generation is still the best star trek media imo, good old picard. New picard serie i only watched a couple episodes didnt catch me at all, will perhaps give it another go later on.
    Do you hear the voices too?

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by ParanoiD84 View Post
    Next generation is still the best star trek media imo, good old picard. New picard serie i only watched a couple episodes didnt catch me at all, will perhaps give it another go later on.
    I've been watching all of them again.. I'm currently on enterprise, then will do Discovery season 1 and 2 then STO, really enjoyed them all. TNG was the most engaging, I must admit, but DS9 was excllent for havin a major theme, and pulling it off quite well, thoroughly enjoyed. Voyager, had some really dull moments, but it also had some of the brightest moments too, above TNG.

    I also watched the films, in the order.. e.g. i watched Nemesis after I finished Voyager season 7, noticed Janeway got promoted to Admiral before Picard, I was like wha...? but then, Janeway achieves more than Picard does.. in the smae period - breaking the warp 10 barrier, defeating the Borg, not to mention all that delta quadrant data.

    Can't wait to get to STO.. I should have started with that, but I started with TNG instead and then looped back. I should probably watch Picard too again, but it was a year ago.

  8. #8
    I think a time jump like they did in Discovery was a good idea. Production teams and writers have changed. Its a good way to have a breath of fresh air instead of relying on the status quo established by TNG and DS9.

    I just wish the future era was well written.

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    I think a time jump like they did in Discovery was a good idea. Production teams and writers have changed. Its a good way to have a breath of fresh air instead of relying on the status quo established by TNG and DS9.

    I just wish the future era was well written.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Myradin View Post
    I think a time jump like they did in Discovery was a good idea. Production teams and writers have changed. Its a good way to have a breath of fresh air instead of relying on the status quo established by TNG and DS9.

    I just wish the future era was well written.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I think a time jump like they did in Discovery was a good idea. Production teams and writers have changed. Its a good way to have a breath of fresh air instead of relying on the status quo established by TNG and DS9.

    I just wish the future era was well written.
    Agreed. Although I would support Picard too.. I really want to know what became of Sisko, Jake, Nog, Rom, Oddo, Kira, and see some of those again. I also want to see what happened to the voyager crew, I know Picard has the odd character from everyone, but it could be a show that explores that near future.

    I very much like that Discovery jumped to the 32nd century (or was it the 31st?), love that good choice.

    however I'm still a bit disappointed with some of the worlds. Trill for example, I thought we'd see something a lot more futuristic looking - what is it with star trek and not doing futuristic type cityscapes on planets? the movies did a good job though

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post

    What would you like for the future of star trek too and comments about how they did the shows.. did anyone notice how lame and boring most of the pictures of civilziation cities actually looked? Gosh what I would do to have some fancy looking futuristic city like the one in the star trek JJ movies, that star base city or something like Star Wars' Coruscant or the SWTOR game's hope cinematic of one of the Alderaan cities - now that stuff looks futuristic. It is just a picture, so they don't need to worry about doing expensive shots in there. Although Strange New worlds could be the chance they get to show more planet side action and alien civilizations.. rather than everywhere looking like 19th and 20th century countryside earth.

    There is so much to discuss on a whole range of things.. so ask away.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post

    I very much like that Discovery jumped to the 32nd century (or was it the 31st?), love that good choice.

    however I'm still a bit disappointed with some of the worlds. Trill for example, I thought we'd see something a lot more futuristic looking - what is it with star trek and not doing futuristic type cityscapes on planets? the movies did a good job though
    You should watch Lower Decks, although it's a bit of a piss take, they really do get creative with the planets they go to, they look alien, and futuristic too - in ways the live shows never bother to do. If strange new worlds could make the effort in showing these things, and could add that to a great set of stories, it would be the amazing.
    Valewalker Farodin: "Magic has long been a vice of the elves. It shaped us, and lifted us out of the darkness - but without balance, it also threatens to unmake us."

    My long replies often repeat info to make sure: You get all the info I have, It is clear and complete, in case you didn't actually read the first one. New readers have context at hand and are reminded of the point

  11. #11
    I wasn't much of a fan of the Kelvin movies for the longest time, then recently rewatched them and have developed a fondness for them. I just wasn't ready for Trek different than what I was used to but now that I'm over that I can very much enjoy them. They're a worthy addition to the franchise, just a shame they won't be continued.

    I also missed out on the latter half of DS9 and all of Enterprise, I need to rectify that soon.
    Shut your goddamn mouth, Gene!

  12. #12
    So in Star Trek First contact when the federation was fighting the borg cube. Worf decided to make a suicide run on the cube when he ran out of torpedos. However the Defiant's nose is an armed launchable warhead. So why didn't he use that? I understand that they lose their navigational deflector when they launch it but if he was already willing to make a suicide run on the cube you'd think he would've used the warhead first.
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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by the game View Post
    So in Star Trek First contact when the federation was fighting the borg cube. Worf decided to make a suicide run on the cube when he ran out of torpedos. However the Defiant's nose is an armed launchable warhead. So why didn't he use that? I understand that they lose their navigational deflector when they launch it but if he was already willing to make a suicide run on the cube you'd think he would've used the warhead first.
    Because an entire ship is better armored than just a warhead. And the ship was essentially adrift, better to sneak in for the kill. Also, as stated in another thread.. He is Klingon. Klingon's are always ready to die.
    "When you build it, you love it!"

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post

    I also missed out on the latter half of DS9 and all of Enterprise, I need to rectify that soon.
    Well worth the watch, especially DS9.

    going through neterprise now, i'ts more boring, I have to admit, but still entertaining... especially if you have followed the universe so far, to see how vulcans and humans were at the beginning.. I had no idea.

    THey viewed the Vulcans as holding them back for 100 years... telling them they weren't ready - i can just imagine this is how hwow high elves were to humans.. I remember Ravenmon writing something about how the ngihte lves should be to the humans, like over bearing parents, and rather than be impressed with their skills and knowledge, humans are generally irritated because of the attitude, condescension and too fast to step in and hand hold, like they would their own young. It's the sort of thing you would expect from a much longer lived species that's helping out a young one they hold a measure of affection towards.

    Love the little nuances too, for example T'pol reacting to the "smells" aboard enterprise, interacting with humans.. she pulls the stuffy bitch role off so well, although to be fair, it doesn't take much acting to do what she has to do.


    I am still on Season 1, so still watching.. had no idea, that the Andorians and Vulcans were once at each other too.. because by the time ofTNG, they're all part of the federation.

    Star Trek overall is really cheap isn't it, the only fancy thing is the ships, and even they aren't that fancy. They made no effort to show truly alien wordls and advanced civilization, much of the stuff looks like a glorified version of 10th century American cities.


    The JJ Abrams movies are the first time star trek showed advanced looking sci fi cities .. @ravenmoon Lower Decks you're right, it does actually show a lot more aline looking things.. and Discovery actually has a few really advanced looking things on the planets you meet, their ship and space fights look much better too, a lot more sci-fi.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post
    The JJ Abrams movies are the first time star trek showed advanced looking sci fi cities .. @ravenmoon Lower Decks you're right, it does actually show a lot more aline looking things.. and Discovery actually has a few really advanced looking things on the planets you meet, their ship and space fights look much better too, a lot more sci-fi.
    Star Trek can look amazing if they worked on those alien cultures, planets, and even future earth.

    Star trek is low budget, or rather was low budget..


    I wonder how much it will cost to do proper sets for some worlds, and cities? I wonder how expensive it was to do Coruscant on Star Wars, and Naboo was amazing - and those were the more human worlds. you did get some alien ones in the animations.. the a cartoon network Clone Wars saw Munilist's main city - the banking clan, it looked pretty cool. We also saw Mandalore.
    Valewalker Farodin: "Magic has long been a vice of the elves. It shaped us, and lifted us out of the darkness - but without balance, it also threatens to unmake us."

    My long replies often repeat info to make sure: You get all the info I have, It is clear and complete, in case you didn't actually read the first one. New readers have context at hand and are reminded of the point

  16. #16
    Going from DS9 to Voyager is like winning the lottery and then immediately being murdered by a jealous family member.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Dakhath View Post
    Going from DS9 to Voyager is like winning the lottery and then immediately being murdered by a jealous family member.
    Then ENT must be being kept on life support for 20 more years, unable to respond to the outside world, yet being aware of it all.

    I kid, I kid. ENT had its moments, voyager too. Voyager had many episodes that started off with a lot of potential and then got flushed down the toilet by the second commercial break.

    One I remember well was the holograms the Hirogen had created, made self aware and to feel pain. They escaped and Voyager ran across them. Was looking to be an interesting moral dilemma episode on what to do. Protect new life? Get a lesson on the good points of the prime directive? Maybe the doctor has to make a tough character decision. Then halfway through the hologram leader is just crazy and you get a predictable everyone works together and the bad guy loses episode.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by SavoirFaire View Post
    Then ENT must be being kept on life support for 20 more years, unable to respond to the outside world, yet being aware of it all.

    I kid, I kid. ENT had its moments, voyager too. Voyager had many episodes that started off with a lot of potential and then got flushed down the toilet by the second commercial break.

    One I remember well was the holograms the Hirogen had created, made self aware and to feel pain. They escaped and Voyager ran across them. Was looking to be an interesting moral dilemma episode on what to do. Protect new life? Get a lesson on the good points of the prime directive? Maybe the doctor has to make a tough character decision. Then halfway through the hologram leader is just crazy and you get a predictable everyone works together and the bad guy loses episode.
    I thought that was a classic case of nature vs nurture, ultimately the hologram leader couldn't overcome his nature, and became once more what he was programmed to do, but the Cardassian hologram was saved.

    The issue is visited several times again later, through the doctor, while with data it was synthetic life, with voyager it was holographic life. The alien culture that was at war with its holograms was something.

  19. #19
    Titan Val the Moofia Boss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the game View Post
    So in Star Trek First contact when the federation was fighting the borg cube. Worf decided to make a suicide run on the cube when he ran out of torpedos. However the Defiant's nose is an armed launchable warhead. So why didn't he use that? I understand that they lose their navigational deflector when they launch it but if he was already willing to make a suicide run on the cube you'd think he would've used the warhead first.
    The writers probably forgot that the Defiant could do that. Also, rule of drama.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    I also missed out on the latter half of DS9 and all of Enterprise, I need to rectify that soon.
    Eh, you don't need to watch the whole shows. There are a lot of forgettable episodes.

    Below is a list of the best DS9 episodes and/or the ones that have the most to do with DS9's overarching story.

    For DS9 you will actually want to watch a few TNG episodes first as they establish the Federation-Cardassian-Bajoran conflict.

    TNG episodes
    • Best of Both Worlds (later becomes Sisko's backstory)
    • The Wounded (Cardassians introduced)
    • Chain of Command (fleshes out the Cardassians

    Then watch these DS9 episodes (seasons 1-3)
    • The Emissary (S1 E1)
    • Duet (S1 E19)
    • Necessary Evil (S2 E8)
    • The Jem'Hadar (S2 E26)
    • The Search (S3 E1&2)
    • Second Skin (S3 E5)
    • Improbable Cause (S3 E20)
    • The Die is Cast (S3 E21)

    Go back to TNG and watch
    • Birthright (S6 E16, TNG-DS9 crossover episode about Worf)

    Then go back to DS9
    • Way of the Warrior (S4 E1 Worf joins DS9)
    • Hippocratic Oath (S4 E3)
    • Indiscretion (S4 E4)
    • Little Green Men (S4 E7)
    • Our Man Bashir (S4 E9)
    • Homefront (S4 E10)
    • Paradise Lost (S4 E11)
    • Return to Grace (S4 E13)
    • For the Cause (S4 E21)
    • Broken Link (S4 E25)
    • Apocalypse Rising (S5 E1)
    • The Ship (S5 E2)
    • For the Uniform (S5 E13)
    • In Purgatory's Shadow (S5 E14)
    • By Inferno's Light (S5 E15)
    • Blaze of GLory (S5 E23)
    • Call to Arms (S5 E26)
    • First 6 episodes of season 6)
    • Waltz (S6 E11)
    • Wrongs Darker Than Death or Night (S6 E17)
    • Inquisition (S6 E18)
    • In the Pale Moonlight (S6 E19)
    • Valiant (S6 E22)
    • Tears of the Prophets (S6 E26)
    • Image in the Sand (S7 E1)
    • Shadows and Symbols (S7 E2)
    • Treachery, Faith, and the Great River (S7 E6)
    • The Siege of AR-558 (S7 E8)
    • Covenant (S7 E9)
    • It's Only a Paper Moon (S7 E10)
    • Every episode from S7 E16 to the end of the show

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    As for Enterprise, there are very few episodes I would recommend.

    TOS and TNG pretty thoroughly did all of the good "episode of the week" plots you can do with a traveling starship. Most of Voyager's and Enterprise's episodic plots are just crappier rehashes of what TOS and TNG did better.

    Enterprise was at its best when it wasn't trying to be another "traveling ship" show, but instead showed the early days of Human spaceflight and the Federation, like First Flight (S2 E24), but there were only a small handful of episodes like that. The overall show was very mediocre.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post
    THey viewed the Vulcans as holding them back for 100 years... telling them they weren't ready - i can just imagine this is how hwow high elves were to humans.
    That's an Enterprise retcon of the Vulcans. In TOS and TNG, the Vulcans weren't assholes. They were legit wise and helpful.

    ENT retconned the Vulcans into being high and mighty assholes dictating Earth's progress, though I think it actually began with Voyager with Tuvok.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post

    That's an Enterprise retcon of the Vulcans. In TOS and TNG, the Vulcans weren't assholes. They were legit wise and helpful.

    ENT retconned the Vulcans into being high and mighty assholes dictating Earth's progress, though I think it actually began with Voyager with Tuvok.
    I think their assholeness kind of made sense as an extension of the prime directive though. Just because a species can achieve warp, doesn't mean they can be trusted with all your technology.

    You could consider anyone following the prime directive an asshole for not helping a primitive civilization with diseases and natural disasters too, afterall.

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