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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaktar View Post
    What value do you see in pointing out that they played a role in escalation; if he hadn't died and there was a court case, would it be relevant? Regardless of the escalation, the couple were not escalating while laying on the ground bleeding to death, when he came back out and shot them, after he'd had a significant amount of time to think through what he was doing.
    At that point they were bleeding on his snow. What jerks, am I right?

  2. #142
    The Undying cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaktar View Post
    What value do you see in pointing out that they played a role in escalation; if he hadn't died and there was a court case, would it be relevant? Regardless of the escalation, the couple were not escalating while laying on the ground bleeding to death, when he came back out and shot them, after he'd had a significant amount of time to think through what he was doing.
    Just that - the couple did play a role. It might affect a court case. For instance, if Rob came up and start yelling at Frank, calling him names and shouting insults and not backing down, and then Frank hit him, in a court case those would be extenuating circumstances.

    In fact, witnesses are now saying the couple actually started the violence first. Not that shooting is any kind of appropriate response - but the facts seem to still be coming in.

    NOW, that being said, going back to get another gun to finish the job is at another level of fucked up. I want to really be clear here that regardless of the conversation, the shooters actions here were not justified.

  3. #143
    Man, can we go back to just like, dudes taking the shirts off and chest bumping screaming, "THROW A PUNCH BRO, NO YOU THROW A PUNCH FIRST BRO, I'M NOT STARTING THIS SHIT BRO, COME AT ME BRO." before the two of them end up embraced, throwing fisticuffs as someone looking on with a phone recording the scuffle screams "WORLD STARRRRRRRRRRRRRR" and sells the video to TMZ for a few grand.

    Fuckin guns ruining what could have been top quality entertainment.

  4. #144
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaktar View Post
    It comes across as though you're equating their actions. You're saying nothing justifies murder, but also nothing justifies treating people like shit. Murder is a hell of a lot worse than treating someone like shit. People still have options when they are treated like shit. The dead do not have any. That guy could have been the nicest guy in the world prior to this, he proved himself to be 100x the piece of shit that couple was.
    Again you're a fan of the fuck your feelings and it doesn't matter what you say or how you treat people the rules says this or that. Well guess what rules don't keep you safe and there is no such thing as a vacuum in situations like this.

    You're not trying to get me to think objectively either, you are trying to get me to say it is ok to do whatever you want treat people however you want and whatever you can get away with so long as it's with in the rules as you see them and everything is ok.

    Well it isn't and that isn't reality. the people that got shot and killed "DIDN'T DESERVE THEIR FATE" but they weren't innocent and obviously they felt being rude belittling and vicious was the way to deal with a neighbor. People are not always obliged to turn the other cheek or look out for OTHERS best interest when they don't give a shit.


    The selfishness and thoughtless behavior here went both ways.
    #ANTIFA "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Man, can we go back to just like, dudes taking the shirts off and chest bumping screaming, "THROW A PUNCH BRO, NO YOU THROW A PUNCH FIRST BRO, I'M NOT STARTING THIS SHIT BRO, COME AT ME BRO." before the two of them end up embraced, throwing fisticuffs as someone looking on with a phone recording the scuffle screams "WORLD STARRRRRRRRRRRRRR" and sells the video to TMZ for a few grand.

    Fuckin guns ruining what could have been top quality entertainment.
    As barbaric (and hilarious) as that situation is, at least there's some minor degree of honor in two men resolving conflict with their own two hands. Using the iwin button that is a gun against an unarmed opponent means you're such a wimp you couldn't possibly do it on your own.

  6. #146
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Man, can we go back to just like, dudes taking the shirts off and chest bumping screaming, "THROW A PUNCH BRO, NO YOU THROW A PUNCH FIRST BRO, I'M NOT STARTING THIS SHIT BRO, COME AT ME BRO." before the two of them end up embraced, throwing fisticuffs as someone looking on with a phone recording the scuffle screams "WORLD STARRRRRRRRRRRRRR" and sells the video to TMZ for a few grand.

    Fuckin guns ruining what could have been top quality entertainment.
    That was never entertaining healthy and has always been part of the problem of this stupidity.
    #ANTIFA "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    That was never entertaining healthy and has always been part of the problem of this stupidity.
    I dunno about you, but seeing two out of shape dudes wheezing after spending 10 minutes bloviating and then throwing a few punches is top quality entertainment.

  8. #148
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nastard View Post
    As barbaric (and hilarious) as that situation is, at least there's some minor degree of honor in two men resolving conflict with their own two hands. Using the iwin button that is a gun against an unarmed opponent means you're such a wimp you couldn't possibly do it on your own.
    No there was nothing honorable about that situation ever, it's stupidity, and it's often times enabled by the fact people reward it with attention or 15 mins of fame. Well everybody wants to be on World Star Until something like this happens.

    "Oh they took it too far" Really exactly because they didn't handle it like everyone expected, because sometimes when people behave a certain way it isn't actually funny, but actually serious.
    #ANTIFA "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Just that - the couple did play a role. It might affect a court case. For instance, if Rob came up and start yelling at Frank, calling him names and shouting insults and not backing down, and then Frank hit him, in a court case those would be extenuating circumstances.
    That's a poor example. There are leagues of difference between punching a loud mouth and shooting him repeatedly, returning to your home to grab another weapon and going back out to shoot them again. I highly doubt his legal representatives would make attempts at such a defense.

    In fact, witnesses are now saying the couple actually started the violence first. Not that shooting is any kind of appropriate response - but the facts seem to still be coming in.
    And had he shot the man immediately after that assault.. he might have had a case for self-defense. Pulling out the gun and shooting them would be considered "re-escalation". Going back to get his rifle so he can deliver killing shots brings it way over the top.

    NOW, that being said, going back to get another gun to finish the job is at another level of fucked up. I want to really be clear here that regardless of the conversation, the shooters actions here were not justified.
    You say that...but at the same time you try to present the couples behaviour as mitigating factors...to the point where you even suggest that it might affect the outcome of a trial.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Nastard View Post
    As barbaric (and hilarious) as that situation is, at least there's some minor degree of honor in two men resolving conflict with their own two hands. Using the iwin button that is a gun against an unarmed opponent means you're such a wimp you couldn't possibly do it on your own.
    Thinking the same.
    Dude pussied out...and then added to it by suicide.

  11. #151
    The Undying cubby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Midnight Bomber View Post
    That's a poor example. There are leagues of difference between punching a loud mouth and shooting him repeatedly, returning to your home to grab another weapon and going back out to shoot them again. I highly doubt his legal representatives would make attempts at such a defense.
    Because someone asked me, and I'm an attorney - so I gave an example of mitigating circumstances in a violent situation. I happen to agree with you otherwise.


    And had he shot the man immediately after that assault.. he might have had a case for self-defense. Pulling out the gun and shooting them would be considered "re-escalation". Going back to get his rifle so he can deliver killing shots brings it way over the top.
    Agreed.


    You say that...but at the same time you try to present the couples behaviour as mitigating factors...to the point where you even suggest that it might affect the outcome of a trial.
    We're riding on nuances here, and I usually get into trouble trying this in a written communication forum. So I apologize ahead of time if I'm not as clear as I would like to be. My point is that the couple played a part in escalating the antagonism and violence in this situation. They are not innocent here. However, is what they did justification for being shot repeatedly? No, not at all.

  12. #152
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    I dunno about you, but seeing two out of shape dudes wheezing after spending 10 minutes bloviating and then throwing a few punches is top quality entertainment.
    LOL Yes haha too bad one of these man children were allowed to own a gun.
    #ANTIFA "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  13. #153
    The Insane draynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Fuckin guns ruining what could have been top quality entertainment.
    Dangit Edge, you're steering the convo into sad rozz territory, don't make rozz sad.
    /s

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    Again you're a fan of the fuck your feelings and it doesn't matter what you say or how you treat people the rules says this or that. Well guess what rules don't keep you safe and there is no such thing as a vacuum in situations like this.

    You're not trying to get me to think objectively either, you are trying to get me to say it is ok to do whatever you want treat people however you want and whatever you can get away with so long as it's with in the rules as you see them and everything is ok.

    Well it isn't and that isn't reality. the people that got shot and killed "DIDN'T DESERVE THEIR FATE" but they weren't innocent and obviously they felt being rude belittling and vicious was the way to deal with a neighbor. People are not always obliged to turn the other cheek or look out for OTHERS best interest when they don't give a shit.


    The selfishness and thoughtless behavior here went both ways.
    You want to make some argument about their behavior - okay - but what does that have to do with shooting them while they're already wounded laying prone on the ground? The shooter was a piece of shit. They may have been rude to him - certainly they were in that video - but we know very little about what happened. Given that he thought it through, fetched a bigger gun, then came out and executed them - I tend to think he was an unreasonable person. What unreasonable things did he do to provoke their anger that day? We could loop on this endlessly, try to figure out which party was more rude pre-shooting. At the end of the day, the couple's shittiness was of the normal, everyday kind - the shooter crossed into monster territory, and you seem to be looking for reasons to excuse him for that.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    Dangit Edge, you're steering the convo into sad rozz territory, don't make rozz sad.
    It's not my intention! I just want more videos of pathetic, out of shape middle-aged dudes gently bumping chests and screaming sweet nothings at each other before the fists start flyin, the chests start heavin, and the person filming screams "WORLD STARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR" like their life depends on it.

    If folks are gonna fight over stupid shit, it'd better at least be for our collective entertainment. As is, this is just a depressing tragedy.

  16. #156
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaktar View Post
    You want to make some argument about their behavior - okay - but what does that have to do with shooting them while they're already wounded laying prone on the ground?
    Easy the guy dumping snow on his property wanted to play the game who doesn't give any fucks.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zaktar View Post
    The shooter was a piece of shit. They may have been rude to him - certainly they were in that video - but we know very little about what happened. Given that he thought it through, fetched a bigger gun, then came out and executed them - I tend to think he was an unreasonable person. What unreasonable things did he do to provoke their anger that day? We could loop on this endlessly, try to figure out which party was more rude pre-shooting. At the end of the day, the couple's shittiness was of the normal, everyday kind - the shooter crossed into monster territory, and you seem to be looking for reasons to excuse him for that.
    You're right I don't know any of the individuals personally or clinically, but based on my observation the loud mouth shoveling snow on his neighbors lawn seemed to want to find out. I am not going to say he deserved to die or his wife. But your right his attitude was all too common.

    The I don't give a fuck about how I treat people or what I say. This is NOT the only time that kind of behavior turned out this way.


    There doesn't need to be an excuse, I see this for what it is, what YOU seem to be trying to do is milk sympathy for a guy who literally gave no fucks treated his neighbor like shit and like too many wanted to see just how far he could push it.


    Well that is an option in life
    #ANTIFA "Intellect alone is useless in a fight...you can't even break a rule, how can you be expected to break bone" Khan Singh

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Because someone asked me, and I'm an attorney - so I gave an example of mitigating circumstances in a violent situation. I happen to agree with you otherwise.
    It's still a poor example.


    We're riding on nuances here, and I usually get into trouble trying this in a written communication forum. So I apologize ahead of time if I'm not as clear as I would like to be. My point is that the couple played a part in escalating the antagonism and violence in this situation. They are not innocent here. However, is what they did justification for being shot repeatedly? No, not at all.
    That's where i have issues though...not that I think you are saying that he was justified...just this idea of "played a part in escalating"...really comes across like victim blaming. That they should have been nicer and then they wouldn't have gotten shot.

    I understand in this case that it was a long running feud and it's not clear what the initial cause of that feud even was...but in the end it doesn't matter. He shot them. He walked up to them while they were on the ground and shot them again. He went to get another gun and shot them again.

  18. #158
    @cubby your need to blame the victims in this is kinda disturbing.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    It's not my intention! I just want more videos of pathetic, out of shape middle-aged dudes gently bumping chests and screaming sweet nothings at each other before the fists start flying, the chests start heavin, and the person filming screams "WORLD STARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR" like their life depends on it.

    If folks are gonna fight over stupid shit, it'd better at least be for our collective entertainment. As is, this is just a depressing tragedy.
    Just spit balling here. But maybe MMOC should have it's own death-match forum.
    2 posters go into a thread.
    Start calling each other motherfuckers.
    The first poster to crack and threaten gun violence, loses.
    Their account gets GDPR'd.

    Consider it a more formal way for posters to engage with sealions, instead of derailing a thread for seven pages!

    MagicFind.US , you're welcome for this innovative idea to drive site engagement. Just send me my royalty checks.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    Easy the guy dumping snow on his property wanted to play the game who doesn't give any fucks.
    This psycho was probably one bad day away from shooting at a snow cloud while screaming "DEATH TO THE PHILISTINE!" because it had the audacity to put snow on his property.

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