new flagellation even worse?

[Coldkil]

An Idea:

Sanguine Assault
You coat your Weapons in deadly Anima, assaulting all (8?) Enemies within 12 Yards, dealing (X% attack power) shadow damage and marking them as [insert flavor name here].
For 10 seconds, your Damage is increased by X% and your Leech is increased by Y% for each [insert flavor name here] within 12 Yards.
(Optional idea: if only 1 target is hit, the damage and leech effects will be increased by X%)

i think the initial hit should be around 150-200% AP if target capped or 100-150% if uncapped.
since our strong point right now is outlaw cleave, the +dmg and leech effects cannot be high or it would lead to balancing issues.
i am not too familiar with current high-end meta to say how much +dmg would be good without being OP.

That's actually not bad. I would keep the "flagellate/vampire" theme and make it so each enemy you hit with the first cleave gives you a buff stack, and instead of a flat %dmg increase which is very dangerous with scaling, i'd make that your next X (= buff stacks) abilities deal %more damage as shadow and consume a stack. If a single target is hit, you get 5(?) stacks.

More istant damage, less buff/debuff management (that we have already).

EDIT: our aoe is capped, but stuff like Blade Rush is not. The initial damage cleave could be uncapped aswell, but i think we should get a capped amount of stacks.

EDIT2: it's fun how everytime players are "called" to give their own ideas, most of the times they come up with stuff that's more interesting and actually viable without being clunky or not doable in game (since there is already other stuff that work in similar ways).

[Mysterymask]

Flaggelation changed back...but now with no extra button to press!

Lash the target for (50% of Attack power) Shadow damage, causing each combo point spent within 12 sec to lash for an additional (10% of Attack power). Dealing damage with Flagellation increases your Haste by 1%, persisting 12 sec after their torment fades.

[Finear]

Flaggelation changed back...but now with no extra button to press!

Lash the target for (50% of Attack power) Shadow damage, causing each combo point spent within 12 sec to lash for an additional (10% of Attack power). Dealing damage with Flagellation increases your Haste by 1%, persisting 12 sec after their torment fades.

this is going to feel so much better now

aslo cut to the chase is back lol, and we didnt have to wait till 9.3 for that

Edit: we may actually run flaggelation conduit now, can't wait for sims to update

[ro9ue]

50% ap attack upfront is gonna feel way more impactful than 3 lashes of 6% ap each lol. Plus no energy cost, plus no annoying secondary pull off target mechanic. Very nice change.

I would like a leech aspect for vampirism theme but that's super picky.

On the cut to the chase... just make it passive. They already did this whole thing before. SND > Envenom refreshes > passive. We're at step 2 again. Hopefully we dont have to wait to get back to where they were before and during the PTR they start realizing SND is just annoying waste a hotkey on period..

[Coldkil]

Flagellation (Venthyr) no longer costs Energy (was 20 Energy), duration reduced to 12 seconds (was 20 seconds), Haste is now granted immediately, and no longer has a second activation. Flagellation’s initial damage increased by 270%, additional damage from spending combo points increased by 160%, and deals damage 1 time upon use (was 3).

Also the conduit has changed to give us more slashes on activation for more burst. I don't think it'll compete with other potency ones (right now we have only one potency slot) right now, but scaling and increased ilvl may become the deciding factor later on.

All in all, really happy with the change. The main issue of Flagellation is that it requires a wide time window with increased CP generation so you could stack it to 30, otherwise it felt just wasted to use it and get like 9 stacks. With this implementation we can fire it more consistently and have more frontloaded damage.

[Finear]

Also the conduit has changed to give us more slashes on activation for more burst. I don't think it'll compete with other potency ones (right now we have only one potency slot) right now, but scaling and increased ilvl may become the deciding factor later on.

Additional damage is most likely not good enough but it gives more haste initially which may compete with other conduits

[Coldkil]

Additional damage is most likely not good enough but it gives more haste initially which may compete with other conduits

Yeah, some conduits are definitely stringer than this - but in the end we got a buffed and more usable skill so i cannot really complain. We'll see when sims get updated.

EDIT: it will be interesting to see if we get the choice between the final dps ability a venthyr soulbind has and another potency conduit. Also, they should really rework Built for War, it's way too inconsistent as a dps conduit.

[AkundaMrdal]

I picked venthyr on my rogue alt, because it was last covenant I was missing and in m+ I forget to end maybe 50 % of my flagellations, mainly when switching targets. But this change will make it useless in m+.

edit: nvm I just noticed they changed it again

[Coldkil]

It's not mentioned above, but seems that the haste buff will last for 12 second after it expires - basically you activate and while you stack it the buff duration is refreshed until the first buff is expired. Even better.

[Sazalol]

Yea something like that

[kaelix1]

Nice, does this mean we get a 'burst' cd? can't wait to see how this work for a combat rogue, i hope they give us a free reroll after the change

[Coldkil]

Nice, does this mean we get a 'burst' cd? can't wait to see how this work for a combat rogue, i hope they give us a free reroll after the change

The skill mechanic doesn't change much - we'll have more burst since it's not going to be a 2 phases skill anymore. You just click it and go wild with spenders. Damage is gonna be increased aswell, but that addresses the fact that all rogue covenant skills are just bad in terms of raw damage.

[Coldkil]

Since we're talking about covenant skill changes here, i suppose it's the right place to drop this.

Serrated Bone Spike initial damage increased by 300%.
Resolved an issue that prevented Serrated Bone Spike’s initial damage from dealing a critical strike.
Serrated Bone Spike now grants 1 combo point plus 1 per active bone spike after it strikes the target.
Serrated Bone Spike no longer refunds a charge and gets removed when the target is healed to full.
Serrated Bone Spike is now removed when the target leaves combat.

Definitely improved. There's also a bug in PTR with Exsanguinate and Bone Spike. Basically, since BS had infinite duration, Exsanguinate makes it tick 30% faster forever. Which is nice but not broken, until you count the issue that every subsequent Exsang makes it tick faster and faster, to the piont you can 3man a world boss because of the insane damage (though ramp up is high, takes around 3mins to kick in).

I'm fine with it working with Exsanguinate, but not the stacking part

[Lodravel]

Since we're talking about covenant skill changes here, i suppose it's the right place to drop this.

Serrated Bone Spike initial damage increased by 300%.
Resolved an issue that prevented Serrated Bone Spike’s initial damage from dealing a critical strike.
Serrated Bone Spike now grants 1 combo point plus 1 per active bone spike after it strikes the target.
Serrated Bone Spike no longer refunds a charge and gets removed when the target is healed to full.
Serrated Bone Spike is now removed when the target leaves combat.

Definitely improved. There's also a bug in PTR with Exsanguinate and Bone Spike. Basically, since BS had infinite duration, Exsanguinate makes it tick 30% faster forever. Which is nice but not broken, until you count the issue that every subsequent Exsang makes it tick faster and faster, to the piont you can 3man a world boss because of the insane damage (though ramp up is high, takes around 3mins to kick in).

I'm fine with it working with Exsanguinate, but not the stacking part

That Bone Spike buff is just :chef's_kiss:

Makes me feel good about having stuck with Necrolord since the beginning, as though the subbornness has finally paid off, although I know that's a silly way of looking at it.

First the shield buff and now, finally, both abilities are actually useful. At least it won't feel as pathetic to hit that button.

[Coldkil]

That Bone Spike buff is just :chef's_kiss:

Makes me feel good about having stuck with Necrolord since the beginning, as though the subbornness has finally paid off, although I know that's a silly way of looking at it.

First the shield buff and now, finally, both abilities are actually useful. At least it won't feel as pathetic to hit that button.

Same for me with Venthyr - the rework makes the skill way more impactful and not clunky. I'd swap to necrolord, but honestly, if they're more or less balanced, why would i do it, i invested time in unlocking stuff for my covenant and i simply don't have the will to redo it all over again.

[Lodravel]

So, well, how think this is gonna last? New Flagellation is a bit nutty in PvP atm. Expecting it to get tuned a bit.

[Coldkil]

So, well, how think this is gonna last? New Flagellation is a bit nutty in PvP atm. Expecting it to get tuned a bit.

Hopefully it gets a pvp only nerf. Right now in PvE is awesome without being op

[Kithelle]

I'm not a huge rogue player, I mainly only really ever enjoyed playing assassination over the years here and there...but ugh this new version is awful imo

Damage is meh, cooldown sucks, and the range boost is short...both in range and duration.

[Ryzeth]

I'm not a huge rogue player, I mainly only really ever enjoyed playing assassination over the years here and there...but ugh this new version is awful imo

Damage is meh, cooldown sucks, and the range boost is short...both in range and duration.

Tf are you on about? Damage is extremely good. Have you watched either Pikaboo's or Whaazz's videos on new Flagellation?? The damage is ridiculous. I'm guessing you're using the ability wrong.

[Kithelle]

Tf are you on about? Damage is extremely good. Have you watched either Pikaboo's or Whaazz's videos on new Flagellation?? The damage is ridiculous. I'm guessing you're using the ability wrong.

100% ap on a 1 and a half minute cooldown for flagellation
120% ap 10% ap dot p3 till target dies or drops combat 3 charges on a 30 second cooldown for bone spike
162.89% ap over 10 seconds 77.56% ap if target survives full duration on 1.5 minute cooldown for sepsis

Does less damage for same or higher cooldowns than all the other covenant abilities...damage is totally meh compared to the other abilities