Do you personally like Odyn? Do you agree with his controversial choices?

[Kallisto]

After she threatened Odyn with returning the Halls of Valor to Ulduar. Threatened her boss. Real smart of her.

Her boss?

More like her rapist that basically mind controlled her for a long time to the point she was unaware of what happened. Then when she got her memories back, rebelled.

[Sammonoske]

Her boss?

More like her rapist that basically mind controlled her for a long time to the point she was unaware of what happened. Then when she got her memories back, rebelled.

Nice made-up narrative. Do you come up with it on your own? Holy hell.

[StationaryHawk]

He's okay as a character, but there's not much to agree with. For all their faults, the Aspects actually fought to protect Azeroth while Odyn sat imprisoned in his own sky fortress.

[TheFirstOnes]

Y'all really don't understand the true metallic chadness that is Odyn.

[OwenBurton]

He's okay as a character, but there's not much to agree with. For all their faults, the Aspects actually fought to protect Azeroth while Odyn sat imprisoned in his own sky fortress.

I wonder if Odyn and the Valarjar would have been able to fight back the Legion. Remember, the Aspects empowered the Dragon Soul, gave their powers to Deathwing, apparently resulted in the destruction of much of the Resistance and the near-annihilation of an entire dragonflight...

[Shadowferal]

He's a far cry from the Odin/Wotan/Wodan/Wodanaz of the Germanic pantheon.

Hmm..if I recall my Norse he's not a nice guy. Only Thor was ever called "friend of mankind."

[shoc]

I mean it is looking like he is more or less responsible for setting in motion the Jailers plan to escape so

[Magical Mudcrab]

He twisted helya into the first valkyr against her wish.
She has every reason to hate us and odyn tbh. In her eyes we are probably just pawns off odyn.

Which is good, it shows the cold detachment of the keepers. It's probably a bad thing if the only keepers we see are those who are either unambiguously righteous, such as Thorim or Tyr, or unambiguously evil, like Loken. Having a character like Odyn, who has done cruel and evil things in the pursuit of his designation, adds a bit more depth to the keepers. It also helps show that the keepers, and the Titans more generally, are only on our side because we are coincidentally on theirs. Moreover, Odyn is flawed and does flawed things but his main hesitation, which was trusting the Aspects to guard Azeroth, ended up being well founded and almost caused Azeroth to be irreversibly damaged twice (Malygos' manipulation of ley lines, and Deathwing destroying the World Pillar to cause the Cataclysm), so his arrogance is understandable at a meta level.

But the story didnt play like that in Legion, which is weird because it only showed us how sad it was that odyn was trapped and not even saying anything about why helya is like this etc etc.

It makes sense that Odyn would do everything he could have to hide the facts of what he did to Helya and would portray himself as a victim. He cannot fulfill his wishes to defend Azeroth if he is trapped, and having mortals with powerful weapons defeat his enemy is a boon to him. While I think it's strange that we did not see him play an active part after his freedom from the Halls of Valor, it makes sense that he has not actively participated in BfA (which was primarily a mortal problem, up until N'zoth was freed) and Shadowlands (as though he appears to have some level of involvement, given his eye is the Eye of the Jailer, it's doubtful he will personally be involved as that would take him away from Azeroth).

[StationaryHawk]

I wonder if Odyn and the Valarjar would have been able to fight back the Legion. Remember, the Aspects empowered the Dragon Soul, gave their powers to Deathwing, apparently resulted in the destruction of much of the Resistance and the near-annihilation of an entire dragonflight...

Possibly. His army could have been strong enough to single-handedly fend off the Legion and prevent the Sundering, but it doesn't matter because he didn't show up.

[Good ol Stroggylos]

Only controversial choice imo is letting us deal with the Legion invasion after he went to visit the rest of the keepers... Hope he doesn't join team jailer

[Moonrage]

He was a little dickhead, but I liked him. He's more in line with the actual Odin from mythology than most portrayels of Odin.

[Caerule]

Odyn is controversial. People take that too much to a meta level, though. You have to look at what the intention behind the character is.

He's not supposed to be controversial, because the things he does are actually problematic in modern society or anything. No, he's meant to be problematic in this setting. And that works well for me, even if I know some who don't like him as a fictional character, as a result.

But his "character type" is supposed to be "The Good Guys Can Be Dicks Too". He's a self-glorifying asshat, hopped up on pride, deeply flawed, and borderline insane in how he operates.

Like, you should read the tablets with his legends around the Hall of Valor. It's a bunch of revisionist history. Him, force the Val'kyr against their will? Lies and propaganda! The agonizing flaming beard resulting from being grabbed by Ragnaros in the face and forever scarred by the Firelords touch? It's claimed he mirthfully laughed it off and kept it willingly.

He does his own will, turns on allies when he doesn't get his way, makes his people jump through countless trials that serve only to glorify him. And had to go through elaborate efforts to use an avatar, to guide a mortal champion to get the Aegis of Aggramar before God-King Skovald could. Skovald brute-forced his way through the trials rather than honoring them. Odyn could have denied him, or flattened him. But Odyn preferred to go through an elaborate ruse, so he could maintain his stupid system or trials.

Point is, Odyn is supposed to be entertaining. And his clear craziness makes him both assistance and antagonist in the story. Being both our ally, and our obstacle. And that enriches the setting. Because having troublesome leaders to work with, flawed characters, just fits the norse mythology fine.

So do I like Odyn? Like is a strong word, but he's alright. I think he takes the role of "Ally but also a dick" well. I think he enriches the setting.
Do I agree with his choices? Hell no! The God of Ego and Trials is an arrogant self-aggrandizing idiot. He's not designed to be agreed with.

[tommyhil622]

Unfortunately he too closely resembles the Norse god or the marvel version of him at least. Never really liked the idea of a titan forged taking the mantle of a mythological being so, literally. It would make sense as a ruse but he’s literally role playing as Odin. Would make more sense if he dropped the act since we know what he actually is but idk.

[Pum]

Which is good, it shows the cold detachment of the keepers. It's probably a bad thing if the only keepers we see are those who are either unambiguously righteous, such as Thorim or Tyr, or unambiguously evil, like Loken. Having a character like Odyn, who has done cruel and evil things in the pursuit of his designation, adds a bit more depth to the keepers. It also helps show that the keepers, and the Titans more generally, are only on our side because we are coincidentally on theirs. Moreover, Odyn is flawed and does flawed things but his main hesitation, which was trusting the Aspects to guard Azeroth, ended up being well founded and almost caused Azeroth to be irreversibly damaged twice (Malygos' manipulation of ley lines, and Deathwing destroying the World Pillar to cause the Cataclysm), so his arrogance is understandable at a meta level.



It makes sense that Odyn would do everything he could have to hide the facts of what he did to Helya and would portray himself as a victim. He cannot fulfill his wishes to defend Azeroth if he is trapped, and having mortals with powerful weapons defeat his enemy is a boon to him. While I think it's strange that we did not see him play an active part after his freedom from the Halls of Valor, it makes sense that he has not actively participated in BfA (which was primarily a mortal problem, up until N'zoth was freed) and Shadowlands (as though he appears to have some level of involvement, given his eye is the Eye of the Jailer, it's doubtful he will personally be involved as that would take him away from Azeroth).

All of this.

People are judging Odyn as if he was some farmhand in Westfall. He's the Prime Designate, if fucking up Helya to become the first Val'kyr was the best way for him to defend Azeroth, then why would he not do it? Titans are order over emotion, does nobody remember what Algalon's job was?

[masterjc]

I hope to see Odyn as a Dungeon boss (raid is too much honor for him)
beaten shit out of him, but not killed. and captured forever in deep chamber

strongly dislike him, total jerk

[shimerra]

All of this.

People are judging Odyn as if he was some farmhand in Westfall. He's the Prime Designate, if fucking up Helya to become the first Val'kyr was the best way for him to defend Azeroth, then why would he not do it? Titans are order over emotion, does nobody remember what Algalon's job was?

You're confusing Odyn thinking it's best with it actually being best. Helya was pretty much right on board with Odyn until he started forcing her to peer into the Shadowlands and she saw shit she warned him not to mess with. While he was in charge Prime Designate didn't make the other titan keepers his slaves and it was all of the job to decide how to defend azeroth. Not just Odyn's alone. While he was the head of the council of sorts it was a far more collaborative effort and not the dictatorship you seem to think it was. Made quite literally evident by the fact that when the other Keepers thought Odyn was going crazy with all his glory non-sense it was he who fucked off into the sky not the rest of them being whipped into line.

We're judging him because he was a raging cunt, his choices massively backfired and were often him jerking off in his own face at the expense of the safety of Azeroth, and he literally lied to his race of peons trying to make himself out as the perfect child. If we want to get pissy about whose plans backyard the other keepers or Odyn don't forget who it was that gave the most help to Zovaal with his eye and screwed around with deathmagic causing one of his keepers Helya to side with the enemy. And thanks to the Nathrezeim's meddling Odyn's fuckery probably helped Zovaal more than we know.

And do you actually remember the Algalon fight? While for gameplay reasons it was a boss fight he's essentially convinced that maybe he/the titan's had it wrong and he shouldn't just blindly follow orders. The titan's had multiple back up plans incase the old god corruption won(that often caused their own problems in hindsight), but the primary goal was always to try as hard as they could to save Azeroth first.


Odyn's all about emotion. Especially pride. And he's shown to have zero patience and be very quick to anger if people step even a small toe out of line with what he thinks things should be. So your whole point really just has no legs to stand on except that the other Keepers also had ideas that didn't go exactly as planed. But he was as blind to the problems with his own as you claim the other Keepers were to theirs. More so actually because unlike the other keepers Odyn seems only rarely and begrudgingly to acknowledge a few minor things as his fault and frequently rewrites mistakes and faults to be glorious tales of heroism like in his tales.

[Magical Mudcrab]

You're confusing Odyn thinking it's best with it actually being best. Helya was pretty much right on board with Odyn until he started forcing her to peer into the Shadowlands and she saw shit she warned him not to mess with. While he was in charge Prime Designate didn't make the other titan keepers his slaves and it was all of the job to decide how to defend azeroth. Not just Odyn's alone. While he was the head of the council of sorts it was a far more collaborative effort and not the dictatorship you seem to think it was. Made quite literally evident by the fact that when the other Keepers thought Odyn was going crazy with all his glory non-sense it was he who fucked off into the sky not the rest of them being whipped into line.

We're judging him because he was a raging cunt, his choices massively backfired and were often him jerking off in his own face at the expense of the safety of Azeroth, and he literally lied to his race of peons trying to make himself out as the perfect child. If we want to get pissy about whose plans backyard the other keepers or Odyn don't forget who it was that gave the most help to Zovaal with his eye and screwed around with deathmagic causing one of his keepers Helya to side with the enemy. And thanks to the Nathrezeim's meddling Odyn's fuckery probably helped Zovaal more than we know.

Absolutely none of this is relevant. Odyn doing what Odyn thinks is best is what makes him a character, with his flaws reinforcing this. Judging a character based on meta information we have, when we know they don't have access to this meta information and don't know the full consequences of their actions until they happen, is entirely silly. Frankly, that many of his plans backfired was beyond his control and were in fact working out well. If not for the failure and subsequent betrayal of Loken, Helya would never have betrayed Odyn, hence he would have never been confined to the Halls of Valor and his Valarjar would have been able to work towards Azeroth's defense. If you want to discuss the efficacy of his plans in a meta context, that's fine, but none of that is relevant to whether Odyn is a good character or not, or whether his choices make sense given his limited information.

And do you actually remember the Algalon fight? While for gameplay reasons it was a boss fight he's essentially convinced that maybe he/the titan's had it wrong and he shouldn't just blindly follow orders. The titan's had multiple back up plans incase the old god corruption won(that often caused their own problems in hindsight), but the primary goal was always to try as hard as they could to save Azeroth first.

Sure, and Algalon not following through on his designation almost allowed the Cataclysm to happen, almost allowed Sargeras to kill Azeroth, and almost allowed N'zoth to corrupt Azeroth. Algalon's assessment that Azeroth needed to be reoriginated was likely correct, and his logic for not doing so (i.e.: he calculated the most likely events of the fight being his victory, and that these calculations were defied made him question his decisions) was faulty. That things have worked out isn't evidence of the assessment being wrong, only that we are unbelievably lucky in how we defy the odds. If you were to roll a die an infinite number of times, you would inevitably come to a point where there would be a series of 1's that would be of a length of 1 million, which is so absurdly small that it would not be considered possible, and Algalon's calculations were likely similar (i.e.: the chances of us winning the encounter were so absurdly small, it would not be reasonable to think we would win) and he was wrongly shaken by being incorrect (i.e.: believing his calculations were wrong just because we defied the expectations) when he should have recognized that his calculations wouldn't be based on certainties but probabilities.

Odyn's all about emotion. Especially pride. And he's shown to have zero patience and be very quick to anger if people step even a small toe out of line with what he thinks things should be. So your whole point really just has no legs to stand on except that the other Keepers also had ideas that didn't go exactly as planed. But he was as blind to the problems with his own as you claim the other Keepers were to theirs. More so actually because unlike the other keepers Odyn seems only rarely and begrudgingly to acknowledge a few minor things as his fault and frequently rewrites mistakes and faults to be glorious tales of heroism like in his tales.

Odyn's all about not deviating from the plan and forcing any who deviate back into order. This isn't some character quirk, this is what should be expected by a character developed by the Titans, who are currently the pinnacle of Order that we know of. For a being of Order their vision would not be negotiated on as any negotiation in their vision induces uncertainty which should be unacceptable. While the other keepers seem content with negotiating on what can be done, which you could take as a more realist or pragmatic approach given the problems they were facing, Odyn's pride and unwillingness to change is a unique trait that would be nice to see come to ahead if it was ever explored (i.e.: a possible split in the keepers and their beliefs for what is the best way to defend Azeroth).

[TheFirstOnes]

"But his "character type" is supposed to be "The Good Guys Can Be Dicks Too"."

Beings of Order aren't good. Nor are they bad. That's the point.

[Maxilian]

I like Odyn as a character cause he brings an interesting story, do i agree with his action? No

[Soon-TM]

I like Odyn as a character cause he brings an interesting story, do i agree with his action? No

I agree with this, and with @Magical Mudcrab's assessment. We definitely need more characters like him, who are neither one-dimensional moustache twirling baddies (e.g. Sylvanas) nor equally one-dimensional goody goody two shoes (Anduin and his army of clones).