Why not badge gear?

[Doffen]

We have Covenant gear vendor and the Great Vault where you can pick loot. If they added a vendor it wouldnt automatically be gear you wanted either. What then? People would complain that the badge gear sucks! Just as they say the GV sucks now when they get items they dont want and need.

The GV is an ever changing "badge vendor" where you do content and get to pick an item depending on your efforts. In reality it works exactly like a badge vendor.

And the badge vendor in TBC was all catch up. It was always a raid item level below current progress. If you compare it to now, Covenant gear is exactly that. In current game design a badge vendor would not fit in since seasons comes and goes. Remember Azerite vendor? If you wanted to pick your bis from that it took you 24-26 weeks to get all 3 if you did a 15 each week. Bar 8.3 it would mean you got to use it for a month before next season came and you started your regrind. I remenber all the QQ of regrinding the currency, I bet Blizzard do as well.

Why no badge gear? Because we got it in The Great Vault.

[khazmodan]

I've lately come to the opinion that the playerbase is far less casual than we've all been assuming. Most 'casual' players, IMO, have already been run off to the point where they now make up a small, silent minority of players. The game is aimed at and designed for the more mid-core player ... someone who runs decently high m+ keys and heroic raiding at least. If you look at Blizzard decisions with that proportion in mind then more of their design decisions make sense.

I think the playerbase is mostly casual for about a month or so after an expansion or major patch but otherwise I think you are right that it is more in the middle for the rest of the time. The reality is that Blizzard is realizing that they can make plenty of money by not bending the game over backwards for the casuals that will not stick around. Instead it makes sense to make it a ton of fun for those casuals for that first month so they keep coming back to buy another expansion and grindy enough for the consistent daily players that are in the middle and then extreme high end rng for the no lifers that grind until there eyes bleed.

[otaXephon]

i have actualy mentioned this before,i think pvp gear,raid gear and dungeon gear should all have specific stats,that boost you in that specific enviroment,they would all work outdoors the same way,like for example resilience would for in pvp and also vs outdoor content but not in dungeons and raids,raid gear would have a raid stat that works in raids and outdoor but not in dungeons and pvp (well i guess it could work in normal/hc/mythic 0)

Yes, that's what this game needs: More shit to keep in your bags for no fucking reason.

[deenman]

Yes, that's what this game needs: More shit to keep in your bags for no fucking reason.

they could implement a system for gear like they did for quest items,have it all be stored in the equipment manager

and even if not....what do people even do with bag space these days?what is this vanila?

[otaXephon]

they could implement a system for gear like they did for quest items,have it all be stored in the equipment manager

and even if not....what do people even do with bag space these days?what is this vanila?

It's an overcomplicated solution to an imaginary problem. The game can be balanced without different types of gear for different content.

[deenman]

It's an overcomplicated solution to an imaginary problem. The game can be balanced without different types of gear for different content.

the change from pvp only stats has only caused problems

[otaXephon]

the change from pvp only stats has only caused problems

...in your opinion. PvP in this game has always been jank, I don't particularly feel like it's less jank now than it was when PvP power was a thing. At this point, over the course of this game's 16-year love/hate relationship with PvP I think the devs have tried just about every possible "solution" to this problem; just because you preferred it when PvP power was a thing doesn't mean that this is the best possible solution.

[Spaceboytg]

i have actualy mentioned this before,i think pvp gear,raid gear and dungeon gear should all have specific stats,that boost you in that specific enviroment,they would all work outdoors the same way,like for example resilience would for in pvp and also vs outdoor content but not in dungeons and raids,raid gear would have a raid stat that works in raids and outdoor but not in dungeons and pvp (well i guess it could work in normal/hc/mythic 0)

I've always liked the idea of gear tailored to the type of activity. It rewards the player appropriately for what they are doing and avoids the problems of needing to PvP/PvE or vice versa for gear for your content. Honestly, the lowest set of PvP gear should demolish a Mythic raider in PvP ... but be near useless in the Mythic raid.

[deenman]

I've always liked the idea of gear tailored to the type of activity. It rewards the player appropriately for what they are doing and avoids the problems of needing to PvP/PvE or vice versa for gear for your content. Honestly, the lowest set of PvP gear should demolish a Mythic raider in PvP ... but be near useless in the Mythic raid.

agree,in the past we had some funny situations with this,i think it was in mop,where the best pvp gear still lost to pve gear in outdoors lol,it got changed later with pvp gear activating in outdoor as well vs players,but i think cataclysm had it best

[Fkiolaris]

i have actualy mentioned this before,i think pvp gear,raid gear and dungeon gear should all have specific stats,that boost you in that specific enviroment,they would all work outdoors the same way,like for example resilience would for in pvp and also vs outdoor content but not in dungeons and raids,raid gear would have a raid stat that works in raids and outdoor but not in dungeons and pvp (well i guess it could work in normal/hc/mythic 0)

That, or use the WoD PvP gear system. So PvE gear gets capped when pvping and pvp gear is boosted in pvp/stays at lower level in pve. Assuming they implement a proper set management system (Rift had one years ago), they should have this for M+, Raids, Rated PvP and casual PvP.

[huth]

they could implement a system for gear like they did for quest items,have it all be stored in the equipment manager

and even if not....what do people even do with bag space these days?what is this vanila?

People who play the game have a crapton of junk constantly clogging up their bags. Vanilla dropped less stuff in general, and a lot of the SL stuff is actually worth taking to whereever it goes.

For that matter, having gear work completely differently in different enviroments is very poor design. There's a reason they removed those stats. Same reason most PvP specific ability nerfs are only effectiveness, not effect. You're effectively suggesting confusing the hell out of people to fix a minor issue, when Blizzard generally trends to making the game easier to understand.

[ellieg]

It's not a refusal to do the content, it's just having a hard time getting into it. I've never done rated PvP and I'm scared to sign up for groups out of fear of judgment. I don't have any friends that could get me in or help me out. And that's assuming they'll even let someone like me with no rating or experience into them in the first place.

Join a "yolo" group. Its easier when the rated bg is the weekly pvp quest. As long as you're ~200 ilvl, you shld be able to get an invite to one of these. They usually go 1/3/6. From there keep playimg until you get to 1400ish rating. Then try to join the 1.5k cr groups

[otaXephon]

People who play the game have a crapton of junk constantly clogging up their bags. Vanilla dropped less stuff in general, and a lot of the SL stuff is actually worth taking to whereever it goes.

For that matter, having gear work completely differently in different enviroments is very poor design. There's a reason they removed those stats. Same reason most PvP specific ability nerfs are only effectiveness, not effect. You're effectively suggesting confusing the hell out of people to fix a minor issue, when Blizzard generally trends to making the game easier to understand.

While I support this argument in concept, you have to wonder why Blizzard says this publicly then adds things like Corruption to the game afterward. This was the same reason they removed Reforging and while I definitely do not support them adding multiple types of gear for different content you have to wonder why the devs think things like DoT-snapshotting and Reforging are "too complicated" but systems-on-systems like Essences, Corruption and Azerite gear from BfA aren't.

[leorana]

As I have said in other threads.

If you want badge gear then you need to consider that it would have to be limited in some way, most likely weekly. And then all you have is weekly vault except somewhat deterministic, and therefore something which has to be weaker overall whether in amount or quality.

Not to mention that having both the weekly vault AND quality badge gear is exactly the kind of loot avalanche that makes the rest of the game suffer. So you would likely have to consider choosing one over the other, in which case the question simply becomes whether you are willing to sacrifice the weekly vault for even less loot.

I would say valor/badge vendor ( possibly upgradable) - and ditch greay vault. Regardless, raids and dungeons need loot drop boost which is what is currently planned

[Nnyco]

Get covenant gear if you want normal ilvl.

[ohwell]

More than enough to get into a random bg and get one shot. Joy of joys, such enough, much fun

Ridiculous level of hyperbole to try to make your point only discredits you.

[huth]

While I support this argument in concept, you have to wonder why Blizzard says this publicly then adds things like Corruption to the game afterward. This was the same reason they removed Reforging and while I definitely do not support them adding multiple types of gear for different content you have to wonder why the devs think things like DoT-snapshotting and Reforging are "too complicated" but systems-on-systems like Essences, Corruption and Azerite gear from BfA aren't.

I'm not sure what makes you think those are terribly hard to understand. It gets complicated on how they interact and optimising them, but understanding what they do and how they work is not.

[otaXephon]

I'm not sure what makes you think those are terribly hard to understand. It gets complicated on how they interact and optimising them, but understanding what they do and how they work is not.

How are things like Reforging and DoT-snapshotting somehow less obvious is the question. It seems, to me, like six of one and half a dozen of another.

[huth]

How are things like Reforging and DoT-snapshotting somehow less obvious is the question. It seems, to me, like six of one and half a dozen of another.

The problem with reforging wasn't that it was complicated, but that it was purely an optimisation problem with basically no gameplay at all. Take numbers, plug into calculator. DoT snapshotting wasn't obvious because there was nothing in the game that even hinted at it, you had to check your log to realise anything was happening.

None of the BfA systems were particularly unclear on how they worked.

[otaXephon]

None of the BfA systems were particularly unclear on how they worked.

For me, that's a strong disagree on Corruption. Essences weren't even that clear, honestly. But it's clear you and I disagree with the fundamentals here. I was just pointing out a bit of what I perceive as hypocrisy on behalf of the devs; it's doubtful they'll ever have systems in the game that aren't able to have the fun optimized out of them. And since that's the case, I personally don't think either Reforging or DoT-snapshotting should have been removed (in a world where they're okay with things like Corrupted gear existing).