Page 20 of 24 FirstFirst ...
10
18
19
20
21
22
... LastLast
  1. #381
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Because finishing a race is the same as driving a handful of precession laps behind a safety car.
    That was pretty much the same, Leclerc was first with a broken Ferrari cutting the engine, and Hamilton got full points for that. Must have been really hard to win that race...

  2. #382
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Cumbria, England
    Posts
    14,348
    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    It's pretty simple. If merc go legal, it'll be to remove Masi.

    He'll hand his resignation in in a few months, watch.
    At this point I feel that's the goal, the way they'll get there though is to appeal the decision of the race, as that's their legal avenue.

    Which sucks for Red Bull, they're going to be dragged into an argument that isn't their fault and be used as the casus belli for getting Masi fired.


    Sports and Fitness mod, Brit with weird sleeping hours.
    Has good taste in ale, bad taste in D&D choices.

  3. #383
    Herald of the Titans Hansworst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Schiedam, the Netherlands
    Posts
    2,670
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Because finishing a race is the same as driving a handful of precession laps behind a safety car.
    Because running your main rival off track and get away with a slap on a wrist is totally comparable with a weather condition no one has influence on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  4. #384
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    No it's not fine. It's actually something pretty much every other driver has been pissed off about Max about and why he's pretty much joked about as being Crashstappen by certain groups of fans. That kind of move was phased out for a reason.
    Ricciardo is the king of divebombs. Wake up, divebombs are legal.

  5. #385
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    20,283
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbazz View Post
    Half a win, and that whole event was a farce. It's also entirely irrelevant to the topic?
    If you think the free points and the fact he was handed in the end 2 free wins for the season are irrelevant, you can’t do maths.

    There are also people arguing here that it *had* to be finished under a green flag.

  6. #386
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Cumbria, England
    Posts
    14,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    No it's not fine. It's actually something pretty much every other driver has been pissed off about Max about and why he's pretty much joked about as being Crashstappen by certain groups of fans. That kind of move was phased out for a reason.
    This.

    We hear the FIA talk all the time about wanting to make racing safer, and yet people are shocked when manoeuvres like this aren't rewarded, or even get penalised.


    Sports and Fitness mod, Brit with weird sleeping hours.
    Has good taste in ale, bad taste in D&D choices.

  7. #387
    Herald of the Titans Hansworst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Schiedam, the Netherlands
    Posts
    2,670
    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    Look where he's from, you won't reason with him. Dutch people are scary nationalist.
    Nice contribution to the conversation with that ad hominem dude.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  8. #388
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    Race should have finished under the safety car, which is boring but it's also how it should have ended. Mercedes earned the win by being ahead at that point, and for the majority of the race.




    If Hamilton goes into that turn as was his right, he gets straight up broadsided by Verstappen, that would be a collision of Verstappen's making and would only benefit one man. Max not being rewarded for trying to decide the title there and then by mutually assured destruction (much like he did at Monza) is the right call. Nobody should want to see a driver go out and try to have his own Senna/Prost moment to win a title.
    No they should have red flagged the race to allow the race to end under racing conditions. As for the overtake, Max made a legit clean but aggressive pass and Lewis made the choice not to back out of it. As soon as Lewis lost the line to the apex he would have backed out if there was a wall or a gravel trap, the one and only reason he didn't back out is because he had a runoff area that he could use to maintain his advantage.

    You can ask any racing driver this, and there are plenty of them giving that same opinion.



    Here's one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    If you think the free points and the fact he was handed in the end 2 free wins for the season are irrelevant, you can’t do maths.

    There are also people arguing here that it *had* to be finished under a green flag.

    The opportunity was the same for everyone, Lewis also got 7.5 free points and would have had 12.5 free points if he had qualified better. Lewis got a free win at Silverstone when he smashed Max into the wall and avoided any penalties, I thought he should have had a severe penalty for that extremely dangerous move.

    And what about Bottas carnage at Hungary taking out Max? You're attempting to use the rest of the season as some sort of justification for what? We're talking about what happened at Abu Dhabi, if you want to bring the rest of the season into it then good luck arguing your way out of Silverstone.
    Last edited by Bigbazz; 2021-12-13 at 07:07 PM.
    I7 6700K : 16GB DDR4 3000 : GTX1070 : Firestudio : Naga : G27

  9. #389
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    At this point I feel that's the goal, the way they'll get there though is to appeal the decision of the race, as that's their legal avenue.

    Which sucks for Red Bull, they're going to be dragged into an argument that isn't their fault and be used as the casus belli for getting Masi fired.
    I suspect their end goal is get Masi out and they'll "compromise" by letting MV keep the title and it'll all be quiet. FIA don't want a kerfuffle, neither do Mercedes. Sponsors don't want this all public.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by MakeMeLaugh View Post
    Ricciardo is the king of divebombs. Wake up, divebombs are legal.
    divebombs =/= late braking.
    1) Load the amount of weight I would deadlift onto the bench
    2) Unrack
    3) Crank out 15 reps
    4) Be ashamed of constantly skipping leg day

  10. #390
    Omg, now people think divebombs are dangerous and should not be legal hahahahahahaha.

    You there! 5s penalty for divebombing!

    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    I suspect their end goal is get Masi out and they'll "compromise" by letting MV keep the title and it'll all be quiet. FIA don't want a kerfuffle, neither do Mercedes. Sponsors don't want this all public.

    - - - Updated - - -



    divebombs =/= late braking.
    Divebomb is late braking dude.

  11. #391
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Cumbria, England
    Posts
    14,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbazz View Post
    No they should have red flagged the race to allow the race to end under racing conditions.
    I mean, I'd agree, would give both drivers the free tyre change at that point and we'd have a race, but had they done that and Hamilton won, I'd bet every penny on Horner complaining that it was an unnecessary red flag that gave Hamilton a much needed tyre change.


    Sports and Fitness mod, Brit with weird sleeping hours.
    Has good taste in ale, bad taste in D&D choices.

  12. #392
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    I mean, I'd agree, would give both drivers the free tyre change at that point and we'd have a race, but had they done that and Hamilton won, I'd bet every penny on Horner complaining that it was an unnecessary red flag that gave Hamilton a much needed tyre change.
    Well that's also a seperate argument - why can they change tyres under red flag conditions.
    1) Load the amount of weight I would deadlift onto the bench
    2) Unrack
    3) Crank out 15 reps
    4) Be ashamed of constantly skipping leg day

  13. #393
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Cumbria, England
    Posts
    14,348
    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    Well that's also a seperate argument - why can they change tyres under red flag conditions.
    Norris asked the same question a week ago. Guessing because everyone's in the same boat so no one gets an advantage.


    Sports and Fitness mod, Brit with weird sleeping hours.
    Has good taste in ale, bad taste in D&D choices.

  14. #394
    Herald of the Titans Hansworst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Schiedam, the Netherlands
    Posts
    2,670
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    I mean, I'd agree, would give both drivers the free tyre change at that point and we'd have a race, but had they done that and Hamilton won, I'd bet every penny on Horner complaining that it was an unnecessary red flag that gave Hamilton a much needed tyre change.
    I agree. Horner would have kept complaining. Wolff however has been acting erratic ever since Lauda sadly passed away. That was the guy who kept him grounded. Taking a lawyer to a meeting with the stewards really sounds like they had him there already case they lost.

    I agree Masi should be fired but not only about the SC situation in Abu Dhabi. The only thing he was consistent in this season was inconsistency.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  15. #395
    Moderator Northern Goblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Cumbria, England
    Posts
    14,348
    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    I agree Masi should be fired but not only about the SC situation in Abu Dhabi. The only thing he was consistent in this season was inconsistency.
    I mean even if we're now saying the race controller has absolute authority over the rules, Masi is not the fucking guy to have in that position.

    The level of incompetence and the thought of him having a whole season where it's established he can decide whatever at any time is horrifying.


    Sports and Fitness mod, Brit with weird sleeping hours.
    Has good taste in ale, bad taste in D&D choices.

  16. #396
    Quote Originally Posted by MakeMeLaugh View Post
    Divebomb is late braking dude.
    No it's not, divebombs usually run someone off track or cause contact and usually nothing to do with the racing line, just a desperate attempt to get past on the inside line. Late braking is just that.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8YtjEakiQU look how late his steering input is, he's beyond the apex. 0:46

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_jdcUVtaTU look where he steers in here. 0:48

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_f1dpx7Bd7g late braking

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoVE4H807hI late braking

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    Norris asked the same question a week ago. Guessing because everyone's in the same boat so no one gets an advantage.
    Norris has been consistently vocal about it. I like the suggestion after a red flag there are 3 laps under safety car, there you can change tyres if you wish and then SC restart.
    1) Load the amount of weight I would deadlift onto the bench
    2) Unrack
    3) Crank out 15 reps
    4) Be ashamed of constantly skipping leg day

  17. #397
    Herald of the Titans Hansworst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Schiedam, the Netherlands
    Posts
    2,670
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    I mean even if we're now saying the race controller has absolute authority over the rules, Masi is not the fucking guy to have in that position.

    The level of incompetence and the thought of him having a whole season where it's established he can decide whatever at any time is horrifying.
    I think we can all agree to that. Damn I miss Charlie Whiting.
    Masi decision to do standing starts in SA was more dangerous then any "divebombs" Max ever made. Hell, his decision to okay that track one day prior the FP should be reason alone to fire him.
    Last edited by Hansworst; 2021-12-13 at 07:23 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  18. #398
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    I mean even if we're now saying the race controller has absolute authority over the rules, Masi is not the fucking guy to have in that position.

    The level of incompetence and the thought of him having a whole season where it's established he can decide whatever at any time is horrifying.
    Honestly the "Complete authority over the rules." scares me also. How can you make plans if in the back of your mind you have to worry about "What if the person in charge has a funny 5 minutes?"

  19. #399
    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    I mean, I'd agree, would give both drivers the free tyre change at that point and we'd have a race, but had they done that and Hamilton won, I'd bet every penny on Horner complaining that it was an unnecessary red flag that gave Hamilton a much needed tyre change.
    I mean Horner would have a whine but the rules are clear about that one and it happens all the time. In hindsight red flagging the race was the right choice but I feel like Wolf would have been making just as much noise about a red flag, Wolf wanted the race to end under safety car, along with all the big Hamilton fans.

    Like I said I fully think Lewis deserved the win on merit, but I'm not a Max fan or a Lewis fan, I'm a fan of the sport and the winner isn't the fastest driver, it's the driver who crosses the line first. I just don't see any situation how you can overturn the result in any fair way.
    I7 6700K : 16GB DDR4 3000 : GTX1070 : Firestudio : Naga : G27

  20. #400
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Manchester
    Posts
    20,283
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbazz View Post
    No they should have red flagged the race to allow the race to end under racing conditions. As for the overtake, Max made a legit clean but aggressive pass and Lewis made the choice not to back out of it. As soon as Lewis lost the line to the apex he would have backed out if there was a wall or a gravel trap, the one and only reason he didn't back out is because he had a runoff area that he could use to maintain his advantage.

    You can ask any racing driver this, and there are plenty of them giving that same

    Here's one.




    The opportunity was the same for everyone, Lewis also got 7.5 free points and would have had 12.5 free points if he had qualified better. Lewis got a free win at Silverstone when he smashed Max into the wall and avoided any penalties, I thought he should have had a severe penalty for that extremely dangerous move.

    And what about Bottas carnage at Hungary taking out Max? You're attempting to use the rest of the season as some sort of justification for what? We're talking about what happened at Abu Dhabi, if you want to bring the rest of the season into it then good luck arguing your way out of Silverstone.
    He did receive penalties at Silverstone, they made no difference to the result because he was so far ahead, but he was penalised.

    Max took penalties that made no difference to the results in races as well.

    Those are issues with the penalty systems, there are clearly flaws but they’re separate issues I think.

    Either way, it’s relevant, like I say because people have been arguing the convention (not a rule) of finishing under a green flag for rushing the decision to green flag the race.

    Ultimately, it comes down to Masi using the same discretion to do what the fuck he wants and using that to benefit Max. Twice.

    If you’re arguing Lewis should have qualified better then, you should be arguing Max shouldn’t have fucked up his tires in qualification here.
    Last edited by Jessicka; 2021-12-13 at 07:26 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •