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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    I mean, if they’re gonna skimp on anything it’s the middle tier when subs are traditionally lowest. Also factor in the pandemic, I’m sure productivity has suffered a bit.
    Ok... but how about they just... You know. Don't skimp on anything?

    That's also an option here you know.
    Quote Originally Posted by smrund View Post
    I'm sorry sir, but we do not serve complimentary cheese when you bring your own whine.

  2. #22
    I'm less concerned about the art and more disappointed about the piece bonuses. That's what really disappoints me. Raiding needs some heavy zip for gear.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    Ok... but how about they just... You know. Don't skimp on anything?

    That's also an option here you know.
    Sure it is. But here’s my impression of wow activity by patch:

    Patch one... surge of new interest, lots of revenue at stake as you want players to buy box.

    Patch two... subs decline as people who burned themselves out in patch one unsubscribe.

    Patch three... game is finally a finished product, and raid is easier because of gear systems that progressively nerf it. People come back and play casually for a while, but eventually start getting bored, which creates hype for something new.

    Now when you say to not skimp on anything, what you mean is to split limited resources equally between second and third patch. If I’m blizzard, I through all the resources at the third patch because it lasts for much longer and because you’re trying to get the burnouts back. I don’t think “tier sets” will keep a burned out player from unsubbing at the end of the first patch, but I think it would encourage them to consider resubbing for third.

    But if you don’t mean that, the simple answer is profit. 2nd patch has the be the least revenue generating, why bother investing a ton in it?

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by La View Post
    This game really has a habit of being good at the start, sucking all through the middle, then getting good at the end. Every expansion recently.

    My questions if that's true is: Why bother, then?
    When was BFA's "being good" period?

    The end certainly wasn't. Corruptions were a complete balancing nightmare.

  5. #25
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by La View Post
    This game really has a habit of being good at the start, sucking all through the middle, then getting good at the end. Every expansion recently.

    My questions if that's true is: Why bother, then?
    That didn't happen, at all, with WoD or BFA. It literally just sucked the entire time.

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  6. #26
    for those looking for the relevant quotes, i'll post them.

    jeremy feasel: "But expect to hear more about tier sets as we move into the future. Not for 9.1, but potentially for future patches."

    jeremy feasel: "We don't have anything to announce today, but would eventually like to give everyone a Heritage Armor set."

    jeremy feasel: "Nothing (refering to customization options) in the short term but we're always looking for ideas from players, so please continue to submit your ideas for things that you'd like to see."

    jeremy feasel: "We're going to be extending the Soulbind trees and adding new Conduits, so rather than throwing new Soulbinds in, we're going to give you the opportunity to take the Soulbinds that you've already bonded with and grown to love, and give them a few more rows."

    so this one isn't accurate like the op claims. they ARE adding new conduits but they are also extending the soulbind trees to allow room for the old ones to still be used basically.




    lastly, one i want to call out myself because they haven't listened to us literally since shadowlands was announced on it.

    jeremy feasel: "I think that in both of these content updates, we're going to be seeing more frequent Covenant swapping and it's something that we need to be sensitive to. We need to be listening to player feedback about how it feels to try out some of these new things now that we're increasing their power levels and make that not feel like it's bad."

  7. #27
    Stood in the Fire RCA's Avatar
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    honestly the class tiers each raid was such a great interest for me, if not playing I'd always take a look at what they crafted. Now a days, it's just not the same...really hope the developers realize they lost some people without class based tier sets, as I cant be alone on this. oh well.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    Sure it is. But here’s my impression of wow activity by patch:

    Patch one... surge of new interest, lots of revenue at stake as you want players to buy box.

    Patch two... subs decline as people who burned themselves out in patch one unsubscribe.

    Patch three... game is finally a finished product, and raid is easier because of gear systems that progressively nerf it. People come back and play casually for a while, but eventually start getting bored, which creates hype for something new.

    Now when you say to not skimp on anything, what you mean is to split limited resources equally between second and third patch. If I’m blizzard, I through all the resources at the third patch because it lasts for much longer and because you’re trying to get the burnouts back. I don’t think “tier sets” will keep a burned out player from unsubbing at the end of the first patch, but I think it would encourage them to consider resubbing for third.

    But if you don’t mean that, the simple answer is profit. 2nd patch has the be the least revenue generating, why bother investing a ton in it?
    Now you're just telling us how it is. Yes, we know all that. But they can sure as hell put on their best shoes and make sure we get good fucking raids and content in general too.. You know, stuff worth resubbing over. I know they can, it's not an indie company afterall.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by SNES-1990 View Post
    Especially when you compare their output to Square Enix who have been in lockdown much much longer in Japan. With a smaller team too.
    Didn't Square cancel the last Ultimate raid?

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by SNES-1990 View Post
    This is so, SO underwhelming.

    Not only will we not be seeing class sets return in 9.1, but the raid armor sets are simply going to be a transmog-able version of the legendary sets that we've seen already.

    No new conduits either. No new customizations. No new heritage sets.

    Here's the interview on WoWhead: https://www.wowhead.com/news=321033....-mega#comments
    Tier sets are outdated. It completely sucks having anything up to 6 slots of your gear 'locked down' to the tier set, reducing gear progression\upgrades by a huge margin.

    They talked about empowered conduits, or something along those lines for 9.1, even if there are no new conduits.

    As for heritage... who cares. that's a little extra we get once in a while, far from a requirement every patch, or even something to be bummed out for not coming.

    As long as we have story progression, dungeon, zone, raid and balance of current systems (conduits, soulbinds, legendaries, and specs), it's a great patch for me. Everything else is gravy.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by aceperson View Post
    lastly, one i want to call out myself because they haven't listened to us literally since shadowlands was announced on it.
    yea, they barely listen to the community, just look at the increased raid drops, valor points for m+ upgrades with extra ilvl from several achievements like keystone master.

    that being said, going ham on everything the community asks is a very bad way to go, so i'm glad they're slow on pulling the trigger and make sure they're the right moves.

  11. #31
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    Oh how I wish I could say I'm surprised...
    wish granted for me, i admit i didn't even think that is option in first place?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Tier sets are outdated.
    tier sets are inconic to wow since ever, i have friends who left wow and yet always check and discuss with me about tier sets
    of course they stopped doing that since tier set removed, and any interest (or hope) they return is dead with it
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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    wish granted for me, i admit i didn't even think that is option in first place?
    Blizz had previously eluded before the expansion launched that, although they wouldn't be included in the first tier, tier sets would/could be making a return in future patches in Shadowlands.

    Ya know, getting our hopes up for obviously nothing.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Tier sets are outdated. It completely sucks having anything up to 6 slots of your gear 'locked down' to the tier set, reducing gear progression\upgrades by a huge margin.
    Make 6 pieces instead of 5, have a 2-set and 4-set bonus, and make one set per class. Make the non-sets either a nice recolor of the sets or something common to other sources.
    Yes, this makes gear progress slightly slower. You can't immediately replace every piece with a higher ilvl one in every situation. But you also get a nice bonus when you complete your set. Giving players something to strive for, something that usually feels good when it's completed, is well worth not being able to switch out a 213 item immediately with a 226.

  14. #34
    The Undying Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Damn my expectations were low but holy shit, recycling the legendary sets is a special kind of low.
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  15. #35
    The Patient Hastis's Avatar
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    Yeah they jusst dont want to make new sets models thats all they obvious can but whhy they should if u can give all 4 covenants most garbage sets and recycle old set which even isnt changed (maybe only colour) but hell yeah i love when druids look like demon hunter mmm yeah or when paladin is dressed like death knight t

  16. #36
    I am Murloc! Lord Pebbleton's Avatar
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    Fuck conduits new and old. Fuck seeing a purple drop from a boss in an expansion infamous for being loot starved and then realizing it's the heroic version of a subpar turd

  17. #37
    Thank Christ for that. Tier sets add nothing of value to the game and just make raiding a requirement. New conduits are unnecessary, the ones we have are annoying enough, adding more would make it worse.

    Glad they aren't forcing bad decisions for no reason.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    Makes sense, I never expected Tier sets in the first patch. Originally there was going to be no plan for them but the outcry for them made them change their mind. This change happened way too far into development to see in the first raid after Nathria.
    People demanded tier sets back in BfA. They had years to work on them for Shadowlands.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    Stop using covid as an excuse. If they didn't provide their employees with a means to do what they need to from home, it's on them as they're not hurting in terms of profit like the restaurants and other things are. That tired sad excuse needs to stop.
    Quote Originally Posted by SNES-1990 View Post
    Especially when you compare their output to Square Enix who have been in lockdown much much longer in Japan. With a smaller team too.
    So much this. Look at what other companies do, look what indie developers can achieve - and then compare those things to the efforts a multi billion dollar company like Blizzard does. Very disappointing.
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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by La View Post
    This game really has a habit of being good at the start, sucking all through the middle, then getting good at the end. Every expansion recently.

    My questions if that's true is: Why bother, then?
    To be fair, bfa was shit from Start to finish

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrod View Post
    Now when you say to not skimp on anything, what you mean is to split limited resources equally between second and third patch.
    No, I don't.

    I mean have three good patches. A patch should contain as much content as a patch does. I don't differentiate between "first, second, and third" patches because I don't want the second patch to be sub par - We wouldn't have people burning out and unsubbing if that were the case, as they'd remain interested in the new content.

    If they can't figure it out with their current model, that means they change their current model to have three good patches. (Or more, considering we used to get 4 raid-sized patches.)
    Quote Originally Posted by smrund View Post
    I'm sorry sir, but we do not serve complimentary cheese when you bring your own whine.

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