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  • worked for 17 years, will work 17 more

    30 27.52%
  • I like it this way

    11 10.09%
  • Gets boring after the novelty

    35 32.11%
  • I dont like it at all

    31 28.44%
  • Other

    2 1.83%
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  1. #41
    The Unstoppable Force Super Kami Dende's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMOTherapist View Post
    What do you think about it?

    There is non existant dynamic and social driven gameplay (apart from RP imaginary and pretend scenarios)
    Do you enjoy this system or you wished there was something new to this formula?
    The Game has survived and been the highest played in the Genre for nearly 2 decades.


    Obviously it's done something right.

  2. #42
    cross-expansion/horitzontal content = eventually you have too much relevant content and you run into issues too. or you end up with powercreep requiring some sort of expansion-esque or squish-esque reset anyways.

    expansion based content (aka tbc model) = cool in theory but in practice just leads to a lot of people guildhopping to tier 5 guilds once they have the loot from their tier 4 guilds, causing everybody with guild loyalty to get perma stuck in tier4.

    patch based content with cathcup = works best in practise by lowering barriers of entry. though to be honest how accessible you want the game to be is a design choice, but a logical one with the average age of players rising.

    where we are right now though we've overshot it a bit though, seeing how heavily encouraged rerolling to fotm specs every patch is in raiding, pvp and m+ is atm. the fact that you can set your clock by the frequency of squishes nowadays also means there is something really wrong.

  3. #43
    To infinity and beyond det's Avatar
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    "WoW's gameplay loop is entirely designed around novelty and reset patches " @MMOTherapist

    I yet have to see any .1, .2 or .3 patch "reset" my gear. New x-pacs kinda do that and all people who love TBC so much need to realize it started there. And the ones who said it was all better in TBC, well..they introduced the following novelty systems as well:

    -shamans for Alliance
    -paladins for Horde
    -flying
    -badge catch up
    -heroic 5 mans
    -voice chat


    Now you can argue we are getting too many more system...so I say fair enough. Might annoy you, to others it gives more option. I am sure some people rage already about the sheer existence of the path of Ascension in their Sanctum upgrades (though it really is the Brawler's guild". Even if they will never do it, they hat that fourth option. Well..what can you do /shrug

    What we get all the time however is catchup, and not only did ppl ask for it, they immediately in SL cried how it is not fast enough.

    Basing gameplay loops around novelty? How dare they...I want to play the same old shit for 20 years. That is how you sell your products and the free market of electronics or cars or even entertainment shows that this is the way to go. Sell old shit. Nobody is ever exited about a cooler car, a faster computer, better internet of the next gen consoles and smart phones.

    Do I need to add the sarcasm tag?

    Also: "Get's boring after the novelty" in the lead. Well..duh. What a surprise. Things get boring after the novelty. I swear that even works for sex and drugs.
    Last edited by det; 2021-02-27 at 11:01 AM.

  4. #44
    Yes, please tell me more about what the game does not have, self-proclaimed “MMO therapist”


    But let’s be honest: you don’t have any credentials other than perpetually hating on the game you’ve stated you don’t play anymore. A game which you’ve stated other people are wrong for liking because they don’t agree with you.


    What really is nonexistent here? Those aspects of the game? Or your common sense?

  5. #45
    I think people expect waaay too much from Blizzard now that they ( the players) are mostly veterans of the game. They ( Blizzard) are a business for profit and have no vested interest in alienating or torturing their customers. That being said, they aren’t directed by a focus group consortium of a balanced cross section of players and do tend to appear to ‘throw stuff at the wall to see if it sticks’ or ( appear to) make knee jerk reactions to obviously failed systems etc and that feels bad and as subscribers in a contract with reasonable expectations we do have a right to let them know our grievances. What is a fail point of the game in general, in my opinion only, is that there is now a second industry of professional players who feel that their level of play is ‘typical’ and that their opinions represent the typical player but, like a millionaire who is a politician trying to represent the public ( for example) they are not in touch with the common man ( or orc etc). Raiding( for example) is not fun for some people, it’s hard it requires homework and commitment and deserves the best loot for that but this game is not just for raiders or there wouldn’t be so much other stuff ( pet battles and lore for the sake of lore etc) - our beloved content creators would have you believe that you are missing out by not pushing yourself into the hardest content ( that they have every possible resource and a financial interest in completing). Some of us play to relax as we have jobs in the real world and doing homework just sucks ass - I’ve clicked my way without add ons for years and paid the price in terms of sucking but l’m using the game for my benefit- having fun slowly advancing and discovering- it’s not up to blizzard to provide your fun ( and if you aren’t having fun then why do you play)???

  6. #46
    Old God Mirishka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by natpick View Post
    its terrible,its all just throw away design all made to be easily changed or slightly altrered in next expansion,shame really with all that man power and wealth behind them,and a small indie company can come up with great simple ideas and sell 4 million copies in 2 weeks,blizz are stuck in a rut or unwilling to change.
    This is funny to me, because the devs of Valheim essentially copied Blizzard's MO for developing WoW. Take a genre that is traditionally punishing and 'hardcore' and make it into a casual, relaxed game (aside from bosses with occasionally cheap mechanics) that is much easier/less punishing than most of its contemporaries. It isn't a coincidence that the survival game which did away with most of the tedium is the one to blow up and sell 4 million+ copies in a week.
    My greatest fear is that one day, my MMO-Champion ignore list will run out of space.

  7. #47
    I left retail when I realized I was an hamster on a wheel
    this doesn't nullify my achievements from previous (good) expansions
    plus the game's look is nothing like I'm used to
    sad but that's life I guess, "no kings rule forever"

    the seasons "loop" and the boring more of the same "content and expansions" killed it for me so yes
    I'm having more fun doing content I've already done in classic than doing new content...just this fact was mind blowing for me when I realized it
    Last edited by Cæli; 2021-02-27 at 02:34 PM.

  8. #48
    I agree with you, the design currently feels like Diablo 3 seasons, the mmorpg, than WoW or another old school mmorpg. It has more in common today with Diablo 3 than it does vanilla WoW or EQ

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    The Game has survived and been the highest played in the Genre for nearly 2 decades.


    Obviously it's done something right.
    So does madden, and like wow, both are prettier but inferior products to their past selves

  9. #49
    The problem for the last decade has been that every new content patch completely invalidates all the content that came before it. As long as stuff is only designed for a lifetime of 6 months, nothing will change.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Art the Clown View Post
    Definitely need a change from the legion design we've had for the last 3 expansions. It's getting old and boring now. New expansions are feeling like big patches because the design is still the same.

    Hope they're working on some new stuff for whatever comes in the next expansion.
    Great comment I wholeheartedly agree. I LOVED Legion one of my fav expansions, so many cool new things to do in it, and it was a fresh and so fun, never stale or boring whatsoever.

    But lately with BfA ( Legion 2.0 ) and now Shadowlands ( Legion 3.0 ) I'm starting to hit a wall in boredom of the same old, same old.

    And no, it's not just WoW or I am getting burned out or getting older with different interests, no it's specifically shitty WoW development. I love WoW, but we're basically on the third expansion in a row that have the stupid crappy systems and same stuff again and again.

    World Quests were great and exciting in Legion, then ok BfA, but now totally suck in SL. What happened to the kill one boss WQ's, instead we get these tedious and boring fill the XP bar WQ's and now they seem to take longer, one kill only gives you 1% or 2%, meaning it takes FOREVER to complete it, and by the time I hit 100% and complete the World Quest I am so freaking bored and frustrated.

    And the systems made in Legion were cool, and fresh, Artifacts and Legendary's, and Netherlight Crucible, etc... Then Blizzard blows it all up, and creates a whole new system for BfA with Azerite, and Essences, and Corruption ( Ugh the worst ) and then the next expansion Shadowlands, they nuke it all again, and give us a whole new set of stupid systems with Covenants, and Soul binds, and blah, blah, blah, holy fuck just stop this already Blizz.

    Stop creating brand new game systems, it's the worst. We don't need Artifact or Azerite, or Covenant gear.

    We don't want to grind for AP, or Azerite or Anima.

    We don't want worse World Quests that are very time consuming and just boring AF.
    Last edited by Zorachus; 2021-02-27 at 04:39 PM.

  11. #51
    Merely a Setback Queen of Hamsters's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NordWitcher View Post
    What was the problem with WTLK? All I remember is that A small minority complained that they felt forced to run 10 and 25M raids for loot drops since they stopped different gear. They also didn’t share the same lockout. That was the only complaint.

    The funny thing is that even though TBC and WTLK were considered “raiding” expansions there was personally less burnout. You did it if you wanted to. Usually 10M were for PUGs and 25M were for your guild runs. Dungeons were fun and basic. Now dungeons are just a mechanic fight because of Mythics and making it competitive.

    Then you have so many other systems at play all to facilitate an artificial grind that you are forced into to grow your character’s power.
    People were sat in cities with nothing to do between resets. Weekly badge farm and raiding was the PVE endgame.

    They simply went the other way and made the maintenance game too much, or so I thought... Positive reports on player engagement throughout BfA makes it seem as if people like what the game has become overall. Jury's out on what it'll look like for SL though.

    I miss Pandaria. It had a nice balance between varied endgame and raid-logging.
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    Never underestimate the speed at which the MMO-C gamerboys will jump into defense of sexual miscreants. Womyn are meanies...

  12. #52
    I like it, progression is what I enjoy.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Maruka View Post
    I think the fact that you know your gear is going to be totally irrelevant within a certain time frame makes it not economical timewise to go for small minor upgrades that in previous expansions were totally worth it. Id rather either level an alt or lapse my sub for the time.
    This has been the case since literally forever.


    Please give examples of these "previous expansions" when minor gear upgrades were totally worth it.


    The game hasn't changed. Your ideas of whats worth spending your time on is whats changed.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by GUZ View Post
    I would like real player housing and a guild hall to chill with my homies fuck these covenants...and why didnt they add a cov recall
    More Time Played metric.

    OT: WoW has been repeating the same expansion since Legion over and over. It's not a surprise. They will continue to do it because people like shallow content and repetitiveness. It's the same idea that gets mobile users locked in.

  15. #55
    having a blast playing classic where some gear is good and you keep it..


    yes retail has better class balance , better rotation , looks better and feels better..

    but at the end of the day i like playing Classic and feeling that "long term" progress . Retail is just eat sleep loot repeat and reset

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    The Game has survived and been the highest played in the Genre for nearly 2 decades.


    Obviously it's done something right.
    I believe if they didn't make a massive attempt with Legion the game would've barely made a comeback. Who knows what would've happened..

    Having two rough/disappointing expansions in a row, is something that we have yet to experience. Nowdays everyone is making these claims with BFA and SLs the numbers reflect this. Drastic cuts were in implemented later in BFA and it really showed the playerbase reaction: dwindling. Launch should've brought a couple people back but not the same numbers as BFA. As it would've been broadcasted.

    They need to stop cutting corners, less stuff to obtain, less content to do, recycled systems. Also on a more serious note cutting jobs. It's not working. The justification for them is probably we are bringing in profit still, that's not addressing real issues of losing more and more customers over time.

    Where they are at after the biggest event for them: Blizzcon. (how many customers actually watched what they had to offer) I feel should be the real eye opener.
    Last edited by Kixxenn; 2021-02-27 at 05:34 PM.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    The problem for the last decade has been that every new content patch completely invalidates all the content that came before it. As long as stuff is only designed for a lifetime of 6 months, nothing will change.
    This has been the case for longer than a decade, with vanilla even being debatable. Once your guild is clearing BWL there is very little reason to do MC. A few random pieces and legendary farm but the vast majority of that gear is obsolete.

    There is also something to be said about being done with a raid. I personally hate farming a raid for even 6 months. I sure as hell do not want to keep farming said raid for 2 years to get X item.

  18. #58
    I dont like it but this is WoW, this is never getting changed. It's always going to be a themepark. I just wish Blizzard incentivized people to actually play the content they're designing, instead of farming pets and old raids.
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  19. #59
    Not at all. And it gets me wondering.

    For some reason Blizzard has this hard on to keep us in game as long as possible. Why? It doesn't matter if I spend 1 hour a day in game, or 5 hours to get the chores done. I still pay for the sub that's based on calendar months, not time spent in game.

    How come Wotlk's model worked? There wasn't that MUCH to do. But the things that were there to do kept us engaged enough to renew our subs.

    IDK. The current game design isnt very appealing to me. Like, most of the time I feel just relief after a daily chores grind. Which of course isnt required per se, but oh well... I'm that kind of player that would like to collect all the advantages.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    You don't need to be a chef to critique food.
    No, but you need to understand it, otherwise you are just another idiot with a shit opinion

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