Realistic portrayal of the Alliance within World of Warcraft

[Raisei]

He also willingly throws away lives of a "suicide army" and "lets the trolls grieve" while not pushing Alliance advantage on Zandalar and generally seemingly wants peace no matter how many lives will be lost BECAUSE of it. Yes, his pacifism kills as many as Sylvanas warmongering.

1) The point about letting the trolls grieve and doing anything else would make the Alliance like the Horde is made by Jaina, not Anduin. He just agrees.

2) Using troops as a distraction is a very standard military move and usually results in those troops dying. It's not great, but that is how warfare works. You can value as soldiers life, but you need to be able to sacrifice it too. In this case the troops were even fully aware of it and volunteered. This would rarely be the case in reality.

3) The entire war was started by Sylvanas. Anduin is not in this war to be the agressor or wipe the Horde out, he is defending his people and wants justice for the Banshee's crimes. The Horde could have immediatedly turned on her after the horrific genocide of Teldrassil, but instead they decided that it might be fun to follow the mass murderer. All lives lost in this war are the fault of Sylvanas and the Horde, no one else.

[Hellobolis]

As i already mentioned - Ashenvale is not retaken yet. Plus i am not arguing about humans having it easy, but making those "peaces" with the Horde never worked and never will work and will get more people killed down the line when they throw another "surprise genocide" at Alliance.

Eh, ashenvale has been going back and forth ever since war3. probably the most fluidly controlled zones there is. i'm sure it'll bounce back soon enough.

[VladlTutushkin]

1) The point about letting the trolls grieve and doing anything else would make the Alliance like the Horde is made by Jaina, not Anduin. He just agrees.

2) Using troops as a distraction is a very standard military move and usually results in those troops dying. It's not great, but that is how warfare works. You can value as soldiers life, but you need to be able to sacrifice it too. In this case the troops were even fully aware of it and volunteered. This would rarely be the case in reality.

3) The entire war was started by Sylvanas. Anduin is not in this war to be the agressor or wipe the Horde out, he is defending his people and wants justice for the Banshee's crimes. The Horde could have immediatedly turned on her after the horrific genocide of Teldrassil, but instead they decided that it might be fun to follow the mass murderer. All lives lost in this war are the fault of Sylvanas and the Horde, no one else.

And he allowed horde off the hook without even flinching despite them only turning on her because she turned on them. He brought no justice for horde's crimes. And yes, even if he had more reasons to stop the war thats fine. But his position as a King is that he REALLY believes in peace. A smart move would have being to ramp up military research and production to roll the horde over next time and immediately start preparing for another war. Or alternatively do them a courtesy back and "surprise genocide" one of their races after Shadowlands.

[MrPaladinGuy]

[VladlTutushkin]

Eh, ashenvale has been going back and forth ever since war3. probably the most fluidly controlled zones there is. i'm sure it'll bounce back soon enough.

Ashenvale was officially decided to be Alliance land , in exchange for Azshara going fully horde. So him not demanding its return is treachery and also feeding horde resources for free.

[Firann]

Let's also not forget that Anduin:
1. Is a student o Velen
2. Lived for a while in Ironforge and was trained in combat by Magni (might be wrong) and played a role in Moira joining back
3. Genn sees him as a son


That mea s that he is favores by three of the original memebers of the Alliance, and considering gnomes just follow the dwarves and humans around thats 4.

The newer allied races also would have no issue with him given his connection with Jaina, Turalion and Alleria for obvious reasons and the Mechs would just go with their kin anyway.

That means the only race that might have a grudge against Anduin being the High King would be the NE who to be fair don't fit with the others anyway!

[Soikona]

And he allowed horde off the hook without even flinching despite them only turning on her because she turned on them. He brought no justice for horde's crimes. And yes, even if he had more reasons to stop the war thats fine. But his position as a King is that he REALLY believes in peace. A smart move would have being to ramp up military research and production to roll the horde over next time and immediately start preparing for another war. Or alternatively do them a courtesy back and "surprise genocide" one of their races after Shadowlands.

What do you expect? The alliance won the war, again, the alliance can’t exactly completely defeat the horde. If that happened, what would the horde players play? To keep half the player base happy, this is the best Blizzard can do.

[Soon-TM]

So he literally went from a cripple to a powerful god like being deity in just a few expansions? Sounds mary sueish

Anduin is the biggest Mary Sue in the story these days. He has even managed to outrank Thrall and Sylvanas in that regard, which is no small merit lawl. Depending on how SL ends, he could very well dethrone Med'an as the ultimate Sue of the Warcraft universe.

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Sounds a lot like Garrosh, honestly. Sick with pox, exiled to Garadar, told he was too weak to be a real orc and would be better off dead, and wracked with crippling depression. Then he's commanding armies, fighting dragons, and forging world- and time-spanning threats in just a few expansions.

While that's correct, Garrosh was never presented as the walking morality litmus of Warcraft - quite the opposite, in fact.

[VladlTutushkin]

What do you expect? The alliance won the war, again, the alliance can’t exactly completely defeat the horde. If that happened, what would the horde players play? To keep half the player base happy, this is the best Blizzard can do.

Then they shouldnt have started the war OR kept it "armies beating on each other" instead of running the whole "war is hell" genocide and war crime fiesta.

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Let's also not forget that Anduin:
1. Is a student o Velen
2. Lived for a while in Ironforge and was trained in combat by Magni (might be wrong) and played a role in Moira joining back
3. Genn sees him as a son


That mea s that he is favores by three of the original memebers of the Alliance, and considering gnomes just follow the dwarves and humans around thats 4.

The newer allied races also would have no issue with him given his connection with Jaina, Turalion and Alleria for obvious reasons and the Mechs would just go with their kin anyway.

That means the only race that might have a grudge against Anduin being the High King would be the NE who to be fair don't fit with the others anyway!

And that dosent mean that NEs can be used as a sacrifice to achieve "peace". Also, "dont fit" dosent work anymore since they fought and died for that Alliance but apparently they "dont fit" and "dont matter".

[Raisei]

What do you expect? The alliance won the war, again, the alliance can’t exactly completely defeat the horde. If that happened, what would the horde players play? To keep half the player base happy, this is the best Blizzard can do.

Indeed, the only reason why the Horde still exists is this. No side can ever win this war.

If Anduin spares the Horde, they keep saying how much of a pussy he is and how he is a terrible king.

If Anduin had wiped the Horde out they would go ballistic over the genocidal maniac.

Anduin can't win and neither can Blizzard.

[VladlTutushkin]

Indeed, the only reason why the Horde still exists is this. No side can ever win this war.

If Anduin spares the Horde, they keep saying how much of a pussy he is and how he is a terrible king.

If Anduin had wiped the Horde out they would go ballistic over the genocidal maniac.

Anduin can't win and neither can Blizzard.

If Anduin inflicted a genocide on the horde after BfA or during it Alliance players would have loved him more then any other racial leader in the whole faction.

[Le Conceptuel]

Realistic, as you know, means accounting for the impact of having a ten thousand year-old Elven priestess and a thirteen thousand year-old prophet in the Allied Forces.

[Combatbutler]

That level of complexity has never really existed throughout the entire warcraft history and it will most likely never happen, the universe is hardly fleshed out little is known about cultures, except for very broad-strokes and a stereotype attached, thne it is all meshed together and consistency is one of their least priorities, the result is well messy and shallow

[rogueMatthias]

I would have agreed originally, the "High King" thing was always stupid.

But now the Night Elves, Gilneans, Dreani, Void Elves and Gnomes are all refugees. SW Kingdom is the only one left with the military to protect them all.

[Soon-TM]

I would have agreed originally, the "High King" thing was always stupid.

But now the Night Elves, Gilneans, Dreani, Void Elves and Gnomes are all refugees. SW Kingdom is the only one left with the military to protect them all.

Draenei aren't refugees, ditto for Gnomes. Last time I checked, the Exodar and Gnomeregan were doing just fine (the latter is fully reclaimed lorewise).

[Raisei]

If Anduin inflicted a genocide on the horde after BfA or during it Alliance players would have loved him more then any other racial leader in the whole faction.

Some, maybe. In my opinion the reluctance to commit genocide is what sets the Alliance so drastically apart from the Horde. We could have annihilated the Horde several times over but we are not doing it because that would make us just like them.
Which is exactly the realization that Jaina arrives at during Warcrimes. She is glad she did not destroy Orgimmar, because she would have become just like Garrosh and she doesn't want that. Same for me.

I like being on the right side and not having to constantly defend what my faction does because it keeps piling warcrimes on top of warcrimes whenever it is bored. I don't need some grimdark fantasy world where everyone stabs everyone in the back because it is convenient and the kiddies go nuts when a guy crushes another guys skull with his bare hands.

Is that realistic? Sure. Reality sucks. Humans are monsters. But why would I need that in my fantasy world? I could just as well watch the news or read from authors like Martin that pander to the blood-thirsty crowd.

The Alliance is the faction of heroes, so it can't just go around genociding, because that is not it's identity.

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Draenei aren't refugees, ditto for Gnomes. Last time I checked, the Exodar and Gnomeregan were doing just fine (the latter is fully reclaimed lorewise).

For now. When the Horde gets that itch again the Draenei will be the next.

[Combatbutler]

The Alliance is the faction of heroes, so it can't just go around genociding, because that is not it's identity.

But it does commit genocide all the time, just not against the horde. The lesser(kobolds, gnolls, trogs) and villain races (naga, aqir, mantid) are usually bombed into oblivion by both factions, natives are driven off their land etc.

[Mic_128]

If the Alliance was real, everyone would riot because there's so many people in towns and cities, and like, 3 residences.

[Soon-TM]

Some, maybe. In my opinion the reluctance to commit genocide is what sets the Alliance so drastically apart from the Horde. We could have annihilated the Horde several times over but we are not doing it because that would make us just like them.
Which is exactly the realization that Jaina arrives at during Warcrimes. She is glad she did not destroy Orgimmar, because she would have become just like Garrosh and she doesn't want that. Same for me.

I like being on the right side and not having to constantly defend what my faction does because it keeps piling warcrimes on top of warcrimes whenever it is bored. I don't need some grimdark fantasy world where everyone stabs everyone in the back because it is convenient and the kiddies go nuts when a guy crushes another guys skull with his bare hands.

Is that realistic? Sure. Reality sucks. Humans are monsters. But why would I need that in my fantasy world? I could just as well watch the news or read from authors like Martin that pander to the blood-thirsty crowd.

The Alliance is the faction of heroes, so it can't just go around genociding, because that is not it's identity.

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For now. When the Horde gets that itch again the Draenei will be the next.

Nah, at least the Exodar (and Silvermoon, for that matter) is 100% guaranteed against fire and... Everything else, even if only because Blizzard has shown time and time again that it cannot/doesn't want to revamp the Draenei/BE starting zones. Which I'm fine with btw, since they are probably some of the most immersive zones ever made in WoW.

Now, as far as Gnomes are concerned...

[VladlTutushkin]

I would have agreed originally, the "High King" thing was always stupid.

But now the Night Elves, Gilneans, Dreani, Void Elves and Gnomes are all refugees. SW Kingdom is the only one left with the military to protect them all.

Night elves are refugees BECAUSE of High King and Alliance and Gilneans were promised Gilneas to be retaken and yet no moves were done to achieve that for years by the Alliance.