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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Yes, your historical ignorance about unions is very obvious. I'm talking about the literal decades dating back to Reagan, and even earlier. You have a lot of catching up to do on this topic.
    Your ignorance about what I wrote is obvious. YOu spew all this BS that has nothing to do with how the union I speak of operated. But your defening siilnece and refusing to condemn unions is always there. Spinning, dodging, and deflecting like a politican while refusing to address the actual issue.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Your ignorance about what I wrote is obvious. YOu spew all this BS that has nothing to do with how the union I speak of operated. But your defening siilnece and refusing to condemn unions is always there. Spinning, dodging, and deflecting like a politican while refusing to address the actual issue.
    You think that decades of whittling away union power has no effect on unions ability to bargain? What literal alternate reality hell do you live in?

    The problem is you want to address "the issue" thinking that it exists in a bubble, detached from any context and/or history. It doesn't yo, that's not how reality works.

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by Karreck View Post
    You are making our point for us when it comes to Amazon.
    Show me where Amazon intimidated anyone. Because you clearly insult every single worker of being unable to think for themselves.

  4. #424
    Stood in the Fire Karreck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Show me where Amazon intimidated anyone. Because you clearly insult every single worker of being unable to think for themselves.
    Like you insulted every single union worker of being unable to think for themselves?

    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    They were all liberals who were more than happy to eat whatever their union shoveled to them.
    Pot, Kettle


    Also, for your reference.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/t...-virginia.html
    Princesses can kill knights to rescue dragons.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Show me where Amazon intimidated anyone. Because you clearly insult every single worker of being unable to think for themselves.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...ng-conditions/

    Remember that time Amazon fired an employee pushing for unionization?

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by Karreck View Post
    Like you insulted every single union worker of being unable to think for themselves?
    Not what I did. I described exactly what those union members were doing. They were thinking for themselves. In fact, they were only thinking for themselves and nobody else in the union. As long as they maintained pension and benefits, the union leadership could do whatever they want. They were the majority. Screw everyone else who could have used the extra money.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...ng-conditions/

    Remember that time Amazon fired an employee pushing for unionization?
    Not why they fired him. But we know that you spin, just like the far left post, so just more BS from you.

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Not why they fired him. But we know that you spin, just like the far left post, so just more BS from you.
    Amazon claims Long violated safety rules by putting a fallen package back on a robot in an area where people aren't supposed to be...which also is in no way fenced off to prevent people from accidentally entering that area.

    Long was pushing for more safety at the facilities like...a way to put protective measures to prevent any accidents that may happen by people unintentionally ending up in the robot area.

    Man, this is top quality comedy dude.

  8. #428
    Stood in the Fire Karreck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Not what I did. I described exactly what those union members were doing. They were thinking for themselves. In fact, they were only thinking for themselves and nobody else in the union. As long as they maintained pension and benefits, the union leadership could do whatever they want. They were the majority. Screw everyone else who could have used the extra money.
    But everybody got the Pension and Benefits, including your family members right? So they didn't really lose out did they? The Union bargained on their behalf, gains were made, and the majority of the membership approved because they got benefits.
    We call this Working as Intended.
    How was this union bad if it got benefits for it's members and the majority of members supported this?
    Princesses can kill knights to rescue dragons.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Don't believe the union propaganda. And by the way, you cannot get fired for voting to unionize. That is illegal.
    As long as they don't mention the reason, you can be fired.

  10. #430
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    As long as they don't mention the reason, you can be fired.
    More specifically, as long as they don't mention an illegal reason, they can fire you.

    "Ted, you're fired."
    "What? Why?"
    "Because you're named Ted."
    "But . . . what about Ted in Accounting? Is he fired?"
    "Oh, no, Accounting Ted is cool."

    Totally legit in at-will employment states.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Amazon claims Long violated safety rules by putting a fallen package back on a robot in an area where people aren't supposed to be...which also is in no way fenced off to prevent people from accidentally entering that area.

    Long was pushing for more safety at the facilities like...a way to put protective measures to prevent any accidents that may happen by people unintentionally ending up in the robot area.

    Man, this is top quality comedy dude.
    Well, he did. Protesting thngs doesn't give you a free pass to break the rules. BUt I forgot you are also one who thinks it is OK to loot and vandalizae other people property. What is high comedy is you condoning workers blatantly breaking safety rules Your BS spin is amazing. You also lied when you originally claimed he was fired for trying to unionize. Just more of your lies.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Karreck View Post
    But everybody got the Pension and Benefits, including your family members right? So they didn't really lose out did they? The Union bargained on their behalf, gains were made, and the majority of the membership approved because they got benefits.
    We call this Working as Intended.
    How was this union bad if it got benefits for it's members and the majority of members supported this?
    You are seriously going to argue that a union that does nothing to increases the wages of it's workers is a good one? So you are OK with slave wages as long as they get benefits. Got it. THe union is not working as intended when workers are screwed over to appease the fat cats in the majority. So I guess making it harder to pay the bills and put foods on the table also = working as intended. What fantasy are you living in that that make that a good union?

  12. #432
    Being against higher pay, better benefits, and improved work conditions is a strange position to take.

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    BUt I forgot you are also one who thinks it is OK to loot and vandalizae other people property.
    I am? Citation needed*

    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    What is high comedy is you condoning workers blatantly breaking safety rules Your BS spin is amazing.
    So...you didn't read the article then. Not remotely surprising.

  14. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blur4stuff View Post
    Being against higher pay, better benefits, and improved work conditions is a strange position to take.
    Very normal if you're far better off than the people that would benefit from unions.

  15. #435
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    You are seriously going to argue that a union that does nothing to increases the wages of it's workers is a good one?
    When it's wages vs. health care and they can only get one, and the union majority prefers health care yes, that's how it works. It's not a bespoke union where everyone is their own mini-union. It's a democracy, so the majority gets to pick what they do.

    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    So you are OK with slave wages as long as they get benefits.
    This pathetic strawman doesn't even have any straw. What is this dude?

    You clearly have no idea how unions actually operate, alongside your historical illiteracy of unions, and I seriously doubt you know anyone even in a union based on how you write about them.

  16. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    You are seriously going to argue that a union that does nothing to increases the wages of it's workers is a good one? So you are OK with slave wages as long as they get benefits. Got it. THe union is not working as intended when workers are screwed over to appease the fat cats in the majority. So I guess making it harder to pay the bills and put foods on the table also = working as intended. What fantasy are you living in that that make that a good union?
    But if everybody is making "slave wages", then why are the majority "fat cats"?

    Here what this situation sounds like. Your "family members" wanted more than the majority wanted, or than the union could bargain for, and got pissed that their personal wants were not met. What you, and your "family members", clearly don't understand is that unions try to bargain with the following mindset.
    A. What do the majority of our members want?
    B. What do we have the best chance of getting for our members?
    C. What will benefit the majority of our members?

    Based on your own statements, the union got pensions and benefits for their members, the majority were happy with this result, and the majority did not push for more. Is a union supposed to put in the resources and effort pushing for something that the minority of their members want?
    Princesses can kill knights to rescue dragons.

  17. #437
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    So the personal experinces of my family members don't count. Oh right, only the positive ones count.
    We're not saying those didn't happen. We're saying that your family being angry that their union opposed segregating the workplace is a good thing.

  18. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    Show me where Amazon intimidated anyone. Because you clearly insult every single worker of being unable to think for themselves.
    Here, they killed the postal worker:
    Trump is back to slamming Amazon and other online retailers for killing the US Postal Service
    https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...se-usps-2020-4

    They are killing mall workers:
    Trump says Amazon 'destroying' shopping malls, hollowing out towns
    https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/...stroying-malls
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  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by Karreck View Post
    But if everybody is making "slave wages", then why are the majority "fat cats"?

    Here what this situation sounds like. Your "family members" wanted more than the majority wanted, or than the union could bargain for, and got pissed that their personal wants were not met. What you, and your "family members", clearly don't understand is that unions try to bargain with the following mindset.
    A. What do the majority of our members want?
    B. What do we have the best chance of getting for our members?
    C. What will benefit the majority of our members?

    Based on your own statements, the union got pensions and benefits for their members, the majority were happy with this result, and the majority did not push for more. Is a union supposed to put in the resources and effort pushing for something that the minority of their members want?
    Yeah, it seems like his family members wanted special kickbacks from management and undermine the integrity of the union. Basically bootlickers.

  20. #440
    The trick to unionising is... it needs to be corporate-wide at minimum, industry-wide at best. Not per location. That's why these guys fail. If you do it per plant, all you do is give the company an incentive to just close that plant. That's dumb shit. You need to get ALL Amazon workers in on this, then they can actually shut the company down if demands are not met. See how the greedy fucks in upper management deal with that. There's not enough Mexicans in the US to just replace ALL Amazon workers.
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