Virgin Hyperloop's Historic Pod is Going to the Smithsonian

[Edge-]

Thanks for finding that. Hopefully other posters who are perpetually confused about total global involvement can find a new hobby to bitch about.

Except that's not what this is, it's companies in those countries working together to create joint standards (a la USB standards etc.). That's not additional investment from the countries from what I can tell.

[cubby]

Except that's not what this is, it's companies in those countries working together to create joint standards (a la USB standards etc.). That's not additional investment from the countries from what I can tell.

You're right - I didn't mean to phrase it like that was the list of ongoing projects. Sorry about that. I just mean there is great international interest in this project, with several municipalities (in various forms) working on various stages. The kind of work you linked is demonstrative of those ongoing projects.

[Belize]

Great! So we’re agreed that it only needs to be as safe as other forms of high speed travel. Glad we’re on the same page that safety isn’t the limiting factor.

You're deliberately missing the point that it has more points of failure due to needing to be in a vacuum.

I can develop a car that's powered by blowing up TNT behind it, and add a bunch of safety features, but it wouldn't change the basic fact that's it'd be inherently less safe than a normal car

[Heathy]

I remember watching a video on how this thing was never going to happen, it does have many points of failure, a single hole in the tube will pretty much kill everyone riding a 'tube'. you have probably 100s of miles of exposed tube that is open to pretty much anyone. 100s of miles of temperature differentiation where parts of the tube expand and contract more or less than other parts. yeah its literally a pipe dream that this will ever be safe. all it would take is for someone to shoot a hole in the side of the thing and you have air travelling up that pipe with the same force as a brick wall.

like in a traditional train, if something happens ahead a long the track, a second train can stop or divert, to avoid it, but in this hyperloop if a breach happens, you're fucked even if you were 20 miles away.

[Fargus]

You mean when a random shooter pressurizes the loop? A fire is dealt with like all fires, with a fire extinguisher. What happens when someone has a heart attack on any train that’s en route? Please, explain how any of these questions are complicated...

Have you actually seen the Hyperloop before? It's not like your standard train track. If the pod bursts on fire, and you're in it... how are you going to extinguish that flame without passing out from the smoke first? How are going to get out of the pod, in a very small and dark tunnel, to do so... it barely fits the capsule? How is the ambulance going to get fast and hazard-free access to the tunnel itself if it's sealed and up high on a support column? Every minute counts with someone having a heart attack. What if there's another medical emergency, like someone having a seizure? This article goes into depth a little more.

Didn't see any emergency exits in the plan nor the prototype. How will an emergency exit even work if the entire system is in a near vacuum? These are all engineering challenges that make this system pretty much impractical. It's a death trap. Hell, you haven't even addressed the issue of a random shooter. Do you know what happens when there's a bullet-size hole breach in a system like that. I'll let you steam on that one for a little if you think that isn't so complicated to solve...

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No, it doesn’t have more points of failure than an airplane. It may have a few more than a standard train, but none of them are insurmountable. Or even remotely similar to your silly example.

I hope to god you're not in charge of building or designing bridges, aircraft, etc

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I have - several times when you've asked previously.

You're lying and anyone who can search your posts on the subject can see that.

Your emotional state regarding Musk is entirely relevant - we only have to look at your ridiculous posting history to see you only come out of the woodwork.

I'm not saying the questions are irrational and hysterical - I'm saying YOU are irrational and hysterical - because you're just blinded by your emotionally based hatred for Musk. It's pathetic. And then to call me a liar...this is why no one takes you seriously. I mean...you can't even read an avatar correctly.

Wasting your time to dig up my posting history to point-score (the link doesn't even work, great job Sherlock), I mean look how you're reacting to people who are negative about the Hyperloop. It's not just me you're being childish towards.

Oh sweetie...really? You've been telling us that it might go from a Hyperloop to a maglev construct if the technical issues aren't worked out in the near future. Please link that for us - we'll wait.

No, we've been telling you from the start that the initial vision and design is just not practical. Not from an engineering standpoint. Not from an economical one.

[arandomuser]

And?

An exhibition of an incredibly impractical concept that still isn't transporting anyone... not sure how this is threadworthy. Btw, the idea of a Hyperloop has been around for over a century already.

BUT Elon smokes weed so hes obv awsome populist megabrain and he talks to bro jogan haha look at me imsosmart

[Forogil]

Wasting your time to dig up my posting history to point-score (the link doesn't even work, great job Sherlock), I mean look how you're reacting to people who are negative about the Hyperloop. It's not just me you're being childish towards.

And almost two years ago in a previous thread he claimed that Hyperloop was "under construction" in several places.

In reality it was either tests or just planned for the future.
The only firm date for actual construction was that HyperloopTT (not Virgin Hyperloop) should have started construction of its first commercial system Q3 2019. Has it? (Originally it was a commercial system - now it seems to be a "prototype" which can mean anything.)

[Yriel]

Thanks for proving my point - the solar roads aren't in a museum because they won't work

[...]

Because all those engineers and companies and cities and countries don't know what you know?

Well he have companies here in Germany that build solar roadways, we have cities paying for them, at least one i know of has been build (a bycicle roadway), it doesn't produce energy, has massive overheating problems and is constantly broken.
Just because companies and cities are involved doesn't mean it's not nonsense.

[Zuben]

Security checks at airports are needed due to the risk and publicity of an exploding bomb. Saying that it's not needed for a new high speed train in vacuum seems like hubris.

I'm not a security or risk assessment expert, I'm just comparing operating a Hyperloop to operating a regular railway. Why don't regular trains require any hassle?

[Sorensen]

the subway was invented decades before musk was even born. did you just fall asleep in basic history class when they discussed new york's extensive subway construction in the late 1800's and early 1900's?

No I just made a good joke in a thread where most people can't see beyond the current week and have an aditude of "if we can't do it now, well never be able to."

[Forogil]

I'm not a security or risk assessment expert, I'm just comparing operating a Hyperloop to operating a regular railway. Why don't regular trains require any hassle?

Partially historical reasons and partially due to a good risk assessment. Since energy increases as velocity squared higher speed naturally imply higher risks - i.e. tripling the velocity (as hyped compared to regular bullet trains) almost increases the energy tenfold and energy kills, and a near vacuum is an additional risk factor.
(And many trains run considerably slower, and thus with less energy.)

If the new idea is to run them underground that adds other/additional safety considerations - we know how to reduce that risk for existing trains, but that adds a costly infrastructure and the new tunnel-digging ideas by Musk seems to skip those.

Note that there have been a number of terrorism attacks against trains - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ailway_systems - but not sufficient to take major precautions in most countries compared to the number of daily commuters. However, Hyperloop is a new mode of transportation, so I would expect some extra attention.

Additionally a similar check for trains as for airplanes would increase the cost and time considerably (someone needs to check everyone), and wouldn't substantially reduce the risk since that would lead to large crowds that terrorists could attack - by placing sarin gas containers or similar stuff in the queue area as in the Tokyo subway attack.

[Zuben]

Partially historical reasons and partially due to a good risk assessment. Since energy increases as velocity squared higher speed naturally imply higher risks - i.e. tripling the velocity (as hyped compared to regular bullet trains) almost increases the energy tenfold and energy kills, and a near vacuum is an additional risk factor.
(And many trains run considerably slower, and thus with less energy.)

If the new idea is to run them underground that adds other/additional safety considerations - we know how to reduce that risk for existing trains, but that adds a costly infrastructure and the new tunnel-digging ideas by Musk seems to skip those.

Note that there have been a number of terrorism attacks against trains - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ailway_systems - but not sufficient to take major precautions in most countries compared to the number of daily commuters. However, Hyperloop is a new mode of transportation, so I would expect some extra attention.

Additionally a similar check for trains as for airplanes would increase the cost and time considerably (someone needs to check everyone), and wouldn't substantially reduce the risk since that would lead to large crowds that terrorists could attack - by placing sarin gas containers or similar stuff in the queue area as in the Tokyo subway attack.

Considering all this would you say security checks would be lessened for Hyperloop as it becomes more common and widespread, or would it remain as a constant element? I'd wager a Hyperloop ticket would already be pricier than a regular train ticket, so they might be able to bump it up even further as much as security infrastructure requires.

It's just that a large part of Hyperloop's attractiveness is that it is able to take people to places fast, making it less of a big deal to live elsewhere than the city your employment is at. If it's essentially just an alternative to air travel without much improvement to convenience and time-saving then I don't see much point in it, other than perhaps lowering pollution (assuming Hyperloop's construction and operation would pollute less, of course).

[cubby]

You're lying and anyone who can search your posts on the subject can see that.

The irony.

Wasting your time to dig up my posting history to point-score (the link doesn't even work, great job Sherlock), I mean look how you're reacting to people who are negative about the Hyperloop. It's not just me you're being childish towards.

So you can't even find evidence of your own claims? How hysterically fucking typical of all your posts. Your pathetic attempts to hide your emotional based reactions re Musk are laughable. If you'd even bothered to read this thread you'd see I'm addressing legitimate criticism about the hyperloop - you even linked one and then childishly mocked me - and agreeing with those criticisms. What you fail to understand, at even the most basic level, is that it's you who have a problem with all things Musk - and your Haters-Gonna-Hate Club just keeps on posting emotional rants with zero logic and no real point.

No, we've been telling you from the start that the initial vision and design is just not practical. Not from an engineering standpoint. Not from an economical one.

You haven't. Not once. You said it wasn't feasible - which is a different word, in case you're still so confused you don't understand simple english. I know it's tough to go back an look at your own posts, but when you figure it out, you'll see how wrong you've always been.

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Well he have companies here in Germany that build solar roadways, we have cities paying for them, at least one i know of has been build (a bycicle roadway), it doesn't produce energy, has massive overheating problems and is constantly broken.
Just because companies and cities are involved doesn't mean it's nonsense.

(this is meant in all kindness, without sarcasm - in case it sounds - just fyi)
So help me out here, you seem to be disagreeing with my premise, but he last line in your post seems to be saying the opposite, that you agree with me. I am guessing that english is not your first language, and I'm not criticizing you at all here, but did you mean for your last sentence to end: "...doesn't mean it's not nonsense."? Bolded/underlined added by me.

I'm going on the premise that's what you meant - apologies ahead of time if you did not.

I can't entirely disagree with your point here - even though my position throughout has been that since so many companies/municipalities are working on these projects there must be an inherent legitimacy to it, just by virtue of numbers. They could all be wrong, and the project might not come to fruition - that is true. I still maintain, however, given that so many groups are working on Hyperloop, they must at least believe that it's technically feasible, otherwise they wouldn't have started in the first place.

Although, in a fit of intellectual honesty, Skylab went up without them knowing how to bring it down. They thought they would figure it out, but they didn't. Crash landing.

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And almost two years ago in a previous thread he claimed that Hyperloop was "under construction" in several places.

In reality it was either tests or just planned for the future.
The only firm date for actual construction was that HyperloopTT (not Virgin Hyperloop) should have started construction of its first commercial system Q3 2019. Has it? (Originally it was a commercial system - now it seems to be a "prototype" which can mean anything.)

You two should get a room. I love that your entire ridiculous disagreement with my premise was the phrase "under construction". Seriously, let us know the date, we'll send flowers and a nice serving bowl.

Would you prefer the term "under development"?

[Forogil]

Considering all this would you say security checks would be lessened for Hyperloop as it becomes more common and widespread, or would it remain as a constant element? I'd wager a Hyperloop ticket would already be pricier than a regular train ticket, so they might be able to bump it up even further as much as security infrastructure requires.

That depends on the actual and perceived threat, and more importantly on whether Hyperloop actually is built.

It's just that a large part of Hyperloop's attractiveness is that it is able to take people to places fast, making it less of a big deal to live elsewhere than the city your employment is at.

I don't see how hyperloop solves that problem.

Basically you need lots of fine-grained public transport to handle getting people from home to work, and it's difficult to have public transport that is both fast and start and stop at lots of places. Having parts of a train that split into different directions is usually just confusing (been there) - and trying to solve it with even more pods would make it even less convenient and increase the cost a lot.

[Daedius]

But can I send documents around in it still?

[PC2]

But can I send documents around in it still?

What? Documents are digital now.

[Forogil]

What? Documents are digital now.

And if they aren't digital one usually scans them and then sends the digital version.

I don't see that rapid transportation for the few documents that actually need to be sent physically is a major market.

[cubby]

Basically you need lots of fine-grained public transport to handle getting people from home to work, and it's difficult to have public transport that is both fast and start and stop at lots of places. Having parts of a train that split into different directions is usually just confusing (been there) - and trying to solve it with even more pods would make it even less convenient and increase the cost a lot.

The larger issue there is people living 2+ hours away from major metropolis' who still have to commute into work. The Hyperloop (and/or other rapid transportation systems) solves the 5+ hour commute (2H each way, plus ancillary transport from the bigger hub - i.e. train to downtown, then bus/Link to office) by making the 4 hour both commute each day down to 30 minutes. I believe that is what @Zuben was suggesting.

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And if they aren't digital one usually scans them and then sends the digital version.

I don't see that rapid transportation for the few documents that actually need to be sent physically is a major market.

I have to agree with you on that one - even major contracts requiring "wet" signatures are moving to digital. Everything else was there 10 years ago. DocuSign and other similar companies have pretty much put the legal document courier business to bed.

[Forogil]

The larger issue there is people living 2+ hours away from major metropolis' who still have to commute into work. The Hyperloop (and/or other rapid transportation systems) solves the 5+ hour commute (2H each way, plus ancillary transport from the bigger hub - i.e. train to downtown, then bus/Link to office) by making the 4 hour both commute each day down to 30 minutes.

That makes little sense, as most things with Hyperloop. People will not have 15 minute from home to Hyperloop station and then 15 minute from Hyperloop station to work, it's more likely to be 40 minutes to an hour for each of those trips.

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You two should get a room. I love that your entire ridiculous disagreement with my premise was the phrase "under construction". Seriously, let us know the date, we'll send flowers and a nice serving bowl. Would you prefer the term "under development"?

My new point is that you said it was "under construction" when it was supposed to be under construction later during 2019.
It's now 2021 and it's not clear that it's actually under construction yet on that project - and we see Branson no longer chairing Virgin Hyperloop.

Some people see through all this; and others don't.

[cubby]

That makes little sense, as most things with Hyperloop. People will not have 15 minute from home to Hyperloop station and then 15 minute from Hyperloop station to work, it's more likely to be 40 minutes to an hour for each of those trips.

I guess it depends on where you live. The math is pretty clear though - especially on Hyperloop station to city, that time would be cut down dramatically. 15-20 minutes max, if it's used that way. Tell me what you're thinking here, I feel like I'm missing something with what you're saying.

My new point is that you said it was "under construction" when it was supposed to be under construction later during 2019.
It's now 2021 and it's not clear that it's actually under construction yet on that project - and we see Branson no longer chairing Virgin Hyperloop.

Some people see through all this; and others don't.

Gotcha - so can we just agree on "under development" or whatever and put this silly issue to bed? The horse died long ago.