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  1. #1281
    @Syegfryed stop making up your own head canon for this stuff. Unless you have evidence of Super Soldier sperm being a route to more super soldiers, in the mcu, we don’t know what he’d pass on. Hell, you don’t even know whether he had kids after he was given the serum. Bringing up Dragonball? Yeah, nothing to do with the topic.

  2. #1282
    Titan Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    @Syegfryed stop making up your own head canon for this stuff. Unless you have evidence of Super Soldier sperm being a route to more super soldiers, in the mcu, we don’t know what he’d pass on. Hell, you don’t even know whether he had kids after he was given the serum. Bringing up Dragonball? Yeah, nothing to do with the topic.
    why the sassiness? i never said it was the truth, i just said i assumed super soldier offspring would inherently get the super soldier powers by having the genes and the blood

    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    We keep asking you to explain how, and you're never able to provide that explanation.
    and i said, the movie, showing doing stronger things, with the sonic clap and the shockwaves, plus it showed he getting stronger by getting angrier in the abomination confrontation

    There is zero indication he was nerfed. None. You're making that up.
    except you know, the movies

  3. #1283
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    and i said, the movie, showing doing stronger things, with the sonic clap and the shockwaves, plus it showed he getting stronger by getting angrier in the abomination confrontation
    Nothing that beats what he did in various Avengers films.

    You're making this up in your own head. It has no basis in the films whatsoever. He's literally done shockwaves, created earthquakes, and stopped MUCH bigger foes than the Abomination with a single punch in the Avengers films. You're just straight-up ignoring the films to make up your own headcanon.

  4. #1284
    Titan Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Nothing that beats what he did in various Avengers films.
    and what he did in the various avengers films? breakings robots and the flying whales? come on.

    You're making this up in your own head. It has no basis in the films whatsoever. He's literally done shockwaves, created earthquakes, and stopped MUCH bigger foes than the Abomination with a single punch in the Avengers films. You're just straight-up ignoring the films to make up your own headcanon.
    if you cannot see those things that is not my problem, even their size is different with 2008 hulk standing 9ft tall with the later hulks barely scratching 8ft, "much bigger" does not mean they are worse or more resilient than abomination, you believe its just "me and my headcanon" but there is tons of articles, videos and other people saying the same thing that the power lv of mcu is weird and floating based on the plot and why the later hullks seems to weak

    But again, if its just my headcanon you can ignore and have a better day

  5. #1285
    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    Bolded part is one of my problems with so many MCU movies. So much is happening off-screen or what is shown on the screen contradicts what is said on screen but we should believe it because thats what happens off screen that it just breaks my suspension of disbelief.
    Why is this a Hulk-only problem?

    Hawkeye devolves into Ronin entirely off-screen. And is back to being Hawkeye one scene after being confronted as Ronin, after Scar-Jo holds his hand or something.

    Captain Marvel gets a haircut and is dealing with the Snap off world for 5 years. And then just falls like a comet out of the sky.

    The events which lead to Hulk being in Thor: Ragnarok are entirely off-screen.

    The breakup between Thor and Jane Foster is entirely off screen.

    Wanda and Vision's relationship was entirely off screen.

    Tony having a kid and a family life was entirely off screen, last we see Tony and Pepper together they're talking in a park about what they want their family life to be when Dr. Strange snatches him up in Infinity War.

    Cap and Bucky's relationship, growing up, is entirely off-screen. Hell, their relationship during WW2 is entirely relegated to like, 1/3rd of the first Cap movie, and then they spend two movies moaning about how Cap loves Bucky and how Bucky couldn't possibly be responsible for all this horrible shit.

    This is a Marvel thing, so to be surprised about it in Endgame is like....what.

  6. #1286
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    I think people would enjoy seeing his character in action in his younger days. Young Avengers certainly seems to be something they’re building towards though.
    I'd rather not see Carl Lumbly replaced with a younger actor just so we can see a Korean War Marvel film. I guess maybe they could give him a full on suit for most of the film so you never see his face or skin color which could tie to the racism then and you could have Carl do the non action stuff. That might be kinda cool and then we might get a known Korean War film besides Manchurian Candidate.
    Last edited by qwerty123456; 2021-04-27 at 06:45 PM.

  7. #1287
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post

    Are you just parroting that now? based on the fucking movie, the 2008 movie, we are basing on that, the hulk in 2008 was stronger than the other versions of hulk, period.
    I'm asking you what specific feats he performed in that movie that make your case. "Based on the fucking movie" is not specific. What exactly did he do in that movie that proves he's stronger than in all the Avengers movies? The only thing you've even mentioned is that Bruce fell from a helicopter and Hulk emerged unharmed. There's nothing about that that shows he could heal the arm damage caused by the snap.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    I'd rather not see Carl Lumbly replaced with a younger actor just so we can see a Korean War Marvel film. I guess maybe they could give him a full on suit for most of the film so you never see his face or skin color which could tie to the racism then and you could have Carl do the non action stuff. That might be kinda cool and then we might get a known Korean War film besides Manchurian Candidate.
    Disney has some pretty good age reduction tech that they've already used pretty successfully.


  8. #1288
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    I'm asking you what specific feats he performed in that movie that make your case. "Based on the fucking movie" is not specific. What exactly did he do in that movie that proves he's stronger than in all the Avengers movies? The only thing you've even mentioned is that Bruce fell from a helicopter and Hulk emerged unharmed. There's nothing about that that shows he could heal the arm damage caused by the snap.

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    Disney has some pretty good age reduction tech that they've already used pretty successfully.

    That's not action sequences though. And they would need to de age and bulk up Carl for a whole film. At that point he's basically the hulk. That's why I think the racism angle could work if he had to be fully covered in combat and they had Carl do the voice and helm off stuff and have a younger buffer guy play him in the action scenes. It would end up kinda being more like Abe Sapien from the first Hellboy where they had Doug Jones do the physical performance and had David Hyde Pierce do the voice which TBH I found much better character than when they had Doug Jones do both in the Sequel.

  9. #1289
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    That's not action sequences though.
    Action sequences are often filmed by stunt actors and/or digitally created already. In addition, as you said, there's always the possibility of putting a mask on...which makes it even easier.

    It's also worth noting that Carl Lumbly has a son who is also an actor. He could probably make for a good stand-in where one is required.

    And they would need to de age and bulk up Carl for a whole film.
    Well, they de-aged Sam Jack for an entire movie. And his face is clearly visible in pretty much every scene. If they can do that...I don't see why they couldn't do the same for Carl Lumbly when they have the additional option of covering his face for at least some of the scenes.
    Last edited by Egomaniac; 2021-04-27 at 09:29 PM.

  10. #1290
    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    Why is this a Hulk-only problem?
    For me it is not Hulk-only, but a general problem. Marvel is not the only one to make that mistake, but we are talking about their movies here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I'm fine with a mafia. Of course, the mafia families often worked with independent third parties in order to maintain relations.

  11. #1291
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    I'd rather not see Carl Lumbly replaced with a younger actor just so we can see a Korean War Marvel film. I guess maybe they could give him a full on suit for most of the film so you never see his face or skin color which could tie to the racism then and you could have Carl do the non action stuff. That might be kinda cool and then we might get a known Korean War film besides Manchurian Candidate.
    I would prefer a limited series with Carl telling stories to his grandson that then flashback.

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    Quote Originally Posted by segara82 View Post
    For me it is not Hulk-only, but a general problem. Marvel is not the only one to make that mistake, but we are talking about their movies here.
    Supposed to be talking about Falcon and the Winter Soldier here, there’s a thread for Marvel in general.

  12. #1292
    Just for the record, "peak human" doesn't mean "the best humans have achieved." It means the absolute pinnacle that they can theoretically achieve. That's not just not what the term means. No natural-born human will ever be as strong, fast, resilient, or resistant to fatigue as Steve Rogers is. And certainly not all of those things at once. He's a literal Ubermensch of genetic engineering.

    Also, finally got to see the finale. I was really disappointed that they did, in fact, make Sharon the Power Broker. But as others have pointed out, it really doesn't make any sense on any level whatsoever. Not even in the ridiculous comic book "Machiavellian plan to get pardoned and gain access to SHIELD tech, mouhahaha!" sort of way.

    That said, I do now understand why they did it. It's all because of Valentina. Sharon's clearly meant to be her opposite in future installments. One being a SHIELD agent posing as a Hydra agent that's in turn pretending to be a SHIELD agent for Hydra. The other is a former SHIELD agent that actually went and became a bad guy, but will be posing as a SHIELD agent in order to further her own goals as a bad guy. Confusing as it is, it gives two sides of the same coin.

    At least I hope that's the reason, as it's the only thing that makes sense on a narrative level. It doesn't mean it makes Sharon's story arc at all sensible, but at least it explains why it's there at least.
    Last edited by Something Wicked; 2021-04-27 at 09:51 PM.

  13. #1293
    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post
    Just for the record, "peak human" doesn't mean "the best humans have achieved." It means the absolute pinnacle that they can theoretically achieve. No natural human is as strong, fast, resilient, or resistant to fatigue as Steve Rogers is. And certainly not all of those things at once. That's not just not what the term means.

    Also, finally got to see the finale. I was really disappointed that they did, in fact, make Sharon the Power Broker. But as others have pointed out, it really doesn't make any sense on any level whatsoever. Not even in the ridiculous comic book "Machiavellian plan to get pardoned and gain access to SHIELD tech, mouhahaha!" sort of way.

    That said, I do now understand why they did it. It's all because of Valentina. Sharon's clearly meant to be her opposite in future installments. One being a SHIELD agent posing as a Hydra agent that's in turn pretending to be a SHIELD agent for Hydra. The other is a former SHIELD agent that actually went and became a bad guy, but will be posing as a SHIELD agent in order to further her own goals as a bad guy. Confusing as it is, it gives two sides of the same coin.

    At least I hope that's the reason, as it's the only thing that makes sense on a narrative level. It doesn't mean it makes Sharon's story arc at all sensible, but at least it explains why it's there at least.
    If she ends up being a Skrull would that change your perspective?

  14. #1294
    Nope, because up til now, there's been no signs that the Skrulls are bad guys in the MCU. Quite the opposite, in every single incarnation we've seen of them.

    And even if she was a Skrull, that still wouldn't have made anything that went down in Falcon and the Winter Soldier sensible. Her aiding in the death of the chemist, alone, utterly destroys the story. Even if she just thought they'd arrest him, there's no reason at all for her to have lead them straight to him.

  15. #1295
    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    Anthony Mackie:
    8 Mile
    Holy shit I just realised he's Clarence.

  16. #1296
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post
    Just for the record, "peak human" doesn't mean "the best humans have achieved." It means the absolute pinnacle that they can theoretically achieve. No natural human is as strong, fast, resilient, or resistant to fatigue as Steve Rogers is. And certainly not all of those things at once. That's not just not what the term means.

    Also, finally got to see the finale. I was really disappointed that they did, in fact, make Sharon the Power Broker. But as others have pointed out, it really doesn't make any sense on any level whatsoever. Not even in the ridiculous comic book "Machiavellian plan to get pardoned and gain access to SHIELD tech, mouhahaha!" sort of way.

    That said, I do now understand why they did it. It's all because of Valentina. Sharon's clearly meant to be her opposite in future installments. One being a SHIELD agent posing as a Hydra agent that's in turn pretending to be a SHIELD agent for Hydra. The other is a former SHIELD agent that actually went and became a bad guy, but will be posing as a SHIELD agent in order to further her own goals as a bad guy.

    At least I hope that's the reason, as it's the only thing that makes sense on a narrative level. It doesn't mean it makes Sharon's story arc at all sensible, but at least it explains why it's there at least.
    Eh, I think Sharon's arc is overly-maligned.

    Her snaking her way into becoming the Power Broker makes sense; she was a criminal and a traitor on the run. She had the skills and the capabilities and, likely, the connections necessary to bring that about. If her homeland has abandoned her (and it had), she needed to make a new home somewhere else, and Majipoor makes as much sense as any. If anything, it demonstrates how unwilling Sharon was to just sit back and drown her sorrows in liquor; she made herself keep moving forward, keep gaining new ground.

    Where I think it fell apart a bit is that they didn't explain what he wants to do with the mantle of the Power Broker, and all the, well, power that entails. It can't be "I want a pardon" like she said; she clearly had no issue whatsoever getting into the USA and walking around without anyone knowing she was there. The pardon's a useful tidbit that, as she admits at the end, she can use to garner more resources and intel. That's it. But what does she want those resources and intel for?

    I don't believe she'd just be trying to garner wealth and power for its own sake. She never demonstrated that kind of desire before. But this kind of position gets her tied back into geopolitics, and I think that's where she's aiming. She couldn't work through SHIELD, but she COULD get resources and access through black-market channels, and the Power Broker had the most of all.

    I also don't for one second believe she's been undercover this whole time. She wouldn't have needed a pardon, if she were, or the pardon would have been something she knew she'd be getting when the mission was over; if it's over, no ceremony, if it's NOT over, no pardon. The existence of that little ceremony where she's pardoned, IMO, makes it clear she is NOT working for or with any US agencies, whether SHIELD or CIA or SWORD or what have you. She's independent.

    "Independent" doesn't mean "villain", though. Nor does "criminal". Let's remember the Guardians of the Galaxy are all criminals. Hawkeye definitely did a lot of murders, and he's still a hero. Etc. I prefer to think she's inserted herself as the Power Broker to take control of Majipoor's underworld and twist it around to doing some good, and mitigating how much harm it deals to innocents. While making a tidy profit on the side.

    I think we can write off a bunch of motivations, like the idea she's undercover, but the rest is just vague. Too vague, arguably. But there are plenty of options in there that make sense for her character. Particularly as SHIELD and related groups have, time and again, shown themselves to be corruptible from within. We just got a reminder of that in Wandavision. Sharon saying "fuck it, I'll do it myself" isn't a strong deviation from her prior arc.
    Last edited by Endus; 2021-04-27 at 09:50 PM.

  17. #1297
    Except your theory falls apart because she literally hooked a supervillian with information and resources to assassinate a hero (and a friend of hers). She also literally built a team of super terrorists, of which she immediately lost control over. She also straight-up had one of her own assassinated (Selby), and is plotting to steal from the government to fund even more criminals, terrorists, and supervillians.

    The Guardians of the Galaxy that isn't.

  18. #1298
    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post
    Nope, because up til now, there's been no signs that the Skrulls are bad guys in the MCU. Quite the opposite, in every single incarnation we've seen of them.

    And even if she was a Skrull, that still wouldn't have made anything that went down in Falcon and the Winter Soldier sensible. Her aiding in the death of the chemist, alone, utterly destroys the story. Even if she just thought they'd arrest him, there's no reason at all for her to have lead them straight to him.
    You mean aside from the Secret Invasion announcement right?

  19. #1299
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    You mean aside from the Secret Invasion announcement right?
    Until it mentions the Skrulls, yes. The Skrulls in the MCU are not the Skrulls from the comics. And also because, again, there has not been a single incidence of an "evil" Skrull in the MCU yet.

    And also, which I'm sure you'll ignore again, it still wouldn't explain the sheer nonsensical stupidity of Sharon's story arc in this series. Even if she's a Skrull of the same caliber as the moronic one from WandaVision that was posing as Fury.

  20. #1300
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    You mean aside from the Secret Invasion announcement right?
    In fairness, they are using the title of a comic event...but, like it was in Captain America: Civil War, it may not actually be that closely related to the Comic book event.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post

    And also, which I'm sure you'll ignore again, it still wouldn't explain the sheer nonsensical stupidity of Sharon's story arc in this series. Even if she's a Skrull of the same caliber as the moronic one from WandaVision that was posing as Fury.
    There was no Skrull posing as Fury in Wandavision. That was in Far From Home.

    There was a Skrull posing as a SWORD agent in WV.

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