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  1. #1

    Assassination Rogue 9.0.5

    So with all the new changes coming for Rogues next weeks, will assassination even be viable for raid and PvP ?? I am reading mixed opinions about the changes.

    I would love to hear from those who were able to hop onto PTR. But hell I will take whatever info I can get from everyone.
    People on this thread only get pissed at you when you don't agree with them...FACT

  2. #2
    The answer is NO !

    assa dmg is just way too low in both pve & pvp
    Last edited by Nzembwamugumbwalchu; 2021-03-18 at 06:40 PM.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggressive View Post
    I am reading mixed opinions about the changes.
    well 9.0.5 changes overall are good for us, its just a question if its enough? and imo its not
    assasination still feels gutted compared to legion and even bfa

    snd still should be removed completely but cut to the chase is better that refreshing it manually

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Nzembwamugumbwalchu View Post
    The answer is NO !
    Not really.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nzembwamugumbwalchu View Post
    assa dmg is just way too low in both pve & pvp
    Kinda agree.



    About the current patch: Assa is okay-ish in PvE and PvP.
    There are assassination rogues who are doing mythic raiding and there are also assa rogues who have >2,4k CR on Arena/RBG.

    Assassination isn't the meta in this patch(Outlaw is king in M+ & is good for raiding and Sub is better for PvP).
    It's viable if you're putting effort for it, but it isn't the best spec for the rogues.

    In 9.0.5 Assa is getting little buffs. Like:
    -no longer needing to use SnD after using it once because of the Cut to the Chase ability,
    -Doomblade is getting really good buff and may be the best legendary for ST(and PvP!),
    -Venthyr is getting high boost and would probably best for ST,
    -Necro is getting interesting rework and would be really strong in M+,

    The best answer for that would be... just wait and see. There will be still some new changes for sure.
    Last edited by Eazy; 2021-03-06 at 08:29 AM.

  5. #5
    Dreadlord
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    The spec lost 4th garrote dmg, essence dmg and suffers hard through double item lvl power nerf. Assa needs high substat to work or a better ratio scale. All in all assa is hot garbage and I am talking about mythic plus.

  6. #6
    What do you mean by viable? It'll be very good for ST boss damage and cleave, still poor aoe. Probably the best melee spec in terms of just boss damage. This is going by the rogue discord sim nerds.

  7. #7
    i like to play what i like and since i choose subtlety i like playing subtlety.
    “Choose a job you love and you'll never have to work a day in your life” “Logic will get you from A to Z; Imagination will get you everywhere.”

  8. #8
    For PVE it will be quite viable and in fact one of the best ST specs in game. The addition of cut to the chase was actually a bigger dps increase than what it seems on the surface, and then you have stuff like leggo and Venthyr buffs that help the spec out even more.

    And I would highly, highly recommend for all rogues to use the ravenholdt discord for up to date and accurate rogue information. The class forums here are dead and either filled with dated information, misinformation, or doomsaying. Many of the class forums here don’t even have mods anymore so that should tell you about the state of them here.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Varolyn View Post
    And I would highly, highly recommend for all rogues to use the ravenholdt discord for up to date and accurate rogue information.
    It was EJ/wowhead first, then here, then Discord. It's just the same people moving around and circlejerking usually. Been in every single one of those.

    In the end, the information is useful only if someone is able to read it, and as usual the only correct answers are "sim your character" and " play the spec you're the most proficient at". People instead look for "HERE'S THE DEFINITIVE GUIDE DO THIS AND YOU'LL BE TOPPING METERS" without actually learning nothing in the process.

    This said, i'm happy that Assa is going to be pretty much more than viable in raid. M+ will still be dominated by Outlaw, because Blade Flurry and very fast resetting CDs - but we're talking high level keys, Assa is surely going to work just fine for anything that's up to 15.

    I'm totally gonna play Assa in raid environment. Being the spec with the most leeway it lets me focus more on fight mechanics - the only point is that it needs to bring enough performance to not be a deadweight.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  10. #10
    it seems like a small buff, but not as major as the many ~5% buffs weve had before.
    it seems more a playstyle fix as a reaction to player feedback that SnD didnt feel good for assassin.
    as a result of the many buffs, assassin has slowly been creeping up the log ranks.
    If rngsus ever decides to give me a decent dagger, im certainly gonna try it out on single target/2-3 target cleave fights.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Naiattavain View Post
    i like to play what i like and since i choose subtlety i like playing subtlety.

    you do you buddy

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by mojusk View Post
    If rngsus ever decides to give me a decent dagger, im certainly gonna try it out on single target/2-3 target cleave fights.
    Same After i managed to get a 223 and a 216 weapon from the cache, i immediately swapped to assa as loot spec so i can try to get daggers around the same ilvl, but no luck. I have a couple 200 in bag but that would just mean punching myself in the face.

    Assa got buffed by around 20%, and with scaling it's just going to creep up. Reducing the energy spent on SnD in favor of Envenom is a decent buff and energy regen has been buffed by a little aswell. Gonna wait for new SimC version to come out before actually crafting the legendary and switching, since i don't want to waste dust onto something that becomes useless as soon people better than be figure out the correct setup. I'd really like to see a CT+Exsang+Bloodfang build rolling out to be good. I'm Ventyr though, while Necro with new bone spike would fit perfectly.

    But i don't want to reroll now that i'm at 40 renown lol.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  12. #12
    @Coldkil not sure about energy regen being buffed, since SnD rank2 is/was a 10% regen.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by mojusk View Post
    @Coldkil not sure about energy regen being buffed, since SnD rank2 is/was a 10% regen.
    it should be more or less equal on ST and a buff on cleave

  14. #14
    I've got a question about SnD and aoe in m+ after 9.0.5. Let's say 4 targets. You are garroting all you can. 4 ruptures rolling. Crimson tempest rolling. Snd rank 2 isn't a thing anymore. Are you gonna have spar combo pts to envenom in this situation to keep snd rolling or should you not even bother with snd and instead focus on 4 ruptures and crimson tempest?

    Tempest is 4-5 combo pts every 12 secs.
    Rupture is 4-5 combo pts every 24 secs.
    With 4 ruptures rolling and 2 tempest, thats 24-30 combo points every 24 seconds. Snd dsnt give energy anymore.

    Would opening priority be garroting everything with subterfuge, crimson tempest, FoKing and applying ruptures, refreshing tempest, then after all of that worrying abt snd?
    Last edited by ellieg; 2021-03-08 at 03:09 PM.

  15. #15
    For raid - yeah it's fun right now (when you finely get used to shit s&d) and after 9.0.5 it will be even better.
    (still crying after wod sub)

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by intenz View Post
    What do you mean by viable? It'll be very good for ST boss damage and cleave, still poor aoe. Probably the best melee spec in terms of just boss damage. This is going by the rogue discord sim nerds.
    Too many people conflate optimal with viable. If it's not the best, it's not viable.
    The most difficult thing for people to do is objectively look at something they don't like and be able to accept that it is not bad, that other people like it, and if it was changed to the way they'd like it that other people would not like it and want it changed back. The second most is to receive something they didn't want or ask for and be grateful for it, not immediately demand what they wanted instead.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by mojusk View Post
    @Coldkil not sure about energy regen being buffed, since SnD rank2 is/was a 10% regen.
    Just slightly - the buff to Venomous Wounds and the fact you have to spend way less energy on SnD totals for more energy "gained". Nothing game breaking but still a buff.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    I've got a question about SnD and aoe in m+ after 9.0.5. Let's say 4 targets. You are garroting all you can. 4 ruptures rolling. Crimson tempest rolling. Snd rank 2 isn't a thing anymore. Are you gonna have spar combo pts to envenom in this situation to keep snd rolling or should you not even bother with snd and instead focus on 4 ruptures and crimson tempest?

    Tempest is 4-5 combo pts every 12 secs.
    Rupture is 4-5 combo pts every 24 secs.
    With 4 ruptures rolling and 2 tempest, thats 24-30 combo points every 24 seconds. Snd dsnt give energy anymore.

    Would opening priority be garroting everything with subterfuge, crimson tempest, FoKing and applying ruptures, refreshing tempest, then after all of that worrying abt snd?
    You should have (from first actual tentatives) Rupture only on you main/priority target and then use CT/Envenom, when at more than 3 targets. Multi Rupture is good for 2/3 targets because with you're losing too much time refreshing dots which give you energy back you're not using on Envenom, thus your poisons doing way less damage. EDIT: obviously you want to multiple garrotes on every target you can every time you can, given it's the biggest source of damage.

    CP generation is fine with FoK cause at 4+ targets it's basically FoK/finisher. And since you're using a finisher every second gcd, your energy regen is fine with only CT applied.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Just slightly - the buff to Venomous Wounds and the fact you have to spend way less energy on SnD totals for more energy "gained". Nothing game breaking but still a buff.

    - - - Updated - - -



    You should have (from first actual tentatives) Rupture only on you main/priority target and then use CT/Envenom, when at more than 3 targets. Multi Rupture is good for 2/3 targets because with you're losing too much time refreshing dots which give you energy back you're not using on Envenom, thus your poisons doing way less damage. EDIT: obviously you want to multiple garrotes on every target you can every time you can, given it's the biggest source of damage.

    CP generation is fine with FoK cause at 4+ targets it's basically FoK/finisher. And since you're using a finisher every second gcd, your energy regen is fine with only CT applied.
    Ok ty. On 4+ pulls u know what priority will be? After opening with garrotes, should you CT first, rupture main target first, or get snd up first? Obviously after first one, FoK once or twice and continue down the priority list.

    I'm guessing its crimson->rupture->snd. Then maintain the 2 dots and spend excess cps on env.
    Last edited by ellieg; 2021-03-08 at 04:00 PM.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ok ty. On 4+ pulls u know what priority will be? After opening with garrotes, should you CT first, rupture main target first, or get snd up first? Obviously after first one, FoK once or twice and continue down the priority list.

    I'm guessing its crimson->rupture->snd. Then maintain the 2 dots and spend excess cps on env.
    Should be like that. More playtest needs to be made, especially regarding SnD. But since it gets devalued by the fact energy regen is tied to the dots/poisons and not to the skill itself, seems likely right.

    However, i think that with CttC we'll be able to just keep it rolling with just envenoming so i'd put it up immediately and then forget about it. In the end, more autoattacks = more poison procs = more energy from VW.
    You tried, and you failed. What have you learned? That's better not to try at all.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Should be like that. More playtest needs to be made, especially regarding SnD. But since it gets devalued by the fact energy regen is tied to the dots/poisons and not to the skill itself, seems likely right.

    However, i think that with CttC we'll be able to just keep it rolling with just envenoming so i'd put it up immediately and then forget about it. In the end, more autoattacks = more poison procs = more energy from VW.
    You're only getting energy from poison procs with the Dashing Scoundrel legendary, Venomous Wounds only gives energy on Rupture and Garrote ticks.

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