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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowtwili View Post
    While I get where people are coming from, I personally feel that Stratholme is really unsuited for the Forsaken for two main reasons.

    1) It's where Arthas descend began, why would they want to live in the city that was the start of their cursed existence.
    2) It's the location of the Bastion of the Silver Hand, a holy site to the Argent Crusade, Scarlet Crusade, Brotherhood of the Light, Knights of the Silver Hand (both neutral and Alliance versions) and even to a lesser extent the Blood Knights.
    3) The Argent Crusade has already made clear in (cataclysm-era) quests that they are planning to rebuild Stratholme into their capital city for their new Light-blessed nation.



    Well, if the Forsaken capture and rebuild Durnholde Keep, they could cut off ground forces from both Kingdom of Stromgarde and Aerie Peak, Thoradin's wall has stairs on the Forsaken side too, so they could (more easily) defend it than Stromgarde could invade.

    Forsaken batriders are more then a match for the Wildhammer Gryphon Riders, imho

    The Kingdom of Gilneas (as per Exploring Azeroth: Eastern Kingdoms) is still not reclaimed and lays abandoned. But even if it isn't reclaimed the Forsaken still need to fortify both Southpoint Gate and the Sludge Fields into better defensible positions because the Alliance has captured (again as per Exploring Azeroth: Eastern Kingdoms) Fenris and Shadowfang Keeps.



    This, really. Also don't make it suck like Operation: Gnomeregan (I still cry myself to sleep over it, oke?)



    Maybe they could recruit the dwarven ghosts of Dun Garok (raise their bodies too, so we could have proper Forsaken dwarves too, instead of only humans, elves and gnomes.



    Thank you, I really like the Stratholme for the Forsaken idea too (and I would ofcourse easily accept it if Blizzard does decide to give Stratholme to the Forsaken), there's just a few points I explained above on why I think it wouldn't work either.



    They're both really good ideas, imho. But I dislike the Argent Crusade working with the Forsaken and Blood elves in such a way, it would push them into the Horde basicly and I like such a large neutral (paladin) organisation. They're basicly a Crusader state these days.



    Neither am I, but according to the BFA wartable the Forsaken where retreating to Alterac City and building a second Undercity there if I remember correctly.



    That one could work too? I'm just, it might sound silly but in my eyes the Argent Crusade is the defacto ruler (nation) in possession of the entire Eastern Plaguelands. No Horde or Alliance have a presence there. So yeah, its abit eh to me. Maybe I'm just too much a sucker for Alterac for the Forsaken?



    It does, the problem is just that it's also the zone with the largest Argent Crusade presence, the Paladin Order hall and a levelling zone.



    If I remember correctly, in the most recent book, it was stated by Lillian Voss that many of the Forsaken refugees living in Orgrimmar are suffering from the heat as it is not good for their bodies (since Forsaken can not feel actual heat).



    I would like that, but Blizzard will never do that. Unless the Alliance gets (Lightbound) orcs...



    Which is why I think the Argent Crusade would expand into Havenshore and New Avalon and not the Forsaken. THe Cruade holds the only entrance to those two areas.

    Also, the mag'har live quite comfortable with the other orcs in Orgrimmar and the vulpera have homes in (now mostly safe) Vol'dun, or if they need to move Zuldazar, which is really close by.



    Ah, but the Argent Crusaders aren't all from Lordaeron either. They're humans (paladin or otherwise) from many nations and races. Hence why there are blood elves, high elves, night elves, gnomes, dwarves, draenei, orcs and many more races that are members of the Argent Crusade. It's just a fact of (Warcraft) live that organisations and nations such as the Argent Crusade, Cenarion Circle and Forsaken are multicultural by nature of how their groups are build up from the ground.



    The Argent Crusade isn't on bad terms with the night elves and Alliance either. They would be insane to risk those relations just to give the Forsaken a new city. Also remember that the current leader of the Alliance is a (quite zealous) paladin from Lordaeron that lived in Stratholme at one point.

    The Zandalari aren't the overlords of the trolls either, so there's not a big chance the forest trolls would accept peace (no matter how good for the forest trolls), even in Zandalar the forest trolls insult the Horde and are hostile mobs.

    Hah, the Argent Crusade will be done with the EPL when Blizzard says they're done, sadly. So that'll take another decade or two, at the least.



    Which is even more reason for the Alliance to attack the Crusade in a potentional Fifth War scenario if the Crusaders are getting so buddy buddy with the Horde. Also no idea what this had to do with my point! (Also still think they did our boy Tirion Fordring a dirty, would've been great if he'd have met Turalyon, one of his original brothers).



    Wait, Anasterian send the priests these days? Damn, I don't really like that new part of lore.

    And I do not think the Argent Crusade (or the Grand Alliance) should formally apologise or "make amends" for what Garithos did. That'd be like saying Quel'thalas should apologise or "make amends" for everything Sylvanas did even after she was risen.

    Garithos was at most a rogue military leader of (the Alliance of) Lordaeron's defunct nobility/military and at worst the most succesful warlord in the area.



    They're never going to use that, are they? >.>'

    (sorry for long post D
    Fair points all, and those bits about the book i did not know, very nice (to me the lore mostly consists only of what happens in game, i dislike stories being spread across multiple media, but to learn of them like this is nice enough).

    1. The Forsaken might run into conflict with them anyhow, as their tendency up until now has been to pervert and corrupt to a lesser degree than the scourge, but still to do so, so long term peace with those mentioned groups might be hard to come by.
    And doesn't all of Lordaeron resemble their curse? Stratholme was pivotal, but it's not where it started.

    2. Fair points, though arguably also points against Alterac as Stratholme would avoid the need to fortify all that. And the forsaken currently do not have much to spare in terms of resources and numbers, and are one of the least easily reinvigorated races due to their undeath.

    3. Yeah, Gnomeregan was a kick in the shins, and that's especially low if you consider they're gnomes!

    4. I seem to recall my forsaken characters having to murder the dwarves in the first place, so i'm not sure they would help.
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  2. #262
    Legendary! Zuben's Avatar
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    I kind of like the idea of the Forsaken populating Alterac, but there's a legitimacy issue. For all these years we've argued Lordaeron rightfully belongs to the Forsaken as they are its original citizens. Afaik the Syndicate largely consists of Alteraci citizens, so the Forsaken taking their lands would be akin to an invading force taking Lordaeron. The kingdom itself has fallen, but as with Lordaeron I don't think it de-legitimizes the inhabitants' right to their dwellings.

    The only way I'd see this going down in a righteous manner is if a portion of Alteraci people split off from the Syndicate and made a pact with the Forsaken, turning Alterac into a protectorate. This would mean the Horde was allied to a human faction1 as well as see the Forsaken co-exist with them rather than have a city themed only for the undead. It would be a clear vision of new post-Sylvanas times for the Forsaken, supported by the harmony witnessed between the living and the dead in Before The Storm. It would also make their name, 'Forsaken', redundant, as they are no longer literally forsaken by the living.

    I kind of like it, then I kind of don't, as it de-emphasizes what I originally appreciated about the faction. The Forsaken are sentient undead, gone through horrible events and carved a life for themselves in a hostile world. This left them largely traumatized, darker than they used to be. This suggested development takes them away from that and towards your ordinary humans. It's an interesting path to see, but also painful because they lose a lot of their original flavor.

    And, honestly, Lordaeron is a big place and theirs by right; leaving it and building your new foundation to a foreign nation is a weird choice in the end.

    1Humans officially allied to the Horde, especially now that we always expect such pacts to turn into playable races, is questionable, as humans are the poster race of the Alliance just as orcs are of the Horde. No matter how far Warcraft's universe has developed to, Orcs Vs Humans is still the core imo.
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  3. #263
    High Overlord Shadowtwili's Avatar
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    This is a situation where we can debate endlessly because both Alterac and Stratholme make (good) sense as a potentional new capital city for the Forsaken, really. Alas, like I said, I'd prefer Alterac but I won't whine and cry if the Forsaken get Stratholme either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Yea, out of all zones and looking at that capitol its a god damn shame and it would be great to see that beautiful city flourish. The whole theme there and the lighthouses I mean.. its great it realy is.
    You know what anoys me the most about capital cities at this point? The fact that Blizzard is centering it all in Stormwind/Orgrimmar. Why can't Ironforge, Dazar'alor, Echo Isles, Thunder Bluff and Bilgewater Harbor have a portal room and all the conveniences of Stormwind and Orgrimmar while serving as their racial capitals? Also, why do they keep insisting on Gnomeregan bieng its independant faction? Gnomes and dwarves are both better off bieng one nation (the Kingdom of Khaz Modan), imho. I mean they share cities, territory, resources and military already anyway.

    Why do they refuse to update Quel'thalas, Azuremyst Isles and Gilneas and make them proper capital cities with all the convenience of Orgrimmar and Stormwind? Especially since, technically, the Alliance now has more homeless races then the Horde.

    Why can't they phase Highmountain, Suramar, Shadowforge City, Mechagon etc into the present day permanently? They can keep the raids and dungeons accesible through their entrances or add a Bronze Dragon to phase it back to the time the city was still hostile/friendly to Horde (or Alliance) players. (Or, if they're really lazy, just make the AR-only cities accesible to all members of their faction).

    Really, with BfA Blizzard has shown it is possible, they just refuse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Worgen deserve it more at this point to be fair.
    Lots of races, deserve lots of areas. Sadly never getting them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Offtopic, but I remember blizz talking about a bg that would be IN the city of gilneas instead of what we got. That would have been such a fun experience. Imagine fighting through the streets, corridors or at the stairs of the church.
    Atleast we wouldn't have this.... Shrodinger's Gilneas situation every damn expansion.

    Blizzard: "It's uninhabitable"
    Players: "There's people there"
    Blizzard: "We know, but it's uninhabitable"
    Players: "But again there's people there"
    Blizzard: "Ya, but still uninhabitable."


    (Also, about the Forsaken/Horde fleeing to Alterac. It's talked about in the mission Alterac Scouting (https://wow.gamepedia.com/Alterac_Scouting) and in the mission Rebuilding Alterac (https://wow.gamepedia.com/Rebuilding_Alterac). Also on a side-note, the Alliance is rebuilding Southshore (https://wow.gamepedia.com/Southshore_Sabotage_(Horde) and https://wow.gamepedia.com/Raleigh_the_Devout)).
    Last edited by Shadowtwili; 2021-03-20 at 01:29 PM.

  4. #264
    Quote Originally Posted by Alanar View Post
    Yea, out of all zones and looking at that capitol its a god damn shame and it would be great to see that beautiful city flourish. The whole theme there and the lighthouses I mean.. its great it realy is.

    Worgen deserve it more at this point to be fair.
    Considering that they got killed off AGAIN when the forsaken burned Teldrassil...they can't get a break.

  5. #265
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Considering that they got killed off AGAIN when the forsaken burned Teldrassil...they can't get a break.
    Plus, the Horde tries to blame the entire Blood War on them. Contrary to all the facts...

  6. #266
    Herald of the Titans Ardenaso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowtwili View Post
    -snip-
    a bit late and I hope it isn't grounds for spam/bump

    I mean the Argent Crusade Lordaeronians whereas they'd finally pledge themselves as an independent state again or probably even let themselves get involved with Calia's forces.

    Best I can think to pull this off is Blizzard making Turalyon scold and sanction them for doing nothing in the Fourth War and then pulling off the Alliance from them and then the Tyrosus/Dawnbringer in response would pledge the Lordaeronians to the Horde. Well even if they're not in bad terms with the Alliance before they're still much closer to the Forsaken and Blood Elves which I think is a better choice geopolitically.

    If Turalyon sends Alleria and the Void Elves to attack Eastweald and Quel'thalas, the Ashbringer should make short work of them before Alleria can say "Quel'thalas for Alliance"

    Quote Originally Posted by Zuben View Post
    The only way I'd see this going down in a righteous manner is if a portion of Alteraci people split off from the Syndicate and made a pact with the Forsaken, turning Alterac into a protectorate. This would mean the Horde was allied to a human faction1 as well as see the Forsaken co-exist with them rather than have a city themed only for the undead. It would be a clear vision of new post-Sylvanas times for the Forsaken, supported by the harmony witnessed between the living and the dead in Before The Storm. It would also make their name, 'Forsaken', redundant, as they are no longer literally forsaken by the living.
    my idea for Alteraci Human Allied Race is that Alterac would be reclaimed by the Blackthorn Bandits, former Syndicate members, and the Ravenholdt from the Syndicate and then Alterac would be a city for Alteraci Humans, Alteraci Forsaken, Frostwolf Orcs, and Revantusk refugees; and then they recruit the Fogsail Pirates, Defias Brotherhood, and that pirate group with a Blood Elf fanboy
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

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  7. #267
    Dreadlord Wolfrick's Avatar
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    Stratholm as the Capitol of the Forsaken is perfect!!!

    Since they don't have the Valkyr anymore we really need to introduce a Necromacer class, the forsaken should really focus on Recuriting as many Necromacers as they can so that they would not end up being a race on the path of extincion... since Undead can't have kids.

    Stratholm was the most Populated and and Urban city on Azeroth... befour the plague hit it, so just think about how many Recruits the Forsaken would have in a city that was that big and that dence with people... and also... think about the sewers... how full of corpses and death creatures must be down there. (Immagin the Zombie appocalyps in New York.... and an undead race... makes that city their capitol... omg... I have having such a Mindexplosion moment now) ^^

    And think about it... it Tyralion... beeing the Leader of the military of the alliance now... with the Forsaken and the horde making Stratholm a new horde capitol of undead... it would be like a "declaration of war against the light"... so it would be a huge thing that could open up a new era of Cold war on azeroth... that would be perfect with an Azeroth revamp!... hey hey... Just saying ^^

    PS:

    Well, this topic and all those great ideas... is a huge prof that an Azeroth Revamp is super needed... and would be super cool

    Just think about...... just think about it!.... all that Lore from Legion... then the War in BFA and so much new and interesting Lore on the realm of death (Now that the Helm of Domination is broken... every undead in free..)

    for years now my head has been full of ideas and concepts how awesome Eastern Kingdomes and Kalimdor would be now in a revamp.... after Legion... BFA and shadowlands.

    PPS: YES!.... I am a Lore Geek/nerd ^^
    Last edited by Wolfrick; 2021-04-12 at 07:09 AM.
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  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    Stratholm as the Capitol of the Forsaken is perfect!!!

    Since they don't have the Valkyr anymore we really need to introduce a Necromacer class, the forsaken should really focus on Recuriting as many Necromacers as they can so that they would not end up being a race on the path of extincion... since Undead can't have kids.
    After just being through another zombie attack on our cities and having the previous Forsaken leader try to destroy reality it would really be smart if the Forsaken just kept a low profile for a bit... making more undead feels like the best way to provoke someone into finally wiping them out.

    Besides, if any Necromancer could just make Forsaken, Sylvanas would have increased her forces long before Wrath. Pretty sure that to make the genuine free-willed undead that the Forsaken are, you need Val'kyr and it is unlikely that we will have access to those in the future. Unless Calia knows how to make more of her own light-forged variant it is unlikely more Forsaken will be made.

    And I am not sure why any race would be fine with that anyway. Undeath is still a curse and torments those afflicted by it. It's terrible that there are so many of them around already, making more would be wrong on several levels.

  9. #269
    Dreadlord Wolfrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raisei View Post
    After just being through another zombie attack on our cities and having the previous Forsaken leader try to destroy reality it would really be smart if the Forsaken just kept a low profile for a bit... making more undead feels like the best way to provoke someone into finally wiping them out.

    Besides, if any Necromancer could just make Forsaken, Sylvanas would have increased her forces long before Wrath. Pretty sure that to make the genuine free-willed undead that the Forsaken are, you need Val'kyr and it is unlikely that we will have access to those in the future. Unless Calia knows how to make more of her own light-forged variant it is unlikely more Forsaken will be made.

    And I am not sure why any race would be fine with that anyway. Undeath is still a curse and torments those afflicted by it. It's terrible that there are so many of them around already, making more would be wrong on several levels.
    Well, with Shadowlands out and making us see that Death is just a prison... where someone else chooses where you are suppose to go and every Covenant uses you as a slave... if all that info would get out to the public in Azeroth... Undeath would be seen as a gift... since yes... you would be undead... but at least you can choose what you wanna be and where you wanna go.

    Also... remember the Helm of domination is broken... so every undead on azeroth is free and wild... (Think about it... from the moment you died.. you where raised in Undeath... and mindcontroled... so all those horrible things you did... was you... but you could do nothing but follow the will of the Lich King...

    So after all that... if the Forsaken would have a council as a leadership... they would be the 1 and only faction that could calm down the undead and make them feel part of something.

    PS: if you ask me... it would be perfect after shadowlands... to make a 3rd Undead faction in Northrend... at least with thatone we could have one evil faction and we could then leave the Horde and the alliance to be more balanced
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  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    Well, with Shadowlands out and making us see that Death is just a prison... where someone else chooses where you are suppose to go and every Covenant uses you as a slave... if all that info would get out to the public in Azeroth... Undeath would be seen as a gift... since yes... you would be undead... but at least you can choose what you wanna be and where you wanna go.
    This is hardly the take-away. People are assigned to places that fit their character, they are not randomly put in prison cells. Some question their assignment, but once explained, they understand it. Alexandros Morgraine for example wondered why as a hater of undead he was send to Maldraxxus instead of Bastion until he was shown the reason. Bastion removes memories that weigh you down and weaken you, but Alexandros draws strength from his memories and was better served keeping them. Uther as a counter example was tormented by his memories of failure and hatred towards Arthas. Letting go of these memories would have been good for him, but the influence of Frostmourne and Devos scheming poisoned him before he could.

    Not sure where you picked up the idea that you are slave of the Covenant, especially considering where these people are coming from. They serve their convenant because those covenants are fullfilling important roles and it is an honor to be a Kyrian for example, you are apparently even free to choose your own appearance as the Maldraxxi are quite skilled in building a body to house your soul that is to your liking (if you want to be a giant war-machine abomination or resemble your human/naga/orc form) and the Kyrian also seem to be able to change their bodies to their wishes as Pelagos shows. The point is, you are given a job, a role, a purpose, you are not a slave.
    Sure Sylvanas believes this, but that is only because it is in her best interest to hate on the system. The best she could hope for was being made to atone in Revendreth for a couple of millenia. Of course she'd be game with upending this system. It's like asking a serial-killer if they are in favour of the death sentence, you get the answer you expect.

    No clue how you can even remotely consider being a rotting corpse as a gift... I'd pick being a Kyrian, Venthyr, Ardenweald person every time before that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    Also... remember the Helm of domination is broken... so every undead on azeroth is free and wild... (Think about it... from the moment you died.. you where raised in Undeath... and mindcontroled... so all those horrible things you did... was you... but you could do nothing but follow the will of the Lich King...

    So after all that... if the Forsaken would have a council as a leadership... they would be the 1 and only faction that could calm down the undead and make them feel part of something.
    Well, after the helm was broken the ghouls everywhere went insane and attacked us. I am not sure they can be safed at all. And I am not sure I want the Forsaken to have more soldiers. They have always been very dangerous to the living people of Azeroth and gleefully went about poisoning and murdering them out of jealousy and spite.
    The Ebon Blade could just as well take care of the newly freed undead, without turning them into a threat for Azeroth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    PS: if you ask me... it would be perfect after shadowlands... to make a 3rd Undead faction in Northrend... at least with thatone we could have one evil faction and we could then leave the Horde and the alliance to be more balanced
    Nah, not gonna happen. It would be a sensible choice since we could push all the genocidal Horde players into that faction and have a decent Horde for the rest, but there are too many problems:

    1) The faction system will not change. BFA was the ultimate moment to end the dual-faction system and have peace, but since that did not happen, there is now no way a change this big will occur.

    2) That evil faction would have to be strong enough to survive against both Horde and Alliance together. Something neither the Scourge, nor the Legion nor the Old Gods have managed. If it could not reach and hold such an astronomical powerlevel it would only keep existing because it was a player faction, making a joke out of both Horde and Alliance, much like the Horde repeated genocidal urges make a joke of the Alliance for allowing it to exist.

    3) There would also be numerous technical issues, with that faction probably not drawing that many people and thus having issues with dungeons and raids and so on.

  11. #271
    Bloodsail Admiral Xykotic's Avatar
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    After the Gnomes retake Gnomeregan.

  12. #272
    Dreadlord Wolfrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raisei View Post
    This is hardly the take-away. People are assigned to places that fit their character, they are not randomly put in prison cells. Some question their assignment, but once explained, they understand it. Alexandros Morgraine for example wondered why as a hater of undead he was send to Maldraxxus instead of Bastion until he was shown the reason. Bastion removes memories that weigh you down and weaken you, but Alexandros draws strength from his memories and was better served keeping them. Uther as a counter example was tormented by his memories of failure and hatred towards Arthas. Letting go of these memories would have been good for him, but the influence of Frostmourne and Devos scheming poisoned him before he could.

    Not sure where you picked up the idea that you are slave of the Covenant, especially considering where these people are coming from. They serve their convenant because those covenants are fullfilling important roles and it is an honor to be a Kyrian for example, you are apparently even free to choose your own appearance as the Maldraxxi are quite skilled in building a body to house your soul that is to your liking (if you want to be a giant war-machine abomination or resemble your human/naga/orc form) and the Kyrian also seem to be able to change their bodies to their wishes as Pelagos shows. The point is, you are given a job, a role, a purpose, you are not a slave.
    Sure Sylvanas believes this, but that is only because it is in her best interest to hate on the system. The best she could hope for was being made to atone in Revendreth for a couple of millenia. Of course she'd be game with upending this system. It's like asking a serial-killer if they are in favour of the death sentence, you get the answer you expect.

    No clue how you can even remotely consider being a rotting corpse as a gift... I'd pick being a Kyrian, Venthyr, Ardenweald person every time before that.
    Well, my friend... you proved my point perfectly... "I'd pick beeing a kyrian venthyr ardenweald person everytime before that"..... you cant... since in the Shadowlands and how they are working now... Someone.... is gonna pick for you.

    Example:
    In a lifetime... you can be a great warrior but at the end of your life you find out that you wanna focus on more peaceful things.... so lets say you have 40 years as a warrior and just 10 as a peaceful person... where would you be sent?

    My true point is this... how the shadowlands work now.... someone chooses for you... where you are suppose to go... and in my eyes... no one... and I mean no one will choose better then the person it self.

    This is why I say that in Azeroth... undeath could be embraced as a gift, since if you are undead you can still choose what to do and where to go, you will stay on the world you are used to and you will be around other undead that maybe could even be your family members, that way you can be with your family forever and also stay where you are used to...

    If you go to the shadowlands... you are taken away from your former life and removed from Reality... (azeroth) so whatever you where part of or loved... is taken away from you.

    Example:
    when you join the Kyrians... they wanna wipe your memorie... you are suppose to forget who you where before you joined them... and if you dont... you are sent to the "temple of Loyalty" for eternity until you change your mind...
    that sounds like slavery to me ^^

    Being undead is not as horrible as someone should make it to be, since in Lore if you take care of your self and keep focused on wanting to live, you will stay alive for a long long time, so it different from "being a living creature" but its not that different if you think about it.
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  13. #273
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    Well, my friend... you proved my point perfectly... "I'd pick beeing a kyrian venthyr ardenweald person everytime before that"..... you cant... since in the Shadowlands and how they are working now... Someone.... is gonna pick for you.

    Example:
    In a lifetime... you can be a great warrior but at the end of your life you find out that you wanna focus on more peaceful things.... so lets say you have 40 years as a warrior and just 10 as a peaceful person... where would you be sent?
    The idea is that the Arbiter knows a person better then they know themselves. It's not some goverment agency that counts the years in which you did that and balances it against the years you did something else. Yes, she picks for you, but think about it, how could you make an informed choice? There are infinite realms to the Shadowlands each very distinct and as a soul arriving you have no clue what they are all about.
    It's not absolute freedom, but it is a beneficial choice. She isn't sending you somewhere where you have to suffer for all eternity. Even Revendreth in it's uncorrupted state was always meant to help the souls.

    But yes, I meant what I said. Every existence in the Shadowlands (except being a prisoner in the Maw) would be better then being a rotting carcass that can not enjoy any facette of life. Undead can not enjoy food, drink, love, can't have children. They basically just exist. Which is why they hate the living so much and draw all their enjoyment from brutal acts of murder and torture. That is not a state I would want on anyone, least of all myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    This is why I say that in Azeroth... undeath could be embraced as a gift, since if you are undead you can still choose what to do and where to go, you will stay on the world you are used to and you will be around other undead that maybe could even be your family members, that way you can be with your family forever and also stay where you are used to...
    I think you are heavily overvalueing and overexagerrating freedom of choice. No one is really free neither on Azeroth nor our world and we still make do with it. Especially on Azeroth everyone serves someone. The Alliance members serve the High King and their racial leaders, the Horde serves the Council previously the Warchief. The free-willed Forsaken served Sylvanas and she killed them when they showed the slightest sign of rebellion against her. They weren't free in any matter of speaking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfrick View Post
    Example:
    when you join the Kyrians... they wanna wipe your memorie... you are suppose to forget who you where before you joined them... and if you dont... you are sent to the "temple of Loyalty" for eternity until you change your mind...
    that sounds like slavery to me ^^

    Being undead is not as horrible as someone should make it to be, since in Lore if you take care of your self and keep focused on wanting to live, you will stay alive for a long long time, so it different from "being a living creature" but its not that different if you think about it.
    I am pretty sure having the flesh actively rotting on your bones and maggots crawling through you is pretty pretty horrible. The Forsaken only survive being in this state without going completely insane because they are not feeling it all. Their connection to their bodies is not complete, but if they were feeling it, their existence would be agonizing on top of being without any pleasures.

  14. #274
    Legendary! Flurryfang's Avatar
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    Would it not be far more interesting if they actually found a land, where they could feel at home and not be in the ruins of some other place?

    I would rather see the Forsaken become something new instead of just returning to Lordearon.
    May the lore be great and the stories interesting. A game without a story, is a game without a soul. Value the lore and it will reward you with fun!

    Don't let yourself be satisfied with what you expect and what you seem as obvious. Ask for something good, surprising and better. Your own standards ends up being other peoples standard.

  15. #275
    Lordaeron was never the forsakens

  16. #276
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilookfly View Post
    Lordaeron was never the forsakens
    Oo look another one of those people lol.


    So far havent seen a better idea then Stratholme tbh.
    Please read this blizzard: https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...m_source=share also what could have been possible with Nightborne--> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLr5dDXn5nE

  17. #277
    Over 9000! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    @Wolfrick I agree. Stratholme as new Forsaken capital would be really cool, it could be a sort of "dark Stormwind", so to speak. Much better than the rabbit cave that was the Undercity... I'm still salty that the ruins of Lordaeron city proper were never even considered as the capital city of Forsaken back in Vanilla.
    If the Janitor managed to pwn Azeroth:

    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    "Die, wold soul of *incomprehensible mumbling* with your death my plan to *incomoprehensible mumbling* finally fullfilled and *incomprehensible mumbling*!"

  18. #278
    Dreadlord Wolfrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    @Wolfrick I agree. Stratholme as new Forsaken capital would be really cool, it could be a sort of "dark Stormwind", so to speak. Much better than the rabbit cave that was the Undercity... I'm still salty that the ruins of Lordaeron city proper were never even considered as the capital city of Forsaken back in Vanilla.
    Yes! a Dark Stormwind! so many cool things could come out of that and the alliance would be so Triggered by that... so tentions would rise again between the horde and the alliance (Since I really love the War between the factions, but ofc, it has to be done better then in BFA)

    yeah.... the Ruins of Capitol city.... was never really used... that was always a sad things... think about it, there could have been "Major blood elf district, then a Troll, orc and Tauren Military district"... since the undead like to live in dark places... but all the other Horde races would have wanted to live in the ruins on top.

    I think blizzard wanted to use the ruins in Cataclysm.... but they had such a small team back then and there was so much content to work with... that is why I am really hoping for a 10.0 azeroth revamp, the world needs a revamp done right and not with all the rush cataclsym was made with...
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