TBC HC dungeons hard or nah?

[Harbour]

Seeing people in Nax gear on stream wiping on Normal id say yes, even though the average player level is higher, Heroic would still be brutal untill players get Kara+ gear.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

There were a lot of CC options that had longer cooldowns so if it got broken for whatever reason or was resisted, it made things much more difficult.

It's also not necessarily an IQ problem, as knowing what specific mob NOT to hit took coordination and communication. Which again, isn't hard, it's just decidedly NOT faceroll easy, which is a pretty profound step up for some people.

Downplay it all you want, but not paying attention and screwing it up can easily lead to wipes. So, yes, while it is super easy to do right, it's also pretty easy to screw it up and extremely important to do right otherwise the entire group could die.

It reminds me of that scene in Guardians of the Galaxy 2 where Rocket gives Baby Groot the explosive with the giant, red, and easily pressed button and the only thing Baby Groot has to do is NOT hit that button...

It didn't at all doing a 15 is harder than any dungeon in the burning crusade. All the content will be downed in days. You'd be crazy to think otherwise. its an easily learned dance.

Your just trying to make outdated mechanics complex. There is nothing hard about ccing mobs that do nothing to stop you. Its a basic competence problem. it was hard to screw up at least compared to mythic+ dungeon. All the timer ask is that you do good damage and know the dungeon nothing else. 3 elemental shamans + tank + healer can clear any dungeon @15 or below.

[Gaidax]

From what I remember they were mostly just tedious. Like Shattered Halls? Yeah fuck that - it simply was unnecessarily long drag filled with trash.

Besides everyone and their mothers will be spamming Mechanar anyway, simply because it's quick and at some point you do it in your sleep anyway.

[stevenho]

the damage will be brutal in the beginning when you have a lot of druids and palas that didn't tank in naxx or t2, using dungeon blues, I'd wager the exact same thing will happen again where ppl will get to 70, get their heroic keys and just go straight into heroics with whatever gear they have and some ppl will be borderline unhealable. remember when ppl showed up with no gems and no enchants on their transitory dungeon gear, yep. that will happen again.

it'll be hard, for the healers who have to pray their heals land in time. for everyone else it'll be the same as any other dungeon. the hard part is playing a healer.

This is an accurate take.

[shadowroguetbc]

the damage will be brutal in the beginning when you have a lot of druids and palas that didn't tank in naxx or t2, using dungeon blues, I'd wager the exact same thing will happen again where ppl will get to 70, get their heroic keys and just go straight into heroics with whatever gear they have and some ppl will be borderline unhealable. remember when ppl showed up with no gems and no enchants on their transitory dungeon gear, yep. that will happen again.

it'll be hard, for the healers who have to pray their heals land in time. for everyone else it'll be the same as any other dungeon. the hard part is playing a healer.

“Man all these healers fucking suck at the beginning of the expansion, must have never played during classic lol” - random rogue probably

[Katchii]

It didn't at all doing a 15 is harder than any dungeon in the burning crusade. All the content will be downed in days. You'd be crazy to think otherwise. its an easily learned dance.

Nothing I'm saying refutes this.

Your just trying to make outdated mechanics complex.

When did I say anything about complexity?

There is nothing hard about ccing mobs that do nothing to stop you. Its a basic competence problem. it was hard to screw up at least compared to mythic+ dungeon.

All the timer ask is that you do good damage and know the dungeon nothing else. 3 elemental shamans + tank + healer can clear any dungeon @15 or below.

Point to where I said it was hard. You're the one comparing it to Mythic+ here, I've never tried to make that comparison. The only point I made is that it's NOT faceroll easy and requires some level of communication and competence. You and I are on the same page here, why are you making it seem like I disagree with you?

[Xalvia]

easy by todays standards, but tedious.

[varren]

at first I think they will present a bit of difficulty when people are rushing in there with massively undergeared tanks. Meta comps will be demanded. After a month when everyone has gear they will be a joke and won't have to be minmaxed as much.

[Xecks]

i saw the lead tank of apes and a few others down blood furnace today on beta at level 68 . it was hard in some spots but they did it.

i think there are other dungeons that will be tricky till people get better gear.

[Poe]

They are way easier than a mythic 15 on retail if that says anything.

[ryjkur]

They are way easier than a mythic 15 on retail if that says anything.

said no one ever, add 5 more keylevels and we are on the right track

[Poe]

said no one ever, add 5 more keylevels and we are on the right track

So BC heroics are harder than a+20 keystone? So statistically speaking, a small percentage of the classic community will be able to clear heroics seeing how small percentage of the retail community can time a +20 ?

Wow, that's really mind blowing. Thanks for the insight, now I am beginning to comprehend and understand just how insanely difficult BC heroics will be.

[Felrane]

So BC heroics are harder than a+20 keystone? So statistically speaking, a small percentage of the classic community will be able to clear heroics seeing how small percentage of the retail community can time a +20 ?

Wow, that's really mind blowing. Thanks for the insight, now I am beginning to comprehend and understand just how insanely difficult BC heroics will be.

They wont be hard. You will have to worry about the tank being one shot untill he gets gear but by the time everyone is in teir4/5 gear they are faceroll. Pally tanks will be everywhere this time around which makes them even easier. If we are using retail level it would be like 180 geared players trying to clear 10s. Then get 226 and it still be a 10.

[scelero]

Shiiit. I remember being a scrub Warlock at 70 that didn't have the succubus pet. Walked into Shadow Labs with FEAR on point. Would fear fuckers all over the place and into other packs. Takes a lil longer, but even then it was more than doable.

I had no problems being a new player in TBC doing it. Shattered Halls is the only one I see people being 'weird' about. It was the only one I had to take seriously for that Champion of the Naruu title.

[Prag]

said no one ever, add 5 more keylevels and we are on the right track

Considering they’re being done on beta at 68 by people in T3 gear, I’m gonna say you’re wrong.

They’ll be tedious at best for a few weeks until the gen pop is moderately geared for kara. Then they’ll be spam fests that we do daily for badges/nethers. There will be a few we avoid pugging.

[Heathy]

yeah with gear it gets easier again, in hindsight I remember the release heroics and they were kinda, over tuned since most tanks didn't have t3. this time it should be easier? heroics probably aren't getting rolled back to their initial state where some abilities probably had really shitty overlap. you had specific mobs hit really hard like the shadow fiend looking mobs in arcatraz and the rogues in shadow labs just sneak up on your healer and one shot them. there are various places and various packs of mobs that were kinda shit, the mobs in mana tombs i remember could spam that freaking immolate and destroy ppl extremely quickly. every heroic had one or two really shitty pulls or a boss that, was kinda sketch the first few times.

the weird thing is that it is easier than mythic+ but the classes themselves aren't as versatile as they are in retail so you don't really have lots of oh shit buttons and multiple instant cast heals. that kinda gives it, its own unique challenge. everyone gets a few more buttons in BC which does flesh everyone out a bit more but its still several expansions away from m+

[Poe]

They wont be hard. You will have to worry about the tank being one shot untill he gets gear but by the time everyone is in teir4/5 gear they are faceroll. Pally tanks will be everywhere this time around which makes them even easier. If we are using retail level it would be like 180 geared players trying to clear 10s. Then get 226 and it still be a 10.

I was trying to be sarcastic.

[kaelix1]

They wont be hard. You will have to worry about the tank being one shot untill he gets gear but by the time everyone is in teir4/5 gear they are faceroll. Pally tanks will be everywhere this time around which makes them even easier. If we are using retail level it would be like 180 geared players trying to clear 10s. Then get 226 and it still be a 10.

Let's not exaggerate, it's more like a 180 trying to clear a 3 or 4, my prediction is people will stomp hc like nothing the second they get an acceptable level of gear that are above greens

[Rusken]

Some of them will be difficult for pugs no matter what, simply due to the speedrun nature of dungeon groups these days. People will rush in to packs that are meant to be CC'd and without decent co-ordination will destroy even geared groups. The big packs in Shattered Halls and Shadow Lab are the obvious ones, and I remember a few packs in Steamvault being a real nuisance with caster mobs 2 shotting healers if the tank doesn't hold aggro well. Arcatraz as well has some nasty caster mobs.

Of course guild groups and any pug of good players won't have any issue but I can definitely see people getting too cocky in their skill and wiping ill-prepared groups.

[ifrah]

Aside from the initial shock of being hurt by the hc mobs while wearing crap gear, the only think that people need to "learn" is that (aside from paladins maybe) tanks don't magically magned the mobs on them by using 2 abilities. Even without raid gear utilized, 0CC pulling was a thing sooner than many of us want to remember.