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  1. #641
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorensen View Post
    So you are just disregarding reality where charge times are low and these cars are fantastic for traveling outside of cites because of their low cost and ease of use?
    No, because that's not really a reality yet. For a tiny minority of folks in some specific areas, sure.

    I mean, I know we're doing the acting silly for laughs thing but like, cheerleading on a pretty shitty billionaire and wanting him to run a monopoly is pretty bad man. It's really not funny or amusing or cute or anything you seem to think it is. It's just annoying.

  2. #642
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    a lot of those jobs historicaly were done by young people who worked part time while being in school/uni . the problem appeared when those jobs were taken over by grown up adoults who lacked any other valuable skills to find work elsewhere.
    This is absolutely 100% false. In absolutely no sense has this ever been true except in the minds of privileged assholes who want to claim they're not "real" jobs to justify paying people a pittance to do them.

  3. #643
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkTZeratul View Post
    This is absolutely 100% false. In absolutely no sense has this ever been true except in the minds of privileged assholes who want to claim they're not "real" jobs to justify paying people a pittance to do them.
    Man, I remember that time I had an internship lined up with a company shortly after college when we were still in the early/middle of the Great Recession. It was paid and everything, got it through a family member that worked for a partner-company so I was fucking stoked. Internship with a decent company? PAID INTERNSHIP? IN A RECESSION?! FUCK YEAH!

    And it got pulled at the last second and I didn't get the internship.

    Why?

    Because it went to a former lawyer with 20something years of law experience. I'm not fucking kidding.

    This is what's hilarious about these kinds of arguments to me, folks don't realize how bad the economy has been and how many people have had to "start over" in new careers where they have huge advantages over teens, 20somethigns and other fresh college grads.

    I honestly wonder when the last time a lot of these folks had to look for a job for was, or if they've ever had to look for a job in a competitive landscape.

  4. #644
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    So, like, 95% of all drivers, then.
    way more than that based on a half of dozen studies its probably closer to 98% that would even 'need' something greater than current capacity.

    Faster/easier/access for charging sure, this i agree is a bit of a roadblock
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  5. #645
    Brewmaster Sorensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    No, because that's not really a reality yet. For a tiny minority of folks in some specific areas, sure.

    I mean, I know we're doing the acting silly for laughs thing but like, cheerleading on a pretty shitty billionaire and wanting him to run a monopoly is pretty bad man. It's really not funny or amusing or cute or anything you seem to think it is. It's just annoying.
    If your goal is to have humans die off that is fine but most of us, or at least myself would like to see humans as a whole move forward into the future in many aspects.

    Stagnation and decay aren't ok with me and I want to see humans thrive and make progress. Your aditude of death isn't funny or cool hunny.
    Driving on Sunshine.

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  6. #646
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorensen View Post
    If your goal is to have humans die off that is fine but most of us, or at least myself would like to see humans as a whole move forward into the future in many aspects.

    Stagnation and decay aren't ok with me and I want to see humans thrive and make progress. Your aditude of death isn't funny or cool hunny.
    What does any of this have to do with being opposed to cheerleading monopolies owned by garbage human beings?

  7. #647
    Brewmaster Sorensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    What does any of this have to do with being opposed to cheerleading monopolies owned by garbage human beings?
    It wouldn't be a monopoly if literally any other car company besides Rivian gave a shit.

    And all humans are garbage but this is a publicly owned company that even you could own if you wanted to.

    Speaking of has $tsla gone down enough for me to buy? Probably not.
    Driving on Sunshine.

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  8. #648
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorensen View Post
    And all humans are garbage but this is a publicly owned company that even you could own if you wanted to.
    Not all human beings are equally garbage.

    It being publicly owned doesn't matter when their by-laws are written so that Musk can control the company with only 22% of the stock. Changes require a 2/3 vote, so 90% of the remaining shareholders would need to back/oppose an initiative to make something happen. It's functionally still controlled entirely by Musk, just as Facebook is controlled by Zuckerberg and plenty of companies have used the "non-voting shares" horse shit to maintain total control while raising billions on the stock market.

  9. #649
    55 major companies paid zero federal income tax in 2020: watchdog

    At least 55 major profitable companies didn’t pay any federal corporate income taxes last year, according a report by the left-leaning Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy (ITEP).

    The group faulted the GOP tax cuts passed in 2017 as well as tax breaks enacted in the first major coronavirus relief bill passed early last year as contributing factors.

    “This continues a decades-long trend of corporate tax avoidance by the biggest U.S. corporations, and it appears to be the product of long-standing tax breaks preserved or expanded by the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA) as well as the CARES Act tax breaks enacted in the spring of 2020,” the group wrote in its report on the findings.

    The report follows President Biden's proposal to pay for a more than $2 trillion infrastructure plan by raising the corporate tax rate from 21 percent to 28 percent. Prior to the 2017 GOP tax cut, the rate was 35 percent.

  10. #650
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    a lot of those jobs historicaly were done by young people who worked part time while being in school/uni . the problem appeared when those jobs were taken over by grown up adoults who lacked any other valuable skills to find work elsewhere.
    This certainly was the case a long time ago. The reality is that upward mobility began to cease. It's not that we just suddenly had huge batches of adults that were lazier than all of the rest. One could work their way up from employee at 18 to manager at 40 in the same company, and many people did this. These days there are gates of entry for higher positions. You can no longer work for a company, learn it inside and out, and become a manager via training. You typically have to have previous managerial experience or business management education. All skilled work requires advanced degrees and always has, so that's really nothing new. It's mostly just that companies have gotten rid of upward mobility within their own company.
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  11. #651
    The Insane PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    This certainly was the case a long time ago. The reality is that upward mobility began to cease. It's not that we just suddenly had huge batches of adults that were lazier than all of the rest. One could work their way up from employee at 18 to manager at 40 in the same company, and many people did this. These days there are gates of entry for higher positions. You can no longer work for a company, learn it inside and out, and become a manager via training. You typically have to have previous managerial experience or business management education. All skilled work requires advanced degrees and always has, so that's really nothing new. It's mostly just that companies have gotten rid of upward mobility within their own company.
    Well society can always create new better jobs that allow everyone to move up and we can automate the lowest crappiest jobs. Upward mobility may not be easy as it was for Baby Boomers but it's always possibile to increase it back to those levels and higher.

    Democrats have some progressive things in the work so if you're a progressive then that means things are set to improve. There's no point in feeling despair and thinking these changes are permanent.
    Last edited by PC2; 2021-04-02 at 08:08 PM.
    Optimism! (HumanProgress.org)

  12. #652
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Well society can always create new better jobs that allow everyone to move up and we can automate the lowest crappiest job.
    We can't predict into the future like that, I thought?

  13. #653
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    We can't predict into the future like that, I thought?
    As much he claims so, the majority of his arguments are reliant on what he predicts to the future to be like. Its kinda fascinating, because he doesn't see the issue there.

  14. #654
    The Insane PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    We can't predict into the future like that, I thought?
    We can't reliably predict what 'will' happen because that depends on whether people/society chooses to create the knowledge to fix our current issues. However all relevant human problems are soluble which means we can always say that improvement is possible as long as people direct their efforts in the right direction. If you read my post you would see I only said we 'can' create more better jobs and increase upward mobility, however just become something can happen in the future that is not a guarantee of anything.
    Last edited by PC2; 2021-04-02 at 06:51 PM.
    Optimism! (HumanProgress.org)

  15. #655
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    We can't reliably predict what 'will' happen because that depends on whether people/society chooses to create the knowledge to fix our current issues.
    And yet, you do exactly that, every single time you hand-wave an issue and promise that a magical innovation will emerge naturally to fix it.

    However all relevant human problems are soluble
    You can't possibly know that. Not unless you're making a circular argument, where problems that aren't soluble are, by dint of their insolubility, irrelevant. Which isn't an argument.

  16. #656
    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    All skilled work requires advanced degrees and always has, so that's really nothing new.
    That's an over-simplification.

    You could become a computer programmer in the 1960s without any advanced education.

    And there has been a massive shift of the number of people starting university, 47% started tertiary education in the US in the beginning of the 70s; now it's 88% (it was even higher during the financial crisis). In part that is likely due to work becoming more specialized and advanced (since simpler work is automated or outsourced to cheaper countries) and in part because there's a degree-inflation. The world average is now close to what the US was during the 60s.

    Now some might say that tertiary education isn't really an advanced degree; but that also indicates that the times are changing.

  17. #657
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Well society can always create new better jobs that allow everyone to move up and we can automate the lowest crappiest job. Upward mobility may not be easy as it was for Baby Boomers but it's always possibile to increase it back to those levels and higher.

    Democrats have some progressive things in the work so if you're a progressive then that means things are set to improve. There's no point in feeling despair and thinking these changes are permanent.
    It's easier and cheaper to automate a lot of para-legal and research work, than it is to automate cleaning staff of a factory. Can't just let a roomba loose on a floor that regularly has oil and/or scilicone spills on it and just have it deal with itself.
    - Lars

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