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  1. #1921
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Spears View Post
    I can't really see how... I could see it being a sense of scale but difficulty wise? I can't say FF14 comes close unless you cap wow to heroic. It is also a weird comparison because of its small size. It is more akin to comparing it to a mythic 15 and a mythic 15 is harder...
    Uh...what? Raids have either 8 man or 24 man variants in FF14. And even the difficulty before Ultimate, which is Savage, is harder than anything I've EVER done in WoW and I used to be a Mythic raider.

  2. #1922
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Uh...what? Raids have either 8 man or 24 man variants in FF14. And even the difficulty before Ultimate, which is Savage, is harder than anything I've EVER done in WoW and I used to be a Mythic raider.
    What kind of mythic raider?

    The kind that kills the first six bosses people get down on week one of progression? A CE mythic raider or a kills maybe 3 bosses a tier mythic raider?

    I can tell you right now that even mythic skriek wing wipes the floor with FF bosses. They are more cinematic sure but if you look at hp bars while your playing they don't really move. Its a bunch of flashy attacks with little to no substance.

  3. #1923
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Spears View Post
    What kind of mythic raider?

    The kind that kills the first six bosses people get down on week one of progression? A CE mythic raider or a kills maybe 3 bosses a tier mythic raider?

    I can tell you right now that even mythic skriek wing wipes the floor with FF bosses. They are more cinematic sure but if you look at hp bars while your playing they don't really move. Its a bunch of flashy attacks with little to no substance.
    Ah ok so you've never actually done any higher difficulty FF14 raids. Gotcha. Nothing about what you said about the bosses in FF14 is accurate AT ALL lol.

  4. #1924
    Because this is a gear-based game, where skill rewards better gear. Giving someone who is bad gear, or giving gear without it being earned in anyway goes against that entirely.

    In any case most of the complaining comes from PvPers who don't want to deal with inferior players having more gear and thus taking longer to kill. To put it simply, in MoP a shitter player wouldn't have the same gear level as me and I'd smash them silly in 5 seconds. That same player today will still lose to me in a duel but it will take longer.

    The worst example of this was with templates in Legion.

  5. #1925
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Ah ok so you've never actually done any higher difficulty FF14 raids. Gotcha. Nothing about what you said about the bosses in FF14 is accurate AT ALL lol.
    Try doing a few. They are not that hard. I admit I haven't played since shadow bringers. It was a fun vacation MMO but I left after clearing it eden's promise.

  6. #1926
    Honestly I could care less if "bad" players got decent loot. Granted I think it makes sense some things be gated behind progression either though PVP or PVE ends but it should be reasonable to have a player in the current tier get to 220 or so as long as they are dedicated to the game and play fairly often.

    Skill should reward tippy top materials and a faster path to gearing.

    Time sink should reward good gear but on a slower path to gearing.

    For example if they just axed keystone master being needed to upgrade to 220. EVERYONE in the game would have a path to 220 item level. But someone that only runs 2s or 3s is going to have a REALLY long slog getting there. They will be upgrading pieces from 187 to 192 range? That is a lot of valor needed. But the PATH IS THERE. If they decide to get better or eventually get better doing lower keys maybe they step it up and start upgrading from 200 or 207 or hell maybe even 210s meaning the upgrade process gets faster for them as they skill up. So it does it all really. Gives lowbies a path to really good gear (I mean 220 is pretty fucking solid) but it just takes time. It rewards getting better at the game and doing higher keys to reduce that time and makes those daily quests in the covy look a little better with that valor reward. By the end someone has certainly earned gear, skill, and maybe got involved with some people socially to do better (if they try). Hell it is almost an MMO system.

    I know the debate with this may move to it being to long or to short. That is an easy fix to even out if a workable system can be discovered.
    Last edited by Low Hanging Fruit; 2021-04-24 at 12:04 AM.

  7. #1927
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Spears View Post
    Try doing a few. They are not that hard. I admit I haven't played since shadow bringers. It was a fun vacation MMO but I left after clearing it eden's promise.
    Yeah I don't believe you at all. You likely did the raids on the lowest difficulty available if you think they're that easy.

  8. #1928
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Yeah I don't believe you at all. You likely did the raids on the lowest difficulty available if you think they're that easy.
    They are really not that hard... any attack that will damage you (few if any kill you at proper gear level outright) give massive warnings.

    WoW usually deals fatal damage where ff wounds.

  9. #1929
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Spears View Post
    They are really not that hard... any attack that will damage you (few if any kill you at proper gear level outright) give massive warnings.

    WoW usually deals fatal damage where ff wounds.
    Yeah you are outright lying. That isn't true AT ALL.

  10. #1930
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    Skill should reward tippy top materials and a faster path to gearing.

    Time sink should reward good gear but on a slower path to gearing.

    For example if they just axed keystone master being needed to upgrade to 220. EVERYONE in the game would have a path to 220 item level. But someone that only runs 2s or 3s is going to have a REALLY long slog getting there. They will be upgrading pieces from 187 to 192 range? That is a lot of valor needed. But the PATH IS THERE. If they decide to get better or eventually get better doing lower keys maybe they step it up and start upgrading from 200 or 207 or hell maybe even 210s meaning the upgrade process gets faster for them as they skill up. So it does it all really. Gives lowbies a path to really good gear (I mean 220 is pretty fucking solid) but it just takes time. It rewards getting better at the game and doing higher keys to reduce that time and makes those daily quests in the covy look a little better with that valor reward. By the end someone has certainly earned gear, skill, and maybe got involved with some people socially to do better (if they try). Hell it is almost an MMO system.
    Well said. This would be enough for me, personally. Totally agreed.

    I would even add a challenging solo path to help with that process if folks were inclined. Finally beating my first mage tower and 5 mask horrific vision in the previous expacs was a big accomplishment. Something like that could award valor and Torghast can be repurposed into a good vehicle for that. But I'd be happy with just what you suggested.
    Last edited by Tadkins; 2021-04-24 at 12:14 AM.

  11. #1931
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Yeah you are outright lying. That isn't true AT ALL.
    Have you ever done any of the ultimate raids? If so can you name a mechanic that doesn't work this way? From what ive done the majority of mechanics are extremely flashy but rather simplistic when compared to wow. Its move to safe zones from massive aoe taking up half the screen or spreading out.

    Something like shriek wings sonar is not only harder to avoid but far more deadly.

  12. #1932
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Spears View Post
    Have you ever done any of the ultimate raids? If so can you name a mechanic that doesn't work this way? From what ive done the majority of mechanics are extremely flashy but rather simplistic when compared to wow. Its move to safe zones from massive aoe taking up half the screen or spreading out.

    Something like shriek wings sonar is not only harder to avoid but far more deadly.
    I have done Savage, which is right before Ultimate. It's more difficult than Mythic. I'm honestly scared to even tried Ultimate because of that. Yes, things are choreographed BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BE. Else NOBODY will complete the raids. WoW is just as flashy. Saying it's not is just more dishonesty from you. I'm not going to argue further about this. Stop spreading misinformation because it is blatantly clear you have never done anything past Normal mode in FF14.

  13. #1933
    Quote Originally Posted by Tadkins View Post
    Well said. This would be enough for me, personally. Totally agreed.

    I would even add a challenging solo path to help with that process if folks were inclined. Finally beating my first mage tower and 5 mask horrific vision in the previous expacs was a big accomplishment. Something like that could award valor and Torghast can be repurposed into a good vehicle for that. But I'd be happy with just what you suggested.
    The vault already does this, albeit in a different way, you get 3 choices per week, a mythic 10 out of time will give you 220 gear in the vault. Or do you want it to be even lower?

  14. #1934
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    I have done Savage, which is right before Ultimate. It's more difficult than Mythic. I'm honestly scared to even tried Ultimate because of that. Yes, things are choreographed BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BE. Else NOBODY will complete the raids. WoW is just as flashy. Saying it's not is just more dishonesty from you. I'm not going to argue further about this. Stop spreading misinformation because it is blatantly clear you have never done anything past Normal mode in FF14.
    What your saying isn't true though... your high on copeium

  15. #1935
    Quote Originally Posted by Sialina View Post
    The vault already does this, albeit in a different way, you get 3 choices per week, a mythic 10 out of time will give you 220 gear in the vault. Or do you want it to be even lower?
    The vault only awards you if you're a raider, M+ runner or rated PvPer. Neither of which are really options if you have no friends or a guild, like me.

  16. #1936
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    What are you talking about? FF14 definitely has pvp. It's super confusing to me though so I don't go near it. Also, the community is not only not toxic but most people will actively try to help you improve if they see you struggling. Meanwhile, people in WoW are more likely to kick you out of the group and tell you to fuck off if you die once to a mechanic.
    What I meant was that it's niche. Not a lot of people care about it. No douches outside the main cities strutting around going "duel me brah"

  17. #1937
    Quote Originally Posted by Echocho View Post
    What I meant was that it's niche. Not a lot of people care about it. No douches outside the main cities strutting around going "duel me brah"
    Yeah exactly. And the people that DO run those modes? They are always willing to help people accomplish it too. Because players in FF14 haven't been given reason to be giant elitists like they are in WoW.

  18. #1938
    Herald of the Titans Daffan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tadkins View Post


    Shouldn't have to wait until the absolute final patch before we're allowed to have a game.

    What????

    That's not even the case now, due to patch resets!

    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post



    Yet as the game has gotten more complex, catering to the 'hardcore' and esport model, long term sub numbers have dropped.
    What a joke! This game has more welfare, catchup and patch resets than ever before!

    2 can play at that game.

    "Ever since WOTLK when they added welfare epics to 5 mans, the subs cratered! Starting right after ICC with that ez 5 man!1111!!!!1111"

    Mine is actually legit though
    Last edited by Daffan; 2021-04-24 at 06:09 AM.
    Content drought is a combination of catchup mechanics and no new content.
    Classic+ Retune/New Boss Abilities >>> #nochanges crowd

  19. #1939
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    There can’t be a progression path that suits everyone, it’s just not possible. People in here don’t want to do grouped content because it’s either too difficult or it gets too long to get in a group (99,99% of solo players are not tank or healers for obvious reasons) but a solo path that grants 220 ilvl in the end should have to be both very long and very difficult, things that would lead to further whines. You can now get somewhere between 200 and 205 by simply world questing plus callings plus one leggo at 235 plus all the 226 boe in AH. It seems quite fair to me, honestly, considering that they are all activity with zero difficulty. The AH boe part requires a ton of gold, ok, but farming gold is also a solo experience, it can be interesting and again it’s zero difficulty.

    I understand that the desire is reaching max ilvl gear without doing the activities Blizzard thinks are worthy to grant max ilvl gear, but it’s not possible.

    It was never possible and it probably never will.
    Like I said if you had bothered to read, iLvls doesn't matter. Everyone deserves a progression path that doesn't end after 2 weeks, the quality of the gear is irrelevant.

  20. #1940
    Quote Originally Posted by Daffan View Post
    What????

    That's not even the case now, due to patch resets!
    That is the case, when what a non-competitive player is allowed would only get them smashed in a random BG.

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