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  1. #181
    Blademaster HazySwayze's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Parts Unknown
    towards the end of cata and beginning with mists is when i'd say modern wow started, that's right around when the fun died lol

  2. #182
    MoP I think. Cata was a transitional period.

  3. #183
    The correct answer is 9.0. It's so very different that the time before cannot really be called modern.

    Unless you only want to use this thread to display when you realized the game was a waste of time, then you say something else.

    It's always been a waste of time.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Noctiphobia View Post
    It's funny how everyone tries to lump in WotLK together with Vanilla and TBC, when in fact it was the one expansion that transformed the game the most into what it's now during its course. The only thing it was missing from being pretty much more or less the same thing as what came next (besides being the last expansion that could easily build on top of Warcraft 3 story) is Mythic+.

    So anyway, Vanilla was an entirely different thing from anything else later on, where they didn't really know what they want to do, and everything was new for everyone. Vanilla to TBC is the biggest change in the history of WoW. So if I had to pick arbitrary points in game where the changes were the largest, the first one would be Vanilla->TBC transition for giving the game a direction (as well as removing most of world pvp besides specified locations thanks to addition of flying), then possibly mid-WotLK for adding all of the quality of life stuff, and then Legion launch for adding Mythic+.

    Then again, there were some less important changes that affected some people much more than others. Personally, Cataclysm making 10 man raiding legitimate, and then WoD killing it were two more important points, but that's mostly my personal preference for smaller groups and more personal influence, that clearly not everyone shares.

    Expansions between WotLK and Legion did gradually modify game mechanics, the way classes play (e.g. using 2 buttons every a few seconds no longer was a valid DPS rotation), etc., but the changes were not drastic, so it's hard to justify picking a random point and saying it's a new era of anything.
    On the other hand, there are some changes that nostalgic people like to pretend changed the game in any significant way, such as cross realm play or LFR.
    Yeah I think Vanilla TBC are in their own cluster, then WotLK to MoP, then WoD to now.

  5. #185
    The Lightbringer Minikin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    There are generally three pillars upon with successful MMO's are built. The social aspect, the world, and the game.

    WotLK destroyed the social aspect of the game, it damaged guilds so badly that they added the guild reward system in Cata to try to repair it, and dungeon finder made it so you didn't have to talk to anyone to progress.

    It also did serious harm to the world, your character stopped being an explorer/traveler and became the hero. Rather than coming across some people who were desperate, who saw you as someone with a sword who could help, you became the savior. The world stopped existing outside of the players actions.

    Finally, the gameplay lost it's focus. Classes began to lose their distinct advantages and disadvantages, abilities began to just sprout up to cover perceived deficiencies of classes, everything began to run together and feel the same. Classes began to lose their moments to shine in favor of everyone doing the same-ish (except DKs, fuck DKs).

    There were changes before this that were negative toward these pillars, and certainly the introduction of the flying mount in TBC did not go the way the developers originally intended, but the three pillars were heavily damaged to the point of WoW basically being a new game during WotLK. Since then, it's just been a zombie lurching forward, every two years it "resets" itself and players flood back with hope that WoW will have recaptured the magic it once had, only to discover quicker and quicker that the game is not what they wanted. That began with WotLK.
    100% agree.

    Mind you. I have always wondered what it means "flying didn't go the way they intended". What did they intend?
    Blood Elves were based on a STRONG request from a poll of Asian players where many remarked on the Horde side that they and their girlfriends wanted a non-creepy femme race to play (Source)

  6. #186

  7. #187
    Legendary! Zka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    3 biggest crimes in my book that made retail wow crap:

    1) increasing encounter complexity instead of increasing difficulty - this started as soon as end of LK, but definitely arrived in Cata

    2) character power obtainable through super dumbed down and boring solo gameplay, but not obtainable with normal mmo gameplay (that is instances, raids, pvp)

    3) features that have the primary or sole fuction of wasting player gametime: timegates, weekly maxes (which are actually weekly minimums), war campaign questlines, hard to traverse terrain, mob aggro everywhere outdoors, travel time ever increasing, rares take time and effort to activate and I could go on, it's really brutally rampant now and they have been clealry going full force with these recently.

    3+1) not quite sure, but borrowed powers seem to be a bad idea now. It was much better to get a few new trained skills and talentable skills every expansion while saying goodbye to a few others. Now we get complex and timeconsuming systems to get something that should have been a talent point.

    There is no hard breakpoint between classic and modern wow, it happened between end of LK and start of Legion, it was more like a gradual transition. Also, it is still ongoing. Complexity is still increasing for no proper reason, timesinks are still growing - at least I can figure out the reason there. (some stupid KPI imposed by incompetent management)
    Last edited by Zka; 2021-04-11 at 07:35 AM.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    Isle of thunder and siege of orgrimmar and the beautiful zones and good story of pandaria were shit? Lol okay dude. We get it. You don't like pandas. Doesn't make the content shit.
    I was mostly referring to Cata. MOP was a very enjoyable expansion from start to finish and most importantly it gave casual players reasonable gear progression, something to work towards over time. Granted I was a raider at the time but I could still appreciate things like rep gear and burdens of eternity off the timeless isle for the casuals.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    WotLK destroyed the social aspect of the game, it damaged guilds so badly that they added the guild reward system in Cata to try to repair it, and dungeon finder made it so you didn't have to talk to anyone to progress.
    This has since been fixed. You need a guild and you need to make premade groups if you want to accomplish anything of value in WoW nowadays. Being on your own and using the group finder doesn't get you anywhere.

  9. #189
    Immortal sam86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    WORST country on earth (aka egypt)
    Quote Originally Posted by Dazu View Post
    You did challenge modes, mythic raiding, garrison invasions etc without ever chatting? Interesting. WoD was crap expansion but seriously, Wrath was more solo friendly than WoD was. You could do everything in game in Wrath except cutting edge raiding without an organised group. There was nothing outside of progression raiding that wasnt easily gotten into solo/casually along with catchup gear obsoleting the previous tier entirely so you could skip previous raids entirely.

    TBC if you think you got better than raid gear from badges then you are delusional. You got a couple of items which were near quality to the max raid loot. And it was tied behind group content that wasnt readily puggable until near the end and/or raiding. TBC you needed a group to even get through attunements to get into heroic dungeons let alone touching raids. You also needed group content to get the materials to make decent crafting items.
    attunements were removed early in TBC, badge gear was better than BT/MHJ and u even get gems from it, TBC patch 2.4 u can easily (still need lot of playing) get gear better than raiding by doing hcs (which wasn't lfg thing yet), specially since TBC each class had its unique status and almost no 2 classes share same gear
    I'm not delusional since literally my friend protadin did that to get to raiding, and i was in a 10 men guild almost all rl friends except me and someone else,
    Quote Originally Posted by Palapop View Post
    Legion. Sadly.

    I really don't understand why people glorify Legion that much. It was really, REALLY bad expansion in my eyes. Endless rng grind-fest is NOT fun. + all classes are RUINED since legion.
    because they were amazing on short term, if i knew from day 1 legion launch that artifact is just this exp and will be deleted after exp end i may not bought it, i literally bought it thx to artifact trailer and how amazing it was
    it is same thing as wrath lfg, i loved it, and i was stupid for liking it, what i thought is finally i can do a dungeon at 3:00 am, but what happened is it killed social part of wow
    Legion ideas were great IF they stayed, what we had is taste something we can never get, and yes i call it taste because of 14 years of wow when something exist for just 2 years it is taste at best
    The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn
    Thrall 7:20+ "Alliance remaining super power", clearly blizz favor horde too much, that they made alliance the super power

  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by D3athsting View Post

    Fixed that for ya
    Gear score feels hurt by this.
    Last edited by Ivank0v; 2021-04-12 at 08:13 PM.
    "Aren't you worried?"
    "Would it help?"

  11. #191
    Between Cata and MoP for sure.

  12. #192
    Cata / MoP. Cata still had the old talent system so i'd say MoP

  13. #193
    The question will the next era start, and what will define it

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