Loot drop rates still feel unrewarding

[TyrianFC]

I don’t know if it’s just me and I’ve had insanely bad luck, or if others are feeling it too... but the drop chances of loot feel still feel somewhat broken and unrewarding.

28 DoS runs in 3 weeks and only the same item dropping twice... and 1 loot drop in 3 weeks of doing 8-10/10 heroic bosses in the same time.

Now I know that it’s not always “about loot” but when you’re trying to farm an item, and having to rerun content over I can accept if there is a random chance the 1/2 items I want would drop... but getting almost nothing for my effort really makes me feel that the “loot fix” is bullocks.

Anyone else experiencing extreme bad luck constantly with loot drops?

The problem is you, not the game or the vault. Players like you want everything sent in the mail.

[Doffen]

Funny enough I always use WoD as my "best xpac for gearing alts" example
Ding level 100, go to Ashran, 2 hours later 700-710 ilvl. M HFC raiders ~740 ilvl, that's a 6-4% difference in ilvl.
For SL to be equivalent I'd have to ding 60 and in 2 hours get 217 ilvl since M CN players are ~230 ilvl

So if you ask me I'd say yes, let's go back to WoD!

You got enough conquest for a whole Wild Gladiator set in 2 hours back then? I honestly can't remember since I did not pvp lol. Highest item level in the world is now 229. In HfC mythic 742-745 was pretty normal. Percentages does not matter. Stat differences matters. Blizzard tunes it in a way that you can't compare it percantage wise out of item level. They do the 15 ilvls difference in every ladder. Highmaul gave 685 gear in mythic mode. Heroic dungeon gear was 630(wf 636). That is 55(49)item levels.

I have taken an example, Frost DK. I don't know if its a good example, but you know, Arcane Mages and 13 sec fights in HfC will skew things a bit! In Heroic Highmaul, Kargath they did around 45k dps with around 690-700 ilvl. With the item level equal to your example, so 660, they did around 30k. So going from 660 to 690-700(6-7% difference in ilvl) thats 50% more. Then I see in CN, in Heroic Hungering Destroyer they do 6kish with 224-225ish item levels. Then I go down to 205ish item level to get the same differences as the WoD example. So are there any big differences between them? The example might be a bit flawed because of buffs etc, but the point is that item level differences percentage wise doesn't really matter. Comparing WoD at Highmaul to CN, the differences in performance when it comes to item level is marginal at best. At 217 to 226 there are barely any differences in CN. So at your example, it would be more realistic to compare you being decked in 730 gear in 2 hours in patch 6.2.

It was easy to get initial gear, sure, but it is like that now too. When you think about that you can do mythic dungeons(keystone) too, up to gear at 210 and up to 226 for one item, weekly. You can get pvp gear equal to mythic gear. More than 2 hours for that though. In WoD that was up to 710 you said? But that was just for 6.2. At launch wasn't it 625 for casual pvp gear? Which is way below Highmaul mythic.

Anyway, we could discuss percentages and numbers all day. But the essence here is that in WoD you had pvp or raid. That's it. There was no point for me to go and do heroic or mythic dungeons except for achievements maybe. Now we got more sources, and one source gives you weekly mythic equal gear. I got my gear from the raid. Sure crafting was decent, so there is that. But we can make a legendary that is 235 now, from first patch.

It was easy to get crap gear. But that's easy now too. For me SL is way better seeing there are so many more ways for me to gear up, and get powerful gear, not just low pvp/dungeon gear.

Sorry for the essay. And arrest me for eventual math errors.

[LDancer]

The problem is you, not the game or the vault. Players like you want everything sent in the mail.

Sorry buddy, but I think the real issue is players like you with your head in the sandbox and butt in the air offering it up to the Blizzard fan-boy association.

I was asking about people having insanely long bad luck streaks and if they’re feeling like loot is still unrewarding. At no point did I demand the 1 or 2 items I want on a platter.

My issue was of all the runs I have done, and the very few times I have seen loot drop it has been the same item. Now if as folks claim there is a legit chance of 40% in seeing some loot, I’d not be feeling discontented because I’d feel still eventually it’d be coming... if there was some protections in place against receiving the same item I have had before... I wouldn’t be worried and continue running knowing it’ll eventually drop.

That was the thinking behind my post and I was asking nothing more then do people feel the current loot drop system is feeling unrewarding.

[Drusin]

You got enough conquest for a whole Wild Gladiator set in 2 hours back then?

The blue set (was it blue?) was 700 ilvl, all you had to do was run around collecting the 'marks' from the chests to get it, 0 conquest needed. If you were winning events and got some conquest along the way you could get one piece of 710 gear in 2 hours.

I honestly can't remember since I did not pvp lol. Highest item level in the world is now 229.

Close enough https://www.wowprogress.com/gearscore/

In HfC mythic 742-745 was pretty normal.

Yeah I think my main was 743

It was easy to get crap gear. But that's easy now too.

But it's not as good as WoD crap gear

I'm not worried about it though, with the number of threads I've seen on loot I guarantee you Blizz is going to make adjustments and not minor adjustments either, i'm just saying WoD was king of quickly gearing alts.

[Grof]

The problem is you, not the game or the vault. Players like you want everything sent in the mail.

The idiot is you, not him or anybody else, since idiots like you thinking they know everything...

[PaladinBash]

this should not be happening and this isnt the only person it happened to.

I feel this in the core of my being. I farmed the absolute shit out of DoS for weeks chasing a single drop for my alt and never saw it drop at all, not even for someone else and never once got it from a box. I checked and I ran it a total of 48 times on +10-15 (whatever was listed, I joined) since they added VP upgrading. That might not sound like a lot of keys to people but running the same dungeon 48 times is a LOT to me. I haven't even run 48 dungeons in total on my main in that time, never mind the same one. I dunno how boosters do this stuff, it rots my brain tanking the same thing over and over again even if it's fast.

It just shouldn't be this bad but it is. Some dude will run it 5 times and get it. Some people will get it in their box the first week. It's fucking wild and do you know what this makes me do? Hate the system not my luck. When legendaries in Legion dropped randomly, I got my best one the first week and everyone else raged about how shit that system was because their luck sucked. It's no different now.

[Marrilaife]

Don't see how Tbc is relevant here? I was running for most of the expansion with the same weapons back then, wasn't great either

Yeah, I don't get the Classic / TBC craze and "make everything how it was back in the golden days". Would you guys love to grind your rep to revered just to earn the privilege to enter a heroic dungeon? You sure will relive that amazing experience on TBC classic soon(TM).

One thing SL managed to recapture from TBC is that the fastest place to get gear is arena, back then while I was grinding 300 badges for my bis boots, arena boyz were running in full epic sets equal to t5 or t6 in power without even stepping into a raid or dungeon.

[LordVargK]

Your expectations are pretty low, the chance is 20% per boss kills, if you clean the raid you get 2 item in average.

Yes, 1 in 5, means 2 in 10. OP killed 9 bosses and got 1 item, so next week OP should expect a drop, when they kill the 10th. Op would actually been lucky to have gotten more than one item.

- - - Updated - - -

Disagree, i have played WoW for a long time. From casual to hc ( and when it changed) to mythic , and back to casual again.
And yes i have had streaks of bad luck, MoP first raid i had weeks of no loot.
But this is different.
In older content you could hit dry spots. where you barely got loot, or what you got was not a upgrade. But not like this. If you used to do a raid on any level you could expect like 1 item per raid for yourself. even before personal loot, when you had bad luck and several people who wanted a certain item. You would most of the time walk out with a item.
But right now its weeks of nothing burgers. Vault and valor upgrade's are pretty much the only way i have gotten items. And vault already has given me 2 double items.

And why is that? What do you do? If you clear heroic each week you get 1-2 items. Are they always useful? No. Don't your guildmates get items? Our guild trades items to one another (if possible), that gives everyone more chances of loot. Also I'm raiding since more than a decade now and that 1 item per raid is not true. At the beginning of a raid, sure, but not in the phase we are now in, where everyone need just one or two specific pieces.

The general problem is however, that heroic raid loot does not outscale the raid. 213 is about what is needed to kill Denathrius, meaning that lower skilled groups will have problems killing him just by doing the raid until that point. The vault should upgrade (pre mythic) raid loot as well, as it does for m+ loot. That way you're pretty much guaranteed an upgrade each week. Also how does the vault give you double items if you can choose between 3 different items? Or do you only kill 3 bosses each week and then wonder why you don't get something different?

[baskev]

You're right. It's also been worse. I raided for months in vanilla and never got a single item because I was unlucky. There wasn't anything you can do about it then. There is something you can do about it now. Therefore, it cannot possibly be worse than that.

yup its not the worst it has been. But in modern WoW...it is a low point.

- - - Updated - - -

And why is that? What do you do? If you clear heroic each week you get 1-2 items. Are they always useful? No. Don't your guildmates get items? Our guild trades items to one another (if possible), that gives everyone more chances of loot. Also I'm raiding since more than a decade now and that 1 item per raid is not true. At the beginning of a raid, sure, but not in the phase we are now in, where everyone need just one or two specific pieces.

The general problem is however, that heroic raid loot does not outscale the raid. 213 is about what is needed to kill Denathrius, meaning that lower skilled groups will have problems killing him just by doing the raid until that point. The vault should upgrade (pre mythic) raid loot as well, as it does for m+ loot. That way you're pretty much guaranteed an upgrade each week. Also how does the vault give you double items if you can choose between 3 different items? Or do you only kill 3 bosses each week and then wonder why you don't get something different?

2 pointless items ( bad for spec), 1 double item...2 weeks in a row.

And like i said , items are not always handy but i still count them.

Lets put it this way with M+, valor upgrades, vault AND raids the loot drop rate should not be around normal raid ( pre shadowlands) drop rate ( if you combine all of them).

- - - Updated - - -

Ahahah... reminds me of TBC where I legit was running around with blue weapon despite raiding SSC for 2 months +, until I finally got a shitty caster purple in Kara off last boss on my birthday.

Yeahhh "not like this".

What we have now is heaven in comparison.

For some people. For some its not. I have had it worse. MoP start raid was very bad.
But its not just the raid drops. If you do m+, valor, vault and raids ( world boss), loot boxes ( daily callings) and still barely get stuff to nothing at all ( or double). there is something not correct.

But i think RNG is also a thing, and some of us have had very bad rng and some of you do not.
Lets put it this way. my alt has had more drops then my main in the whole of shadowlands. and it dinged 60 months after my main.

[Gratz]

The amounts of free therapy we provide for blizzard is staggering. How many times have you talked friends off a "im done with this game" ledge because of how deflated they felt after looting Vault/weekly chest?

[Gaidax]

The amounts of free therapy we provide for blizzard is staggering. How many times have you talked friends off a "im done with this game" ledge because of how deflated they felt after looting Vault/weekly chest?

0?

I mean, if people want to quit WoW then so be it. All said and done it's just a game and if a person is not having fun, then they really should quit, because what's the point otherwise.

[glowpipe]

From week one i did 2 weekly options for m+ and often even 3. Never less then 2. First week the rewards was 220 and the week after and until now the rewards have been 226
I have yet to see a weapon from the m+ cache on my main. Litteraly everyone in my raid team, and i have asked every single one. Have had 2-3. My main tank has had 6 weapons since the start. My main is still at a 220 weapon from HC sire. This expansions gearing and the heavy dependency on rng feels incredibly wank. As im no longer raiding mythic. I have no chance on a 226 weapon from there. So my only option now is the weekly chest. And i seem like the only one in my guild atleast that never get one

[Gaidax]

From week one i did 2 weekly options for m+ and often even 3. Never less then 2. First week the rewards was 220 and the week after and until now the rewards have been 226
I have yet to see a weapon from the m+ cache on my main. Litteraly everyone in my raid team, and i have asked every single one. Have had 2-3. My main tank has had 6 weapons since the start. My main is still at a 220 weapon from HC sire. This expansions gearing and the heavy dependency on rng feels incredibly wank. As im no longer raiding mythic. I have no chance on a 226 weapon from there. So my only option now is the weekly chest. And i seem like the only one in my guild atleast that never get one

Oh we had one guy in our guild like that, we had some sick memes there. Eventually he got one,

[Gasparde]

would it be rewarding for you if you received everything you wanted within like 5 runs?

Yes. Infinitely more rewarding than having to run the same content 28 times and still not having the one single item I want.
At least the 5 run option would allow me to hop onto an alt and start from fresh again. The current system locks me in place forever because every second spent not running DoS for that stupid ass fucking trinket on my main is a wasted minute that could be invested into making my main stronger.

It's ok to be done with a character. It's okay to have nothing to do. It's okay to have BiS. Maybe being all BiS after 1 week of playing might be a bit too much, but this current horseshit iteration of NEVER being able to get all the shit you want because there's just not enough fucking time in a day is just stupid beyond redemption.

[arandomuser]

but every influencer who has the ins with blizzard said less loot will make the game fun just like classic!!!



at what point do we admit the influencers are wrong 99.9% of the time and blizzard stop listening to them?


they need to base their game on, are people logging in to play it, and does our data show people are logging in and playing, IE their legion design model-not does preach and bellular find it particular to their tastes and lets base our development around that, if preach and bellular whine about artifact power, and say they quit but more people are actually playing the game, maybe just ignore them and keep the artifacts.. I had more people who genuinely enjoyed playing the game during corruption and titanforging than i do now. im going to die on this hill artifact power and titanforging, and even corruption kept people interested in content and they shouldnt of removed it because content creators created a false perception that the community didnt like it.

[LordVargK]

]

2 pointless items ( bad for spec), 1 double item...2 weeks in a row.

And like i said , items are not always handy but i still count them.

Lets put it this way with M+, valor upgrades, vault AND raids the loot drop rate should not be around normal raid ( pre shadowlands) drop rate ( if you combine all of them).

Why not? It was nerfed in SL and is now back to what it was before. And honestly better than in 8.0.

[Gratz]

zero? If you are the type of person that has never talked to someone about how shitty it is to not get what they were looking for after maxing out their vault then I feel sorry for the people you use to have fun in this game.

We are talking about people feeling down after not getting loot again and again and again. Not general reasons people quit games. Thanks for telling everyone that people can quit if they want to. Hot shit take right there. 15k posts and copy pasted that tired response as if it is intelligent.

[Gaidax]

zero? If you are the type of person that has never talked to someone about how shitty it is to not get what they were looking for after maxing out their vault then I feel sorry for the people you use to have fun in this game.

We are talking about people feeling down after not getting loot again and again and again. Not general reasons people quit games. Thanks for telling everyone that people can quit if they want to. Hot shit take right there. 15k posts and copy pasted that tired response as if it is intelligent.

Or, I'm just playing in a stable guild that's there all the way from WoTLK that does not consist of whiny sumbiches, who pull out the "Waah I quit" card the moment they don't get loot for a couple of resets.

Our guys and gals don't quit because they don't get that specific bunch of purple pixels right away, they quit because RL simply catches up to them in their 30s and every time it happens we wish them good luck and not try to pull them back in like some dickheads.

We're all big boys and girls here, capable of making our decisions. There is no need to tell any of us what to do.

/shrug

[Swnem]

I think it's ok in mythic+ now, but in raids we are still feeling the loss of the reroll tokens, which allowed us to target specific items. Now, raiders are at the complete mercy of RNG and given drop rates, some items aren't even seen at all.

[Soon-TM]

Funny enough I always use WoD as my "best xpac for gearing alts" example
Ding level 100, go to Ashran, 2 hours later 700-710 ilvl. M HFC raiders ~740 ilvl, that's a 6-4% difference in ilvl.
For SL to be equivalent I'd have to ding 60 and in 2 hours get 217 ilvl since M CN players are ~230 ilvl

Though that's not exactly accurate because WoD gear had set bonuses so even if you hacked the game and made it to 740 ilvl without doing M raids you'd still perform worse than a M raider so some consideration for set bonuses being gone would have to be made.

So if you ask me I'd say yes, let's go back to WoD!

I never thought I'd ever say this, but right now I'd be very much playing WoD rather than this bland, unrewarding crap of SL. At least in WoD I'd be making $&#@tons of gold with minimal time investment.