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  1. #421
    I'm happy with this.

    What i didn't like about raider.io is that it was game design outside the game on how points were aquired. This way blizz reigns it back into the game. I am happy with that. A 3rd party website might not be required anymore.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by Sugarcube View Post
    i did a +14 for my druid yesterday...

    they popped their cds before ingra was taking more damage... then they made some comments about boomkins damage and convoke after the first boss because i was doing like 70% of the groups damage on ingra... they would have been closer to my damage if they didn't pop cds before ingra was taking more damage...

    took ages for them to kill mistcaller because they started attacking the wrong targets... the healer was running to the right target instantly... i had to combat res twice... tank didn't interrupt patty cake and died... another person ran into the rooted fox and died...

    the tank did the only pull with more than one pack at a time with the gorms and nobody interrupted the shields or heals... i was the only one interrupting and moonkin interrupt is 1 min cd... the healer wasn't dispelling the shields... nor did any of the blood elves of which there were 3 in the party use arcane torrent to dispel the shields... it took us 3 minutes to kill those 2 packs... only died because i decided i had enough with the packs and decided to pop convoke + ca after my last beam...

    didn't interrupt parasites on tredova...

    still timed it even with their massive fuckups...
    Mists, especially in forti weeks with affixes that do not buff mobs further, allows quite a lot of mistakes, especially if dps that fail mechanics can at least do decent dps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ya dps is very rarely the issue. The number that is. Every 15 can be pulled 1 pack at a time with like 3.5k avg dps and still time it. I've been in awful groups with still minutes to spare at the end.
    Yes and they can be also completed naked and blindfolded if you play pitch perfect but it’s never the case in pug.

    Good luck in timing a DoS or a SD of a ToP 14 with 3.5k dps average, safe pulling also. It can be maybe done if everyone plays pitch perfect but as I said it’s never the case.

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Mists, especially in forti weeks with affixes that do not buff mobs further, allows quite a lot of mistakes, especially if dps that fail mechanics can at least do decent dps.

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    Yes and they can be also completed naked and blindfolded if you play pitch perfect but it’s never the case in pug.

    Good luck in timing a DoS or a SD of a ToP 14 with 3.5k dps average, safe pulling also. It can be maybe done if everyone plays pitch perfect but as I said it’s never the case.
    SD has a really generous timer. DoS isn't awful since it got extended, just make sure you 1 phase final to save 2 more mins on fort week bit shldnt be needed. ToP are single pulls anyway, no real way to double pull except for a few in the beginning of plague wing.

  4. #424
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    Doesn't matter about "features", it's how people use it - and people use it exactly the same. Look at the score, nothing else.
    Yep, and that is what is wrong with rio as number simply turn people into vultures while whole game mode into rat race.
    Im not getting accepted -> i push arbitrary score -> I get accepted bit more -> I want to push higher -> but im not getting accepted -> i need to push other dungeons

    and the circle continues. The only way out from this madness is to make a network of friends.

    So now it's basically turning people into numbers. Instead of providing basic data (like top X best dungeons) and giving more filters in finder.
    BfA > Wotlk > Cata > ... > WoD ~ TBC > Vanilla > ................ ? .............. > Legion > ... > Eating Dust > .... > SL
    You said corruption was great system. Can't find it and proceeds to lie again.
    Legendaries were such a great system I had them all before blizz lifted softcap

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Mists, especially in forti weeks with affixes that do not buff mobs further, allows quite a lot of mistakes, especially if dps that fail mechanics can at least do decent dps.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Yes and they can be also completed naked and blindfolded if you play pitch perfect but it’s never the case in pug.

    Good luck in timing a DoS or a SD of a ToP 14 with 3.5k dps average, safe pulling also. It can be maybe done if everyone plays pitch perfect but as I said it’s never the case.
    These days the timers are very lenient. DoS was tough back when the timer was 2 minutes shorter.

    I still would love to see you raider.io profile.

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Yep, and that is what is wrong with rio as number simply turn people into vultures while whole game mode into rat race.
    Im not getting accepted -> i push arbitrary score -> I get accepted bit more -> I want to push higher -> but im not getting accepted -> i need to push other dungeons

    and the circle continues. The only way out from this madness is to make a network of friends.

    So now it's basically turning people into numbers. Instead of providing basic data (like top X best dungeons) and giving more filters in finder.
    Rio does tell you your best dungeon overall, as well as the best dungeon they are qing for. As well as number of dungeons ran in that range. All on the tooltip

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    They are not even undergeared. Good players were doing +10 keys in 180 gear at the beginning of the expansion. Players have just gotten so used to outgear content because of Titanforing that they lost all sense of appropriate gear levels. People think they need to be 220 ilvl to complete heroic raids and +15 keys. A group of good players can easily complete a +10 key in 180 gear and a +15 in 200 gear.
    +15s not +10s ^^ we farmed vault for mythic week and did a mix of 14s and 15s in time and downgraded the 16s and after the vault was caped we switched to +10s on mains only.
    All this with a 190-195 ilvl and class stacking, we didnt had fire mages and boomkins faceroll +15s like you do now lol, my 3 raid chars this tier are DH (main) and Hunter, Ret as split alts so my 3 farm grps looked like this:
    1.) 3 warr and 2 pallys
    2.) 2 dhs and 3 druids
    3.) 1 DK tank 3 Hunter and 1 shaman

    im still baffed how this bads cant get ksm with 220 ilvl, renown 40 and 226 conduits and blaming R.io for it.
    Last edited by Feral Druid ist Op; 2021-04-16 at 12:45 PM.
    I.O BFA Season 3


  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by Wuusah View Post
    These days the timers are very lenient. DoS was tough back when the timer was 2 minutes shorter.

    I still would love to see you raider.io profile.
    Uuuh yes sorry, I forgot, it’s Zexian-Zenedar(EU).

    Nothing to hide, really, feel free to provide hints/suggestions to improve. What a pity that disbanded runs are not logged (but I can understand that).

    I’m not a pro by any meaning and I’m not interested in being, just wanted to try getting KSM as a personal goal, nothing more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    SD has a really generous timer. DoS isn't awful since it got extended, just make sure you 1 phase final to save 2 more mins on fort week bit shldnt be needed. ToP are single pulls anyway, no real way to double pull except for a few in the beginning of plague wing.
    My friend, I know that but I’m the guy who press random buttons when party energy bars go down, remember? I cannot lead runs, I can only hope people dps and don’t stand too much onto bad things on ground.

  9. #429
    Pandaren Monk Sugarcube's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post

    My friend, I know that but I’m the guy who press random buttons when party energy bars go down, remember? I cannot lead runs, I can only hope people dps and don’t stand too much onto bad things on ground.
    you're not dpsing?

  10. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Yep, and that is what is wrong with rio as number simply turn people into vultures while whole game mode into rat race.
    Im not getting accepted -> i push arbitrary score -> I get accepted bit more -> I want to push higher -> but im not getting accepted -> i need to push other dungeons

    and the circle continues. The only way out from this madness is to make a network of friends.

    So now it's basically turning people into numbers. Instead of providing basic data (like top X best dungeons) and giving more filters in finder.
    Yeah, more filters in finder would be a benediction. But I doubt it will ever happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sugarcube View Post
    you're not dpsing?
    Not much usually, too busy healing or dispelling or interrupting. I dps as much as I can but it’s rare I have many room for doing it. The only runs I could dps “for real” were guild runs.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Uuuh yes sorry, I forgot, it’s Zexian-Zenedar(EU).

    Nothing to hide, really, feel free to provide hints/suggestions to improve. What a pity that disbanded runs are not logged (but I can understand that).

    I’m not a pro by any meaning and I’m not interested in being, just wanted to try getting KSM as a personal goal, nothing more.

    - - - Updated - - -


    My friend, I know that but I’m the guy who press random buttons when party energy bars go down, remember? I cannot lead runs, I can only hope people dps and don’t stand too much onto bad things on ground.
    I do that as well but im still contributing ~1.2k dps to the run. Not amazing but definitely helps speed things up.

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by Feral Druid ist Op View Post
    im still baffed how this bads cant get ksm with 220 ilvl, renown 40 and 226 conduits and blaming R.io for it.
    In WoD ilvl naturally filtered out the badies because you could only obtain the highest level gear through the hardest content. And people complained that gear was "gatekeeping" them from content. Then Blizzard made Titanforging and the weekly chest to give the badies higher ilvl since they claimed this was the gatekeeping. But the badies quickly realized that even with better gear they are still "victims" to "gatekeeping"... because in the end they are still badies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    The only way out from this madness is to make a network of friends.
    But you can argue that this is a good and healthy thing for the game. Players should make a network of friends/guildies/teammates.

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    I do that as well but im still contributing ~1.2k dps to the run. Not amazing but definitely helps speed things up.
    As I said before I dps whenever I can but I usually don’t have much room for that, I’m nowhere near 1k dps I think apart from really smooth runs. Also dpsing as resto shaman is quite miserable you can only flame shock, lava surge when it procs and some chain lightning hoping you don’t have to stop cast because someone is dying.

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    As I said before I dps whenever I can but I usually don’t have much room for that, I’m nowhere near 1k dps I think apart from really smooth runs. Also dpsing as resto shaman is quite miserable you can only flame shock, lava surge when it procs and some chain lightning hoping you don’t have to stop cast because someone is dying.
    I dont play resto sham so can't really help much. I guess keep shock on cd, sneak in chain lightning on opener. Drop cap tot to give more time to cast. Keep riptide up for that passive healing. I understand the struggle

  15. #435
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    I dont play resto sham so can't really help much. I guess keep shock on cd, sneak in chain lightning on opener. Drop cap tot to give more time to cast. Keep riptide up for that passive healing. I understand the struggle
    The idea is
    - apply FS
    - cast CL
    - apply FS to another target to raise chances of Lava Burst procs
    - cast CL
    - apply FS to...

    Use LB when it procs as instant cast, apply frost shock if you need to slow a target or kill an explosive affix, end of resto shaman dps capabilities.

    I don’t complain, I’m not interested in dpsing but rshaman is clearly not a Holy Paladin or a Resto Druid dps wise.

  16. #436
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    The idea is
    - apply FS
    - cast CL
    - apply FS to another target to raise chances of Lava Burst procs
    - cast CL
    - apply FS to...

    Use LB when it procs as instant cast, apply frost shock if you need to slow a target or kill an explosive affix, end of resto shaman dps capabilities.

    I don’t complain, I’m not interested in dpsing but rshaman is clearly not a Holy Paladin or a Resto Druid dps wise.
    Idk if it helps at all but on my ele shaman at least, you can cast lavaburst first and spam flameshock so that it goes off immediately after lavaburst cast finishes. Flameshock hits first, so burst still crits. Useful for openers and getting the dmg out 1 gcd earlier

  17. #437
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Uuuh yes sorry, I forgot, it’s Zexian-Zenedar(EU).

    Nothing to hide, really, feel free to provide hints/suggestions to improve. What a pity that disbanded runs are not logged (but I can understand that).

    I’m not a pro by any meaning and I’m not interested in being, just wanted to try getting KSM as a personal goal, nothing more.

    - - - Updated - - -


    My friend, I know that but I’m the guy who press random buttons when party energy bars go down, remember? I cannot lead runs, I can only hope people dps and don’t stand too much onto bad things on ground.
    I think your biggest problem is that you're not really looking at your group members when you join a run. Like look at HoA:

    Your latest run was a complete clown fiesta with two dps at 700 io and one at 1300. All three from the same guild. Clearly one player trying to carry their mates for a weekly 14.
    The run before that looked really good at first glance. But look at that moonkin. He has no track record whatsoever for lower keys. He started at 15 and has some 16s by now all with some guild mates. He's clearly benefitting from good players in his guild who pushed him through. If you looked at him ingame, his "dungeons in 10-14 range" number must've been ridiculously low. A clear sign of someone being boosted. Also the DK had not many keys done at all as dps 11 days ago. He went from only tanking some of them to dps'ing a +14 with no real dps experience.

    You could have a significantly better dungeon experience if you actually used raider.io before the dungeon starts.

  18. #438
    Quote Originally Posted by Wuusah View Post
    I think your biggest problem is that you're not really looking at your group members when you join a run. Like look at HoA:

    Your latest run was a complete clown fiesta with two dps at 700 io and one at 1300. All three from the same guild. Clearly one player trying to carry their mates for a weekly 14.
    The run before that looked really good at first glance. But look at that moonkin. He has no track record whatsoever for lower keys. He started at 15 and has some 16s by now all with some guild mates. He's clearly benefitting from good players in his guild who pushed him through. If you looked at him ingame, his "dungeons in 10-14 range" number must've been ridiculously low. A clear sign of someone being boosted. Also the DK had not many keys done at all as dps 11 days ago. He went from only tanking some of them to dps'ing a +14 with no real dps experience.

    You could have a significantly better dungeon experience if you actually used raider.io before the dungeon starts.
    90% of runs you see in there are pugs, they are not my keys. That HoA I joined i only saw the Druid (if i remember well) 1200 that created the group, probably to bait an healer (halooo, here I am XD). I immediately understood when I joined and I saw the other members that timing it would have been impossible but despite my zero spare time I’m kind hearted and I feel sorry if I leave keys without even giving them a try. We made it in the end, I needed it for the vault anyways so I decided to stay.

    That’s why I said that 50% of my last month runs are a failure and I hope that in blizzard score it will be also possible to see the rio of the other group members and not only the rio of the dude who created the group.

    The thing I can do for sure is running my keys way more I did in the past.

    Thanks for the tips!

  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    90% of runs you see in there are pugs, they are not my keys. That HoA I joined i only saw the Druid (if i remember well) 1200 that created the group, probably to bait an healer (halooo, here I am XD). I immediately understood when I joined and I saw the other members that timing it would have been impossible but despite my zero spare time I’m kind hearted and I feel sorry if I leave keys without even giving them a try. We made it in the end, I needed it for the vault anyways so I decided to stay.

    That’s why I said that 50% of my last month runs are a failure and I hope that in blizzard score it will be also possible to see the rio of the other group members and not only the rio of the dude who created the group.

    The thing I can do for sure is running my keys way more I did in the past.

    Thanks for the tips!
    You don't have to run your own keys. You can just join a group, look at the other 3 players who you couldn't see before joining and then decide whether you want to do that or not. As healer you do have that luxury to just leave groups before the run starts and try to find something better. Same for tanks.

    You're saying your time is limited but then act like it's not. If you want to get KSM while not having much time to play, then you need to aggressively use raider.io. It's way better to take the 5-10 minutes extra before starting the dungeon and therefore committing to that hopefully good group, than to waste 30+ minutes over and over again with bad ones.

    Your rio profile is the perfect example why rio is so important and why playing without it is such a miserable pug experience.

  20. #440
    Quote Originally Posted by Wuusah View Post
    You don't have to run your own keys. You can just join a group, look at the other 3 players who you couldn't see before joining and then decide whether you want to do that or not. As healer you do have that luxury to just leave groups before the run starts and try to find something better. Same for tanks.

    You're saying your time is limited but then act like it's not. If you want to get KSM while not having much time to play, then you need to aggressively use raider.io. It's way better to take the 5-10 minutes extra before starting the dungeon and therefore committing to that hopefully good group, than to waste 30+ minutes over and over again with bad ones.

    Your rio profile is the perfect example why rio is so important and why playing without it is such a miserable pug experience.
    On top of this, i think its important he adapts to this now rather than later. When I am making a group and see someone with the correct ilvl, and the right info in the rio tool tip, I load up their page real fast. If I open up the specific dungeon, and one or 2 others, I see how many have been timed and at what level and date. If I see you haven't timed one for a month or so, and you have like 3 failed ones since then, im gonna pass over you.

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