Imagine being a new player in 9.1

[sam86]

Was there a confirmation about the additional 40 renown levels?

Even so, there is catchup that is quite generous.

Then again, people are going to feel behind if they join an MMORPG months into the content.

exactly /10 char
technically u don't need that renown to get to raiding, if that's ur goal

[Swnem]

Wait till 9.3. XD

160?

Yeah, i wasnt excited about 40 more renown either.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

You finally finished leveling to level 60 and now you are greeted with 80 renown levels
Sounds absolutely terrible

i have (for splitraid purposes) 2 alts and my main decked out in 4x 40 Renown, and ican tell you that you can get 40 in one Day spamming HC Dungeons and +2 keys after HCs stop giving you Renown, 9 from the campaign 2 from calling and 2 from the weekly (which you have insta competed with the SD quest + 5 souls, and dont turn in the weeklys until you are 38)

[cface]

i have (for splitraid purposes) 2 alts and my main decked out in 4x 40 Renown, and ican tell you that you can get 40 in one Day spamming HC Dungeons and +2 keys after HCs stop giving you Renown, 9 from the campaign 2 from calling and 2 from the weekly (which you have insta competed with the SD quest + 5 souls, and dont turn in the weeklys until you are 38)

What exactly does 1 day consists for you? You nolife the shit out of that day? Cause for many, me included, a good day is 2-3 hours of gaming, normally less. And I do not wanna spend that time doing dogshit content that's not challenging or even rewarding (removing valorcap would make it rewarding).
Some people play wow for it's relaxed content, while many other do it for the challenge in raiding/dungeons. Also playing the same got damn char is extremely boring to me, and I need to have 3 specs.
Imagine only playing 1 character in LoL/dota. Or just 1 char in diablo. In BFA, I could easily get a char decently geared in S4. I suspect they will do this in SL as well, you just gotta skip the insanely boring seasons for them to get their head out of their ass and make wow fun, which they tend to do in the end.

[Gaidax]

Big number scarey, the 9.1 edition.

Laughable. I thought we got over it back in the kindergarten when we learned that after 9 comes 10 and so on.

[LuminaL]

imagine being a new player and having stuff to do. God damn !

people want absolutly no content that they cant instantly get their hands on, but then gonna bitch on forums on how this expansion is bad abecause there is nothing to do and how its a bad game design and they dont want new comers to be at the same level of power as they are and when they are given content they bitch about how boring it is that they actually have to do that content.

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What exactly does 1 day consists for you? You nolife the shit out of that day? Cause for many, me included, a good day is 2-3 hours of gaming, normally less. And I do not wanna spend that time doing dogshit content that's not challenging or even rewarding (removing valorcap would make it rewarding).
Some people play wow for it's relaxed content, while many other do it for the challenge in raiding/dungeons. Also playing the same got damn char is extremely boring to me, and I need to have 3 specs.
Imagine only playing 1 character in LoL/dota. Or just 1 char in diablo. In BFA, I could easily get a char decently geared in S4. I suspect they will do this in SL as well, you just gotta skip the insanely boring seasons for them to get their head out of their ass and make wow fun, which they tend to do in the end.

you want instant max renown you invest time in the game, you cant invest time in the game? then do it over the course of a week and stop moaning about it. its that simple: you get as much reward as you invest time and effort into stuff. its same rule in game, its the same rule in real world.

also if you think wow is boring now, I have some serious bad news for you: its been much better than what it was 10 years ago and if you dont like it now, dont wait for it to suddenly become fun again, you are dreaming about your nostalgic past, you cant repeat that, its how it is. if its not some nostalgic dream, then again there is always classic and TBC servers for you, which according to you should be fun for you.

[Crysis]

You finally finished leveling to level 60 and now you are greeted with 80 renown levels
Sounds absolutely terrible

So basically playing any mmorpg that has been online for few years and where you kinda have to expect you are gonna have to catch up to others sooner or later.

Yeah, next stupid problem?

This is so annoying, petty and childish, seriously, either theres nothing to do, or theres too much to do, reputations suck, reputations dont suck, we dont want any grinds, we miss basic grinds - WoW playerbase is so split, no wonder developers dont know what to *fix* sooner, since everybody has problem with everything. How about for once you enjoy knowing theres gonna be more rewards for you to pick up along the way, huh? But that would probably require too much thinking for some people.

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Big number scarey, the 9.1 edition.

Laughable. I thought we got over it back in the kindergarten when we learned that after 9 comes 10 and so on.

This pretty much. We could have been level 130 by now, do millions of damage, see our power grow, make an impact. But no. Instead we have to revert, squish and nerf everything even remotely hard for kids to grasp.

[cface]

people want absolutly no content that they cant instantly get their hands on, but then gonna bitch on forums on how this expansion is bad abecause there is nothing to do and how its a bad game design and they dont want new comers to be at the same level of power as they are and when they are given content they bitch about how boring it is that they actually have to do that content.

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you want instant max renown you invest time in the game, you cant invest time in the game? then do it over the course of a week and stop moaning about it. its that simple: you get as much reward as you invest time and effort into stuff. its same rule in game, its the same rule in real world.

also if you think wow is boring now, I have some serious bad news for you: its been much better than what it was 10 years ago and if you dont like it now, dont wait for it to suddenly become fun again, you are dreaming about your nostalgic past, you cant repeat that, its how it is. if its not some nostalgic dream, then again there is always classic and TBC servers for you, which according to you should be fun for you.

Yes I think so, it's called an opinion, you may have heard of it. My problem is the rewards are dogshit. Doing vision in BFA gave you 10! ilvl over hc raid, doing torghast, gives you some lousy soulash that gets boring real quick.
Doing mythic dungeon feels incredible unrewarding, and the only way to pump alts through is by armor stacking, which now is an absolute must thanks too 2 loots at the end, and the ilvl is pathetic. It just feels like do your dungeon, THEN wait at the weekly lootgate. Woho, 1 slot.

Content needs to be rewarding, and putting all of the rewards (and I mean ALL) behind a silly fucking weekly vault is dumb as fuck. I do not miss BFA essences, or Legion legendary random drop rate every 3 weeks, only to have the highest probability to be let down, but in the end they fixed it. Why do they always have to make expansions so crappy in the beginning, only at the end make it feel good.
Problem would be solved so much if they just reverted back to 3 loots at the end, and 5 ilvls above heroic on a 15, hc loot at 12. You still need to fish for weapons/trinkets etc in the vault. Either this, or remove valor cap.

[Lochton]

exactly /10 char
technically u don't need that renown to get to raiding, if that's ur goal

I mean, if we follow the OP's mentality of worry, then a brand new player's worry wouldn't be renown level but the massive world to explore and systems to understand, and communities to bind with, and much more. They have a new adventure to get on. 40 renown levels more is nothing compared to the rest, as that will as well be caught up by time, faster than how the old players went through the content.

The only one that would worry about 40 new levels is the person who quit when he reached the first 40 - even so, that person SHOULD by then know that he/she had to catch up on things.

[ellieg]

Mage alt dinged 60 on Sunday. Did world boss, 1 renown. Did 5 timewalking for weekly (honestly can't remember if it did but that shld be 5 is renown there). Did 2 layer of torghast, 2 renown. Turned in souls quest, 1 renown. Ran SD for calling and to get the 750 anima thing. 1 renown from boss, 1 from calling. 1 additional for turning in 1k anima quest.

This week. 1 layer of torghast 1 renown. Did 6 of my cov chapters. 6 renown. Ran all of lfr last night. Im up to like 27 or so renown. Got the anima from lfr to turn in the 1k quest.

Literally just progressing how you normally would, gets you caught up. Ill finish up the last cov chapters, maybe do some bgs to get some easy 197 honor gear, and most likely be caught up. Last trait of soulbind is 34. I think there's a 2% stam around renown 37? The last 3 levels give no sort of power anyway. Ill get them by starting m+ if im not capped by then.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

It's not difficult or insanely long to get caught up to 40 right now. I think I got to 32 in my first couple days on a fresh alt recently. The problem with it is more it is insanely boring. The covy stuff was fine when you were on offing them weekly but when you sit down and grind them out it quickly becomes insanely obvious how brainless and just raw time sink the things are. It's zero difficulty. Zero thought. Not much interesting story telling. Really its just go to marker, 3 quests, go to next marker, 3 quests, back to sanctum, get new marker, 3 quests..... and repeat like 4 times. It's just not good content.

[cface]

Mage alt dinged 60 on Sunday. Did world boss, 1 renown. Did 5 timewalking for weekly (honestly can't remember if it did but that shld be 5 is renown there). Did 2 layer of torghast, 2 renown. Turned in souls quest, 1 renown. Ran SD for calling and to get the 750 anima thing. 1 renown from boss, 1 from calling. 1 additional for turning in 1k anima quest.

This week. 1 layer of torghast 1 renown. Did 6 of my cov chapters. 6 renown. Ran all of lfr last night. Im up to like 27 or so renown. Got the anima from lfr to turn in the 1k quest.

Literally just progressing how you normally would, gets you caught up. Ill finish up the last cov chapters, maybe do some bgs to get some easy 197 honor gear, and most likely be caught up. Last trait of soulbind is 34. I think there's a 2% stam around renown 37? The last 3 levels give no sort of power anyway. Ill get them by starting m+ if im not capped by then.

I'm not sure why OP is bashing renown of all things, it's exactly as you said and not even timegated when catching up. My biggest alt complaint is how long it takes to get gear, and how incredible low the ilevel is in m+ compared to BFA.
Are they afraid people reach their 226 ilvl gear too fast, and then quit? Sure there are people like that, but I think&feel most will push dungeons/logs/mythic raid with that gear, or do it all again on a different char. Why make gear so got damn hard to get? And no, I don't step a foot in pvp, it's not what wow is for me, got Dota for my pvp experience. Maybe when they nerf pvp gear they will finally give in and increase dungeon loot.
My biggest nolifing in wow was at end of Legion, gearing up one alt after the other, getting a lot of mage towers on them, and just enjoying the crap out of the game. I think torgast has a potential, with people gearing up different alts and try it in dungeons/raids/torgast and maybe even pvp.

This whole thing feels like they are punishing us for speaking up against WF/TF gear, and thought everyone wanted the classic experience.

[Deadite]

you dont need to get 40 renown levels to get flying...

How do you know? You could be right but you say it like it is a fact.

[Belloc]

I remember being a returning player a couple weeks before 8.1. I was further along on my Heart of Azeroth before most of the rest of my friend's guild who had been playing from the start of the expansion. WoW does catchup mechanics really well.

[FelPlague]

How do you know? You could be right but you say it like it is a fact.

Because they literally told us we get it when we finish the cov campaign, and that finishes at 59.

Which means 6 weeks of we get renown at the same rate

[rrayy]

Maintaining or increasing MAUs requires player engagement. If someone only logs in for one minute a month they probably won't stay subscribed in the next month.

All "games as a service" utilize various methods to drive engagement, usually in the form of login rewards and daily or weekly tasks, and repeatable content in general (be it reputation grinds, renown grinds, gear grinds, or whatever).

THat isn't hard to get and calling time gates "things to keep you subbed" is just nonsense. There are a lot of people who do sub each month that may only play a couple of hours every month for whatever reason. "Keeping you subbed" is not why they time gate. They time gate so one doesn't feel they are required to complete content immediately.

[Stardrift]

Yeah I too know someone (a lot of people) who spends 40-60$ on a game, plays once, then never launches it ever again. It's not something people admit to because it's embarrassing behavior.

Yea lol. They enjoyed the hell out of Legion, stuck it through BFA, then saw the over convoluted systems in SL and just quit, despite making the purchase. Other two friends just gave up while questing.

And I'd be lying if I didn't consider just putting it down right away too, but I stuck through it because I'm stubborn. It's safe to say though if the next expansion has similar timegated power grinds, I'm just going ultra casual. I already only complete normal raids once just to see the fights and catch some transmog along the way, but I'm thinking fuck raiding entirely.

[Kathranis]

THat isn't hard to get and calling time gates "things to keep you subbed" is just nonsense. There are a lot of people who do sub each month that may only play a couple of hours every month for whatever reason. "Keeping you subbed" is not why they time gate. They time gate so one doesn't feel they are required to complete content immediately.

I wasn't talking about timegating. I was talking about repeatable tasks that encourage you to login and play for at least short bursts every few days to keep you engaged with the game. World Quests and Callings are like the opposite of timegating, they're there to create at least some degree of FOMO.

Timegating is a way to artificially lengthen the longevity of content purely because there's a limit to how much content they can produce. If they could implement new quests and events every week (like lots of mobile games do) they probably would, but it's just not feasible.

There's a real delicate push and pull between giving players novel experiences, repeatable content, content that could be removed, and preventing them from burning through content too quickly.

I can't imagine the amount of research they've done on player engagement, but the developers of this game are probably some of the most knowledgeable on the subject.

[Deadite]

Because they literally told us we get it when we finish the cov campaign, and that finishes at 59.

Which means 6 weeks of we get renown at the same rate

Yeah but we were done with the campaign ages ago. I guess it is 'We’ve had one, yes. What about second campaign?' I must have just missed when they said it would be flying at 59 renown.

[FelPlague]

Yeah but we were done with the campaign ages ago. I guess it is 'We’ve had one, yes. What about second campaign?' I must have just missed when they said it would be flying at 59 renown.

they said flying would be gotten once you finished the campaign, and on the ptr right now you can check, and the final chapter is at 59.