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  1. #1

    9.1 Boomkin Covenant

    Looking for advice.

    It is too early to tell if the changes mentioned will stay or if they will re-evaluate and make more changes for boomkins. However, where we sit now with the announced new leggos as well as the changes. Are we sure that NF is still going to be the superior cov choice for boomkin? A follow up question, is there a serious possibility that Kyrian could contend with dmg?


    To me, I almost feel like the nerf to BoAT, if it stays, will make NF almost at a closer equal or even lower dmg output as Kyrian and that would be after scrambling for stat changing. The reason I feel this way is... As noted in multiple guides Convoke was abnormally powerful with BoAT as the Leggo. With the nerf coming to boat, if people want to continue to use BoAT, the obvious idea would be to weight the crit stat more.

    When weighing crit more may lower the mastery and verse and Haste depending on what the experience is after the change. With lowering Mastery, Verse and haste and with the idea that Incarnation spec for 10 percent crit could this potentially lower the amount of damage overall that NF added to Boomkin? I would have to assume, that the above would result with a slower game play due to haste lost with starlord out of spec as well.

    Also, with the new convoke leggo, if that sits as announced, could cause BoAT to be replaced. This will severely kill crit and that convoke with BoAT dmg combo. Would this be thought as a dps gain enough to also not think kyrian would be a potentially better dmg cov?

    All of what is mentioned above leads me to believe that Kyrian will get better.

  2. #2
    Elemental Lord clevin's Avatar
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    If you really want to go Kyrian it will be fine. The covenants aren't going to be 10% of your damage etc so it really doesnt matter. For all but the very best, improving play will give you more damage than moving covenants.

    As to all of the specifics... we don't and can't know because it will change on the PTR and if they break anything it take a couple weeks to show when 9.1 is live.

    So, you asked for advice and here's mine - Sit tight. Do nothing until 9.1 is out for couple of weeks and we have real data from live... .UNLESS you're a high end mythic raider. In that case, you can theorycraft yourself and do what you need to.
    Last edited by clevin; 2021-04-15 at 04:45 PM.

  3. #3
    Personally dabble in mythic but don't push it hard we more so raid heroic to get AOTC and move on and do alt runs. That being said I been Kyrian since the jump and really wanted to switch NF for 9.1 to improve my dps and to be ready for 9.1 but keep holding back due to lack of desire to farm renown. Another reason I havent been too pressed to switch to NF from Kyrian is because in the logs overall per ilvl even as kyrian sit really well and I out perform a lot of the NF druids I come in contact with. Currently sitting at 84.9 overall on warcraft logs in heroic per ilvl.

  4. #4
    Just wait until we have more solid data, or you might just find yourself switching back and forth repeatedly. It's far to early to make any real decisions.

  5. #5
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Druid
    Balance
    New Moon (Talent) now has 20 second recharge (was 25 seconds).

    Solstice (Talent) now causes Shooting Stars to fall 200% more often (was 300%).

    Stellar Drift (Talent) has been redesigned – Starfall damage increased by 25% and allows you to cast while moving while Starfall is active, but it has a 15 second cooldown.

    The free Starfall from Oneth’s Clear Vision (Runecarving Power) ignores the Stellar Drift (Talent) Starfall cooldown.

    Balance of All Things (Runecarving Power) now grants 24% increased critical strike chance (was 40%) and decreases by 3% every 1 second (was 8% every 1 second).
    Obviously, these are not finalized yet; but let's say these make it to live, are these big enough nerfs to dictate changes?

    I already have Primordial Arcanic Pulsar at Rank 4, and I would assume that would be the next legendary in line for raiding.

  6. #6
    SD change makes the talent worse than having no talent at all in that row, so I would hope the devs not to be stupid enough to let that go live, but well... It is Blizzard, so.

    Solstice change makes the talent trash too, and New Moon change is not enough to make it worth takin, so basically we'll just be running FoE for everything if this goes live. As for the Lego, idk what would replace it, but BoAT is basically gutted.

  7. #7
    As Dragonskyr said, the changes to our talents are devastating right now. There is a reason we did not use FoE or Moon on the last row and blizz just nerfs the only thing that was just not as bad as the other 2. SD is just a stupid change, nothing else - I really hope that blizz is not going with this, as this is completely killing this talent.

    The BoAT was pretty obvious, but this will simply kill this legendary, but at least we got other that are not abyssmal (hello bm hunter legendaries pre-buff).

    Hopefully there will be more thought out changes coming (ofc we are early in the PTR but.. yeah), otherwise I'll have to just not play this class again anymore, once again, same as having to quit playing FDK because of BoS.

  8. #8
    Immortal Raugnaut's Avatar
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    BoAT is a longer term buff for Convoke honestly. With the current iteration, you basically had a very low boost to crit for the later portion of Convoke. Whats more, as we get more gear and thus more crit, it would cause us to benefit less from BoaT during the first 2 seconds of it. Now not only do we retain a larger portion of the crit for a longer duration, but we won't run into "crit soft caps" in which any more crit then a certain %age becomes less valuable during the original BoAT window.

    There is also the new Convoke legendary - If it works akin to the Anima Power, then it'll replace any Wraths with Full Moon, an absolutely gargantuan burst increase.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moounter View Post
    I think your problem is a lack of intellect.

  9. #9
    I wish they made the Moons talent on par with whatever else is best there. It's pretty sad (right now) that for our last talent tier the best one is a passive that's barely noticeable... So many specs have cool things in their last tier. FoE is pretty meh too for an active.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    BoAT is a longer term buff for Convoke honestly. With the current iteration, you basically had a very low boost to crit for the later portion of Convoke. Whats more, as we get more gear and thus more crit, it would cause us to benefit less from BoaT during the first 2 seconds of it. Now not only do we retain a larger portion of the crit for a longer duration, but we won't run into "crit soft caps" in which any more crit then a certain %age becomes less valuable during the original BoAT window.

    There is also the new Convoke legendary - If it works akin to the Anima Power, then it'll replace any Wraths with Full Moon, an absolutely gargantuan burst increase.
    The legendary makes it last twice as long with half the casts, it won't be the same as having the anima power on live

  11. #11
    The only good thing about MoonMoon is Full Moon....the other two spells could not possibly feel less impactful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tennisace View Post
    Are these resisters actually contributing to our country and paying their taxes? Or are they freeloading?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Myztikrice View Post
    The legendary makes it last twice as long with half the casts, it won't be the same as having the anima power on live
    The Legendary makes it last half as long with half the casts and half the CD. Basically, it cuts everything in half, except how often the "special" spell happens.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    BoAT is a longer term buff for Convoke honestly. With the current iteration, you basically had a very low boost to crit for the later portion of Convoke. Whats more, as we get more gear and thus more crit, it would cause us to benefit less from BoaT during the first 2 seconds of it. Now not only do we retain a larger portion of the crit for a longer duration, but we won't run into "crit soft caps" in which any more crit then a certain %age becomes less valuable during the original BoAT window.

    There is also the new Convoke legendary - If it works akin to the Anima Power, then it'll replace any Wraths with Full Moon, an absolutely gargantuan burst increase.
    I agree. Now im holding myself with crit and haste cause of Legendary and convoke. Wich meens with higher item lvl u become weaker. Same with mastery and versa they eventually drop in worth more gear u have. So i see this as a fix but then again the Covenant Lego is prolly way to go. But can we combines Covenant lego with normal Lego then NF with BOAT seems pretty insane.

    Also the empyreal nerf putting other trinkets on 40 sec instead of 30. Will destroy our burst aswell. for ST that is

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    The Legendary makes it last half as long with half the casts and half the CD. Basically, it cuts everything in half, except how often the "special" spell happens.
    Ah that's right, still shouldn't use the Torghast experience as indicative of what the legendary experience will be

  15. #15
    Wow im retired. But those are some crazy nerfs.
    No more perma cast while moving and balance of all things is now 24%? It was 50 or 60% at the start, lol

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Argenon View Post
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Druid
    Balance
    New Moon (Talent) now has 20 second recharge (was 25 seconds).

    Solstice (Talent) now causes Shooting Stars to fall 200% more often (was 300%).

    Stellar Drift (Talent) has been redesigned – Starfall damage increased by 25% and allows you to cast while moving while Starfall is active, but it has a 15 second cooldown.

    The free Starfall from Oneth’s Clear Vision (Runecarving Power) ignores the Stellar Drift (Talent) Starfall cooldown.

    Balance of All Things (Runecarving Power) now grants 24% increased critical strike chance (was 40%) and decreases by 3% every 1 second (was 8% every 1 second).
    Obviously, these are not finalized yet; but let's say these make it to live, are these big enough nerfs to dictate changes?

    I already have Primordial Arcanic Pulsar at Rank 4, and I would assume that would be the next legendary in line for raiding.

    With those nerfs in play on ptr, balance druids in testing were still top 3 dps on both raid boss fights that weren't even AOE. Needless to say, balance druids can stop crying they're going to be fine, clearly the nerfs were needed if they're still a top dps after them

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by GnomeEU View Post
    Wow im retired. But those are some crazy nerfs.
    No more perma cast while moving and balance of all things is now 24%? It was 50 or 60% at the start, lol
    24% but loses that over 8 seconds, rather than 5 seconds. Not really surprising, either; they already commented back when they nerfed it to 40% that they only didn't go further because they didn't want to change the legendary rankings during progression.

    It would have become an issue later on anyway, since secondaries are still going to rise as we go through the expansion.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    24% but loses that over 8 seconds, rather than 5 seconds. Not really surprising, either; they already commented back when they nerfed it to 40% that they only didn't go further because they didn't want to change the legendary rankings during progression.

    It would have become an issue later on anyway, since secondaries are still going to rise as we go through the expansion.
    What's not funny, but amusing, is I left the game out of weariness because I just didn't enjoy the BoAT and Solstice playstyle nor the player reaction to not being "optimal" -- I very much enjoyed Celestial Alignment in regular intervals (with the Arctic Pulsar equivalent) and Fury of Elune for snap Ap and/or a little extra passive cleave when I wanted it. But then I'm also a player that preferred guardian affinity with renewal because 15 years of this game conditioned me to being a tanky feathered turret. I couldn't move while casting if you wanted me to LOL

    Perfect world I would have full moon back just because throwing moons is awesome but not sure the 5 second reduction makes it worth it.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Mythicalchicken View Post
    Perfect world I would have full moon back just because throwing moons is awesome but not sure the 5 second reduction makes it worth it.
    Tbh I wouldn't mind if they redesigned this talent. Get rid of New Moon and Half Moon, leave it only as Full Moon, place it on something like 1 or 2 minute cd, increase AP gain and make it spread Moonfire to all affected enemies which would fit thematically.

    New Moon and Half Moon are such barebones spells not worth casting (but then you have to cast them to get to Full Moon) and I wish we had some meaningful, cool cd on our last row as many other specs have.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    BoAT is a longer term buff for Convoke honestly. With the current iteration, you basically had a very low boost to crit for the later portion of Convoke. Whats more, as we get more gear and thus more crit, it would cause us to benefit less from BoaT during the first 2 seconds of it. Now not only do we retain a larger portion of the crit for a longer duration
    It is still only 8 seconds 40% losing 5% each second is 8 seconds. 24% losing 3% each second is 8 seconds.

    So was - 40 -> 35 -> 30 -> 25 -> 20 -> 15 -> 10 -> 5 -> 0
    Now its - 24 -> 21 ->18 -> 15 -> 12 -> 9 -> 6 -> 3 -> 0

    So how is this a longer term buff?

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