1. #1061
    I'm mid way through SB, and I take days away from progressing the MSQ.
    one day I'll craft lots of stuff for requisitions, or quests, to level up my gatherer/crafters.
    another day I'll level my lowest levels class to unlock their jobs at 30 (gotta get used to the job names & icons for high level content).

  2. #1062
    Quote Originally Posted by Myradin View Post
    Graphically the player/gear models are superior, though the environments feel very drab.
    Other players definitely seem friendlier and more inviting, haven't seen any drama in dungeons yet either.
    Game seems to use its open world a bit better.

    That said the main quest is a snore fest most the time. And there's a number of things people complain about in retail wow that are present, even worse, or completely absent here.
    The ARR MSQ suffers from being excessively wordy as they were settling into the story and their style. paragraphs and paragraphs of text saying what could have been said in a single one. Alphinaud and urianger were like this by design because one is a patronizing know-it-all and the other just talks archaicly in a winded fashion but for other cases it could have been avoided. Fortunately it gets better and more interesting after the major ARR event occurs the closer you get to the next expansion in post-ARR.

    ARR does establish the foundation of everything which comes later, but a lot of the wordy stuff is better to just skim.

  3. #1063
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Did you complete the whole MSQ? If you haven't your analysis doesn't really change if I'm being honest. While I think the overall story is really good there are giant mounds of filler to get to the good stuff, making the MSQ way longer than it has to be. RPG going to RPG I guess, but the game really isn't as super deep as the dozens of hours each expansions dialogue will lead you to believe (even though I think it's overall pretty excellent). The TLDR here is that there's a lot of TLDR in the game, with ARR as an entire entity being a big TLDR.
    I only just completed ARR last night. Admittedly it has a very strong finish, although a bit too heavy on the cinematics. Narratively I wish it'd done a better job sprinkling the empire throughout the ARR quest chain, as it often felt like i'd go hep a farmer for hours, suddenly get involved with big important people....then get sent to another farm somewhere to make cheese.

    FF14 definitely presents its actual main quest stuff very well when its not being filler. The ending of ARR was more hype than any raid in wow to be honest. But the road to get there is long and boring, that if i didnt have other friends playing, i'd have probably bailed like I did when I actually joined briefly in 2016.

    Its odd, its not like leveling in wow isn't full of random mundane stuff, but WoW's world has more...character to it. I could (and have) picked pumpkins and killed rats for hours in WoW, but it feels like pulling nails in FF14.

  4. #1064
    Now that im starting 5.3, i wanna give my random ratings.
    What criteria to use?

    Gameplay: (dungeons, world content, raids, trials, etc)
    Story: (is it engaging)
    Entire Package: (all the other stuff and worldbuilding)
    Objective Score: (related to other games)

    These are of course comparative (and used against one another - rather than an objective score versus other games... actually, hang on, ill add in an ill considered objective score as well just because...)
    So, ARR:

    Gameplay: 40/100
    Story: 2.0: 40/100, post 2.0: 60/100
    Entire Package: 65/100 (so much world building, plus loads of stuff to do from squadrons to beast tribes to coils to extreme raids, its... decent).
    Objective Score: 55/100

    Heavensward:

    Gameplay: 60/100
    Story: 80/100 (so much more engaging)
    Entire Package: 60/100 (its more of the same, innit?)
    Objective Score: 7/10

    Stormblood:

    Gameplay: 90/100 (every single dungeon and trial was super fun - honestly, it felt like the perfect difficulty - reminder, im a story player, not a high end gamer).
    Story: (pre yanxia): 30/100 I hated it. From Yanxia on, 80/100
    Entire Package: 50/100 (i burst through it so dont really have the perspective everyone else who played it when current has).
    Objective Score: 7/10

    Shadowbringers:

    Gameplay: 70/100. I think trust spoiled this for me. I really feel those deaths in dungeons in a way i might not have if i ran them with others. And it kinda sours the enjoyment a tiny bit. Im almost certain the dungeons are so much fun (amaurot was genuinely amazing, but sooooo challenging with the trust system, just as an example).
    Story: 90/100. I loved the sb story. I thought the shb hype was a bit much. But compared to everything that came before it... You just have to experience it. Then post on the spoiler thread every crackpot idea you have because your brain is going to be so engaged trying to solve a puzzle (that the game WILL explain to you anyway, but who cares, youre gonna want to piece it together all by yourself anyway because you are so engaged and immersed). Its... im not sure?... fun? Its super fun.
    Entire Package: 75/100. The universe building is enormous. No idea about the side content. But its so big for lore drops. Were i playing this whilst current, i reckon it'd squeeze a few extra points. Or maybe Bozja would sink it into oblivion. Ive no idea. All i know is that the pixie beast tribe quest is fun and the world building is enormous.
    Objective Score: 9/10

    Ooooh, can i knock 5 points off the story (5.2/3 transition spoilers) because my character didnt say to the people who think they're the warrior of light "would you please stfu and look at the effing sky? How dumb are you? I literally gave you night time (after 100 years), barely a day ago? What the hell is wrong with you? You want to be a warrior of light? Did you not see that shit for the past 100 years? What is literally wrong with you?" I knocked 5 points off the score. There you go, endwalker. Make me proud!

    ETA2: The clipping of my hairstyle (its literally basic af) is unacceptable. You hear me squeex! UN. AK. SEPTIBLE!!
    Last edited by ippollite; 2021-09-20 at 03:54 PM.

  5. #1065
    Scarab Lord
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    4,890
    One of the big reasons I didn't like Stormblood is because I felt like it padded the story elements far too much with pointless stuff, and a lot of the pre-Doma stuff was really bad. It led to a really disjointed experience and I found myself not caring about half of the storyline in general.

    Also, another huge critique of Stormblood (and this isn't an exaggeration), is that there's barely any combat or interactive parts in the MSQ that isn't just reading through chat boxes. Both HW and ShB tell just as a complete story (or more IMO) while having a good mix of scenarios, combat quests or just generally questing that doesn't involve jumping through 600 million chat bubbles.

    It's funny because for me the two best parts of the game are the MSQ and the actual raiding itself. I haven't done savage or extreme trials, but I don't really have to in order to know that they would be excellent content. The normal mode versions of all of these things (once your UI is setup so you can actually see shit) are all utterly fantastic, and while there's decidedly less overall raid content in FF14, it's just as good IMO. I know that savage and extreme trials are more than just numbers checks, to where they expand on the encounters themes and add quite a bit more. My only critique would be that some of the encounters are incredibly long, and some of the encounters have action time sequences when I think is really lame.

    The dungeons in FF14 will never really be a selling point to me. As a singular experience (doing them once) they're really good, but that's about it. Aside from a couple dungeons the formula for bosses, trash pacing and length of the dungeon is virtually the same from level 1 through 80.

    Extra areas like Bozja/Zandor and Eureka are really interesting concepts, which are sort of mixed to me depending on which one you're talking about. All in all they serve a cosmetic purpose, a gearing system, alternative combat system, while mostly telling a side story that's interesting on it's own. Some of them are pretty good, while other's a pretty meh. The redeeming factor is even the meh ones are something you can entirely skip if you want, and generally just serve as a grindy way to obtain cosmetic weapon experiences that eventually become your BiS weapon near the end of an expansion.

    Alliance raids are really bad in general and I can't think that I've ever had a positive experience with them as I've grumbled about them multiple times in the FF section of these boards. Hilariously enough, the 24 and 48 man "alliance raids" in Bozja and Zandor are actually way better than any of the 3 standard Alliance raids that appear through the game, especially from a mechanics and fun standpoint (granted the 48 man ones without a proper UI setup is an absolute cluster fuck).

    I play WoW for dungeons and raids. I play FF14 for the MSQ and the raids as well. I think they both do raids in interesting ways, and while I like that WoW puts out far more actual raid content, I can't deny that the presentation nor the raid size of FF14 isn't a compelling selling point.

  6. #1066
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    I don't feel compelled to log in and do chores every day.

    In WoW, you had to log in every day and do your chores, or you were falling behind. You had to do your world quests, and kill the world boss, and then your mythic + run for your chest, and then do the LFRs, and then do your visions. And then, once you had done all that, hopefully you were high enough ilevel to get accepted into a PUG for the latest raid so you can get your weekly lockouts. If you don't keep up with doing your chores, you eventually won't be able to get into a PuG, and that's GG because everything in WoW boils down to "doing the latest raid on the highest difficulty possible".

    In FFXIV, not everything boils down to raiding. Raiding is just another activity you can do if you want to do. Yes, there are chores (your roulettes), but they aren't mandatory: they're for leveling up the other jobs if you want to. Yes, there is stuff at endgame that have ilevel requirements, but it is pretty easy to meet them (buy exarchic gear, or turn in your tomestones at Eulmore, or do a few dungeon/Nier runs, or any combination of those three). I can not log in for weeks or even a few months and come back and I can still pretty much jump into almost anything just like that, whereas WoW felt like a secondary job.
    Honestly...a lot of this is the community, not the game. You didn't need to keep up with your gear or whatnot in ff14 because the players didn't care / require you to have the best at all times, or require you to be 10 ilvs higher than the content requires. With the wow people migrating to ff14, I would not be surprised one bit if this mentality gets brought over to ff14 too. I haven't played in awhile so I guess I'll see for myself how it is in the new expansion.

    Ofc at the very high levels (world first), you should be keeping up with everything, but this toxic mindset trickled down to even the casual guilds who couldn't clear the raid even after 7 months. It was really sad.
    Last edited by blackpink; 2021-09-20 at 06:52 PM.

  7. #1067
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    Honestly...a lot of this is the community, not the game. You didn't need to keep up with your gear or whatnot in ff14 because the players didn't care / require you to have the best at all times, or require you to be 10 ilvs higher than the content requires. With the wow people migrating to ff14, I would not be surprised one bit if this mentality gets brought over to ff14 too. I haven't played in awhile so I guess I'll see for myself how it is in the new expansion.

    Ofc at the very high levels (world first), you should be keeping up with everything, but this toxic mindset trickled down to even the casual guilds who couldn't clear the raid even after 7 months. It was really sad.
    Eh, it has nothing to do with WoW. There have always been people like this in XIV.

    I still remember people insisting on Relic+1 only for WP/AK runs back in ARR. Not to mention how crazy people got about Titan groups back then.

    Hell, I myself was removed from a Leviathan unreal group recently for not having 520 item level (in spite of it syncing to 435 or whatever) because it showed a "lack of dedication to improvement" or some nonsense.

  8. #1068
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Eh, it has nothing to do with WoW. There have always been people like this in XIV.

    I still remember people insisting on Relic+1 only for WP/AK runs back in ARR. Not to mention how crazy people got about Titan groups back then.

    Hell, I myself was removed from a Leviathan unreal group recently for not having 520 item level (in spite of it syncing to 435 or whatever) because it showed a "lack of dedication to improvement" or some nonsense.
    It does have to do with wow. Although I think I'm talking about different thing than you. I was referring to pre-made groups, not pugs. I never do pugs in wow or ff14 because they're just massive waste of time.

    It was extremely annoying how the mentality in wow was always "we need more gear" and we always had to make sure to keep on top of everything to make sure we had the best gear we could have. Never was that they're just bad, nope.

    In my static ff14 groups, this was never the mentality. Gear was just a bonus. There was never any pressure to keep on top of anything, so...yea...the community.

  9. #1069
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Eh, it has nothing to do with WoW. There have always been people like this in XIV.

    I still remember people insisting on Relic+1 only for WP/AK runs back in ARR. Not to mention how crazy people got about Titan groups back then.

    Hell, I myself was removed from a Leviathan unreal group recently for not having 520 item level (in spite of it syncing to 435 or whatever) because it showed a "lack of dedication to improvement" or some nonsense.
    There are people like this in every game. I remember the most extreme case for me was in Tera, when someone wanted to kick me out of a group because of my class. It was an instance, where at some point you had to split the group and people had to solo stuff. That was just hardest on my class back then, because it was a glass cannon and could get one-shot easily in there.

    However, there are far more tools and addons in WoW which enable such / similar behaviour. According to my personal experience, it's thus much more prevalent there than in the other MMOs I've played.

  10. #1070
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    It does have to do with wow. Although I think I'm talking about different thing than you. I was referring to pre-made groups, not pugs. I never do pugs in wow or ff14 because they're just massive waste of time.

    It was extremely annoying how the mentality in wow was always "we need more gear" and we always had to make sure to keep on top of everything to make sure we had the best gear we could have. Never was that they're just bad, nope.

    In my static ff14 groups, this was never the mentality. Gear was just a bonus. There was never any pressure to keep on top of anything, so...yea...the community.
    Then I'd say you got lucky with the players in your pre-mades, because the mentality you're talking about has been a thing ever since the game launched. It's not a WoW thing, it's a specific kind of player thing. I'll agree that FFXIV seems to have fewer of those types of players, but it still has them, and has had them since the beginning.

  11. #1071
    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    Then I'd say you got lucky with the players in your pre-mades, because the mentality you're talking about has been a thing ever since the game launched. It's not a WoW thing, it's a specific kind of player thing. I'll agree that FFXIV seems to have fewer of those types of players, but it still has them, and has had them since the beginning.
    Sure, I've been lucky for 7 years. Like I said, at higher levels you'd expect this kind of behavior, but not at lower levels. I experienced this and expected it when I raided at hardcore level in wow.

    I was also on gilgamesh, which is probably one of the more tryhard servers (I'm not there anymore because I transferred to play with a friend and now I can't go back /sad).

  12. #1072
    I made a mistake unlocking blue mage. I love everything about this job. I was supposed to continue the MSQ, now I'm distracted. :P
    "People with depression score higher on tests of realism. Intelligence is positively correlated with mental illness and suicide. What this indicates is that if the mind understands too much about reality, it wants to destroy itself. Human life is existential horror."

  13. #1073
    Genuinely, im looking forward to beating the story, wondering what to do, then remembering that blue mage quest (and all the extremes i can solo if i just put some graft behind it). What an idea! (Borne out of pure accident according to arthars).
    Last edited by ippollite; 2021-09-24 at 12:26 PM.

  14. #1074
    finally beat damned ramuh on extreme, that was easy fight but people kept failing. What I enjoyed about it is that people werent screaming ever after hour of wipes. I had about 4 attempts so ~3.2h total in this.

    Imagine hour long wipes on lfr in wow...
    Ship has been abandoned.
    ---

    NextUI for XIV


  15. #1075
    First - catpeople. I love catpeople!
    I like that you can play all jobs on one character. I like the crafting and gathering mechanics which make this aspect of the game much better than in WoW. (I first loved crafting in WoW, but now it feels pointless and soulless, though I use it now and then.) I like the profession (as in crafting and gathering) quests, the weaverone was hilarious. I like the story focus of the game, even if the videos are a bit annoying in raids. I am still leveling my first job (White Mage), but it's fun to play.

  16. #1076
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    It does have to do with wow. Although I think I'm talking about different thing than you. I was referring to pre-made groups, not pugs. I never do pugs in wow or ff14 because they're just massive waste of time.

    It was extremely annoying how the mentality in wow was always "we need more gear" and we always had to make sure to keep on top of everything to make sure we had the best gear we could have. Never was that they're just bad, nope.

    In my static ff14 groups, this was never the mentality. Gear was just a bonus. There was never any pressure to keep on top of anything, so...yea...the community.
    Every single player in the high end community expects people to have the best gear possible. Every single expansion, the NEW 2 trials people will request the absolute highest ilvl to join their parties possible. If you didn't diligently gear up and pad your ilvl as much as possible you will be excluded from clears (learning parties will take nearly anyone).

    That said, I'm more confused why you're saying it's the community, but citing the fact that you only play with a static? I mean my WoW guild never hounded anyone about gearing or ilvl either, so I wouldn't expect your ff14 static to; just like mine never did in FF14 either.

  17. #1077
    Quote Originally Posted by Tenjen View Post
    The ARR MSQ suffers from being excessively wordy as they were settling into the story and their style. paragraphs and paragraphs of text saying what could have been said in a single one. Alphinaud and urianger were like this by design because one is a patronizing know-it-all and the other just talks archaicly in a winded fashion but for other cases it could have been avoided. Fortunately it gets better and more interesting after the major ARR event occurs the closer you get to the next expansion in post-ARR.

    ARR does establish the foundation of everything which comes later, but a lot of the wordy stuff is better to just skim.
    In almost every case you can read the first sentence of each text block and move on.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
    -ynnady

  18. #1078
    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post

    Ooooh, can i knock 5 points off the story (5.2/3 transition spoilers) because my character didnt say to the people who think they're the warrior of light "would you please stfu and look at the effing sky? How dumb are you? I literally gave you night time (after 100 years), barely a day ago? What the hell is wrong with you? You want to be a warrior of light? Did you not see that shit for the past 100 years? What is literally wrong with you?" I knocked 5 points off the score. There you go, endwalker. Make me proud!
    The thing about that is that We just got out of a conversation despelling their bias against the warrior of light mantel. As the WoD we had a profound influence on that outlook and then Elidibus took advantage of that by raising their spirits. We couldn't clear up the issue without disheartening them or confusing them after what we just said when trying to do the old Warriors of Light justice.

    Its also very hard for us to go counter against what is a very sincere effort on their side to do good due to our example and our actions. We would have to crush their hopes. All the stuff you bring up to sway them away from being manipulated is stuff we ourselves just negated as potential arguements. Elidibus really played a fantastic card there, classic Ascian mindgames. Hope is also really hard to kill, especially when we ourselves do so much to foster it in them.
    Last edited by Tenjen; 2021-10-05 at 12:57 PM.

  19. #1079
    As one who was glad to have left WoW cause the current expansion was boring, I was super happy to have come across FFXIV. I am having lots of fun in the game right now. I pretty love everything about it.

    I love the story, the gameplay, and I love the classes (jobs) in the game. I will definitely be enjoying my time in Eorzea for a while

  20. #1080
    I'm leveling up still through MSQs, but I seem to have stopped logging in much. We'll see how it goes in Endwalker, but I'm not really feeling excited to be playing the game.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    If you didn't get your COVID shot it's probably too late now, you fool.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •