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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    That doesn't mean the outcome would be negative for everyone.
    But it would be not random and thus predictable, and therefore provable.

    You have yet to do this.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    But it would be not random and thus predictable, and therefore provable.
    No it wouldn't necessarily be provable by me. That would still require a lot of work. Something can seem random without being it.
    Last edited by Kaver; 2021-05-05 at 02:59 PM.

  3. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    There's also same item but with tertiary stats or sockets
    Does this mean in the vault, you could see in any given week the same pair of identical bracers?
    I've never seen dupe items in the vault, but it wouldn't surprise me if they allowed identical duping.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    No it wouldn't necessarily be provable by me. That would still require a lot of work. Something can seem random without being it.
    But, again, if the random generator is bugged like you say, then it's not random. The random generator being bugged means it is producing a predictable outcome.

    If the outcome is predictable, it is provable.

    It can "seem" random, but it isn't. And thus, it is provably not random.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Jujudrood View Post
    Does this mean in the vault, you could see in any given week the same pair of identical bracers?
    I've never seen dupe items in the vault, but it wouldn't surprise me if they allowed identical duping.
    Not in the same row same week. But possible in 2 different weeks. As in "big bad belt of buffness - 226" in the vault week 7. And then "big bad belt of buffness - 226" in the vault week 8

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Random is random. Any sequence is equally likely to happen.

    bracers, bracers, bracers
    is equally likely to
    bracer, legs, shoulders.

    It's just that you don't perceive first one to be random, it's human error.
    With Computers there is no such thing as truly random (technically there is but I doubt Blizzard is getting random numbers from an internet based atomic clock) and if the code for determining a random number was coded by a human then it's even less random again, and if its programed by a company that has a gambling gacha game built into its mmo for giving out "random" loot ...well

    You know what they say right "The house never loses".

    Main reason why I ignore bullshit systems that the wow devs put into the game to make it appear more fair to the players, their systems have never been fair and they have never had any reason to make them fair, they have metrics to meet.

    Mythic + after all is just a shiny weekly slot machine that makes you to do a silly amount of busy work to win "a" prize that you have zero control over.
    Last edited by Addiena; 2021-05-05 at 03:14 PM.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Addiena View Post
    With Computers there is no such thing as truly random and if the code for determining a random number was coded by a human then its even less random again, and if its programed by a company that has a gambling gacha game built into its mmo for giving out "random" loot ...well

    You know what they say right "The house never loses".
    This is just conspiracy mongering. Especially given that random selections of people get better loot than some pro raiders on some weeks.

    There's absolutely no control over who gets what loot drop when. Besides, Blizzard always wins once they've gotten your money. There is no lose scenario for Blizzard, they already got your money BEFORE you stepped in the raid lol.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    But, again, if the random generator is bugged like you say, then it's not random. The random generator being bugged means it is producing a predictable outcome.

    If the outcome is predictable, it is provable.

    It can "seem" random, but it isn't. And thus, it is provably not random.
    I'm not saying it's bugged.

    I'm saying it could potentially be bugged.

    If it seem random then it can trick people to think it is. The degree of a potential bug matters.

    Bug again, I'm not saying it's bugged

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    I'm saying it could potentially be bugged.
    And I'm saying it's 100% not bugged.

    Now prove it is or begone with you. There is literally no point to your posts.

  10. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Not in the same row same week. But possible in 2 different weeks. As in "big bad belt of buffness - 226" in the vault week 7. And then "big bad belt of buffness - 226" in the vault week 8
    Ah, got it.
    I was hoping they would have duplicate item protection at least.
    It would feel like shit if they were like "this week, you can choose the Belt of Mediocrity, the Belt of Mediocrity....or..... the Belt of Mediocrity!"
    I mean, still sucks to get Belt of Mediocrity, Belt of Minor Sidegrade, and Belt of Possible Offspec Use in one week, but at least they're different.

    For the topic:
    Week to week, seeing the same item makes sense, since it's effectively a full RNG draw.
    I mean, I've seen the al'ar tanking trinket at least 7 times in total (I started a collection and had 7 in my bags before I got bored and vendored them).
    But for each week in and of itself, getting the same slot is a lower chance than getting anything else; with no dupe items, it's just a flat draw and remove.
    If there are 50 items in the bag, it's 1/50, then 1/49, then 1/48, since each item drawn is removed from the bag.
    If of the 50 items, 3 are bracers, 3 are chest, 3 are legs, etc etc etc, the first draw is equal chance for any slot.
    The second draw however is only 2/49 bracers, whereas everything else is 3/49, and if it does get bracers, the last draw would be 1/48 for bracers vs 3/48 for any other slot.
    You can get 3 bracers, as 3 bracers exist in the bag, but the odds of getting 3 bracers is lower than getting bracers+any+any, given that it's an exclusionary draw.

    In OP's case, pretty sure it's just RNG being RNG.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    And I'm saying it's 100% not bugged.

    Now prove it is or begone with you. There is literally no point to your posts.
    But I don't think it's bugged. I just think it's stupid to blindly trust that it isn't. Especially based on Blizzards history with bugs.

    The point is that we shouldn't always be so gullible. It's okay to have some degree of skepticism.
    Last edited by Kaver; 2021-05-05 at 03:15 PM.

  12. #152
    Ive never once gotten a neck from the vault, what are the odds of that?
    I do get weapons, every single week, without fail.....

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    The point is that we shouldn't always be gullible. It's okay to have some degree of skepticism.
    Which is a nonsense non sequitur. It leads to nothing. Being skeptical over nothing is not "avoiding being gullible." If anything it's being the MOST gullible, willing to believe things are wrong at the drop of a hat.

    If you don't have a reason to argue something, arguing it is not in your best interest. It is truly sad that I have to say that.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    And I'm saying it's 100% not bugged.

    Now prove it is or begone with you. There is literally no point to your posts.
    Can you prove without any doubt that its not bugged? Wait, you can't? What a shocker *rolleyes*

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    This is just conspiracy mongering. Especially given that random selections of people get better loot than some pro raiders on some weeks.

    There's absolutely no control over who gets what loot drop when. Besides, Blizzard always wins once they've gotten your money. There is no lose scenario for Blizzard, they already got your money BEFORE you stepped in the raid lol.
    There is always a lose situation, it's not conspiracy mongering .. its called not trusting the house, unless of course you are one of these people who walks into a casino and believes the house isn't in it to win and always uses fair and equitable odds.

    I dont trust Blizzard and I trust Bobby Kotic and Activision even less.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    But I don't think it's bugged. I just think it's stupid to blindly trust that it isn't. Especially based on Blizzards history with bugs.

    The point is that we shouldn't always be so gullible. It's okay to have some degree of skepticism.
    Science once believed in a geocentric model, so I don't think a little skepticism is a bad thing when it comes to blindly trusting that the earth isn't flat.

    Thats what you're saying

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    Can you prove without any doubt that its not bugged? Wait, you can't? What a shocker *rolleyes*
    I don't need to. Things working as intended is easy to prove - I can log into game on Tuesday and get 3 random items from my Vault. Seems to be working as intended!

    You need to provide a reason you believe it IS bugged. We've seen plenty of reason to believe it isn't. 99% of the playerbase gets random drops.

    The 1% who hasn't, if they want to prove it IS bugged, needs to prove it is.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    Which is a nonsense non sequitur. It leads to nothing. Being skeptical over nothing is not "avoiding being gullible." If anything it's being the MOST gullible, willing to believe things are wrong at the drop of a hat.
    I'm not believing anything is wrong. I'm just realistic knowing that systems can have bugs. Especially in work that was rushed like Shadowlands was. It's would not be anything new if something like that happened. Being a little bit skeptical of a system which has produced some cases of extreme results is completely reasonable.

  19. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Addiena View Post
    With Computers there is no such thing as truly random (technically there is but I doubt Blizzard is getting random numbers from an internet based atomic clock) and if the code for determining a random number was coded by a human then it's even less random again, and if its programed by a company that has a gambling gacha game built into its mmo for giving out "random" loot ...well

    You know what they say right "The house never loses".

    Main reason why I ignore bullshit systems that the wow devs put into the game to make it appear more fair to the players, their systems have never been fair and they have never had any reason to make them fair, they have metrics to meet.

    Mythic + after all is just a shiny weekly slot machine that makes you to do a silly amount of busy work to win "a" prize that you have zero control over.
    My friend has in the last 4 out of 5 weeks gotten a 233 from vault. All upgrades.
    For the last 2 weeks I've gotten the biggest possible upgrades from vault on my reroll character

    Random is gonna random. Sometimes you're winning, sometimes you're losing. Like in the first 3 months of the expansion where I got 0 220-226 weapons from vault/raid.
    It'll even out in the end, just keep rolling

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Addiena View Post
    There is always a lose situation, it's not conspiracy mongering .. its called not trusting the house, unless of course you are one of these people who walks into a casino and believes the house isn't in it to win and always uses fair and equitable odds.

    I dont trust Blizzard and I trust Bobby Kotic and Activision even less.
    In a casino, you'd be right.

    But Blizzard isn't a casino. You give them money before you can play their game, and then you never need to give them money again if you don't feel like it.

    You literally can't lose in WoW. Everything you do is a win. Even items that you don't want are wins. Trying to compare drops to a casino misses the point that you literally didn't pay anything for the drop. It's free. You didn't lose anything by getting a drop you didn't want. You got an item for your work, and your work was playing a game that you already gave money to play, because you wanted to play it.

    This analogy is shitty at the core.
    Last edited by Fleugen; 2021-05-05 at 03:26 PM.

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