[FILM] Red Sonja Adaptation to Star Hannah John-Kamen

[Xilurm]

These are pretty much my sentiments. I'm tired of the control, repression and stigma. I really detest seeing it in our entertainment, more so our video games. I am an advocate supporter of letting females wear what they want to wear. Not what other people deem as appropriate.

I literally saw that argument a week or so ago and one of the parties said "she didn't decide to wear this, it's the artists who decided for her".

Is this one of those "you're complaining about people complaining!" things that children like to go for?

Zero irony in what you quoted.

He's right though. And you comparing him to a child because he used a plausible argument doesn't make you more edgy.

[gaymer77]

I meant small in height, I loved her in Killjoys and was a treat to see her in ant man, so I like the actress, her ethnicity does not bother me either, I liked momoa as conan truth be told, being a redhead is as simple as a shitty wig which I hope they do not do, but the stature is not there to my eyes, not that I am a Red Sonja expert or to be honest even much of a fan, she just does not seem 'big' enough which is not to slight her, the large chick in game of thrones physiclaly matches the role, even if just physically.

Oh I fully agree on the red hair part. Brigitte Nielsen wasn't a redhead either when she played Red Sonja but her hair was colored red for the movie. The difference between her and Hannah John-Kamen is the body doesn't match what the iconic Red Sonja is. You are absolutely right that Gwendoline Christie would have made a much better casting choice. She has proven herself to be a great actress AND she has the better fit look of the body Red Sonja has.

[inafume]

Y'all must've hated the 1980s movie if you expect the actress to match the comic imagery.

[Milchshake]

Is that why the covers of her comics that were released even just last month look like this?


Inb4 my post gets infracted because these images are too skimpy even though the thread is about her.

Joseph Michael Linsner is a horny teen's idea of a good artist. Maybe he gets cover work because he's friends with DYNAMITE brass?
I appreciate his detail work. But the characters always seem so still and wooden, with a limited palette of expressions.
Makes Frank Cho look like Raphael.

[Xilurm]

Not right at all lol I even showed why I was commenting in the first place.

And it is a childish practice to scream "you're complaining about people complaining!" because its just a poor attempt at dismissing criticism of people being toxic.

Do people really still call things "edgy" and think anyone is trying to be "edgy"?

Sorry for being an adult.

Damn right you're an adult. Saying "the internet was a mistake" is one of the most boomer things to say.

[Xilurm]

Joseph Michael Linsner is a horny teen's idea of a good artist. Maybe he gets cover work because he's friends with DYNAMITE brass?
I appreciate his detail work. But the characters always seem so still and wooden, with a limited palette of expressions.
Makes Frank Cho look like Raphael.

He seems like a good artist to me regardless of what kind of art he draws. He's no Artgerm, but that doesn't matter much.

[gaymer77]

Redhead is a haircolor, not a ethnicity. They don't have to cast someone who's a original redhead. Hair can be colored. Like... what?
She's half Norwegian and half Nigerian, so it's not strange that she looks "ethnic", whatever that's supposed to mean, I guess.

Also the outfits Red Sonja wears are fucking stupid and should be changed anyway. Nobody gives a shit about the basement weebs that'll cry about it and give it a low score on Rottentomatoes because "bewbs and bikini!".

I am well aware that hair color can be changed to fit the role an actor is cast for. All of the Malfoy family in Harry Potter had to bleach their hair blond for their roles. Orlando Bloom had to wear a wig for his role in the Lord of the Rings films. KJ Kapa has to dye his hair red to play Archie in Riverdale. Scarlett Johansson had to dye her hair for Black Widow. Hell even Elizabeth Olsen had to dye her hair for the role of Wanda/Scarlet Witch as she is a natural blonde. Those are just a few of the actors who have had to change their hair color to fit the established hair color of certain roles they were cast for. The problem is the rest of the features that make up who Red Sonja is are missing from her too. Yes her body type is shorter than Red Sonja. Yes her muscle size is less than Red Sonja. Yes her breasts are much smaller than Red Sonja. And yes her skin color (established in the books and even the 1985 Red Sonja film) is not the fair complected color already established for the character. To be frank, Gwendoline Christie would have made a much better choice for casting for Red Sonja because she fits the description of what Red Sonja is minus the hair color (which as pointed out can easily be changed with dye) and she's proven her acting abilities from her stint on Game of Thrones as Brienne of Tarth.

[Xilurm]

You sure showed me with your crazy internet buzzwords! Damn whippersnappers.

It's fine, I myself didn't know what it meant a couple of years ago.

[Darknessvamp]

I've never read Red Sonja but I did watch Ant-Man 2, let's just say her performance wasn't great in that film when she wasn't masked up and mute. Especially when some of her first lines were an emotionless yet snarky exposition dump about her totally tragic backstory and the majority of the rest of her dialogue were generic villain growls while fighting and random moaning in scenes where she is supposed to be in pain.

I can't see her as a barbarian-esque character.

[Endus]

I literally saw that argument a week or so ago and one of the parties said "she didn't decide to wear this, it's the artists who decided for her".

I mean, that's exactly correct. It's why you can't really defend a supposedly heroic character like, say, James Bond, when he's written to be pretty rapey and demeaning to women, by saying "well, that's just who he is". He's a character, not a person. The author chooses every single thing he does, says, and is. It's the writer who puts that rapey stuff in there, for the writer's own reasons, and questioning that is just . . . completely normal critical analysis.

It's fine, by the by, if you're writing a rapey James Bond where the point is that he's an abusive dickhole of a human being. The issue is when the writer tries to wave off those things as "totally fine" or "he can get away with it because he's otherwise heroic" or some similar equivocation. The newer films with Daniel Craig get into this, presenting Bond as far more damaged than prior films tended to; he has serious, deep-seated issues, and that's something the films explore.

Same here; you can't hand-wave Sonja's choice of attire with "well, that's what she chooses to wear, and are [i]you telling women what to wear?" It's a bullshit argument. The author/artist chooses that stuff. She's a character, not a person. Which isn't me saying she shouldn't be wearing a scalemail bikini, I'm just saying own up to your artistic choices and predilections. Look back up to my original post in the thread; I really hope they don't even try and take the material seriously, but take it as tongue-in-cheek as, say, 1960s Batman. The in-character stuff might be delivered 100% seriously, but the presentation should be deliberately farcical or knowingly pulpy. I'm totally fine with the bikini, if the men are wearing Conan loincloths and such and they mock people who cower behind their flimsy steel shells. Go nuts with that stuff. Roll around in it. It's when you try and present the bikini as a justifiable, reasonable choice that you enter really, really dumb territory. And I think the film would be a hell of a lot more fun by just rolling with the pulpiness rather than trying to Zak Snyder it with grittiness until all the fun's pulped out of the property.

[Myradin]

Honestly someone like Gina Carano with a red wig would be perfect for this role.

[eschatological]

Honestly someone like Gina Carano with a red wig would be perfect for this role.

Gina Carano can't act her way out of a paper bag.

[Endus]

Gina Carano can't act her way out of a paper bag.

Not to mention, y'know, the casual bigotry. It may have been low-grade stuff rather than chanting "Blood and Soil" at a rally, but it's still an issue.

And honestly, while I thought she had the physicality for these kinds of roles, her stint in the Mandalorian made me question that. So much of the brawling just looked like WWE fighting; completely silly stuff rather than a realistic fight. She looks good in photos, but even her stage combat skills are pretty eh, and her MMA skills have not, apparently, translated particularly well.

Hollywood does have a serious issue with women's body shapes and I'd love to see more ladies with Carano's body shape in more roles, particularly physical ones like Red Sonja, but that's "how do we revamp and entire industry" levels of difficult, rather than just a single casting change.

[Paperfox]

I believe that Red Sonja was created by Robert E. Howard, the writer who created Conan the Barbarian.

In Warcraft, Paula Patton for her role as Garona was turned green digitally.

[Endus]

I believe that Red Sonja was created by Robert E. Howard, the writer who created Conan the Barbarian.

Marvel owns the licenses to Howard's work.

Also, Howard's Red Sonya (spelling important) wasn't connected to his Hyborean stuff, didn't wear a metal bikini, and mostly used guns. It was Marvel comics that reworked that into the scale-bikini swordmaiden everyone thinks of.

[Adamas102]

If her outfits are stupid and nobody gives a shit about her fandom... why make a movie about her in the first place?

Because it's a recognizable name. I've never read a Red Sonja comic, but I recognize the name. If the entirety of the character is nothing but red hair and a chainmail bikini, then yeah I don't see why anyone would make a movie for her. I'm assuming there's a bit more to Red Sonja than just her appearance.

- - - Updated - - -

Hollywood does have a serious issue with women's body shapes and I'd love to see more ladies with Carano's body shape in more roles, particularly physical ones like Red Sonja, but that's "how do we revamp and entire industry" levels of difficult, rather than just a single casting change.

Find more ex-athletes who want a career change into acting?

[Endus]

Find more ex-athletes who want a career change into acting?

Oh, I don't think it's a problem of a lack of candidates. I think it's an issue of casting directors and their predilections for a certain body shape.

[Polyxo]

Not to mention, y'know, the casual bigotry. It may have been low-grade stuff rather than chanting "Blood and Soil" at a rally, but it's still an issue.

And honestly, while I thought she had the physicality for these kinds of roles, her stint in the Mandalorian made me question that. So much of the brawling just looked like WWE fighting; completely silly stuff rather than a realistic fight. She looks good in photos, but even her stage combat skills are pretty eh, and her MMA skills have not, apparently, translated particularly well.

Hollywood does have a serious issue with women's body shapes and I'd love to see more ladies with Carano's body shape in more roles, particularly physical ones like Red Sonja, but that's "how do we revamp and entire industry" levels of difficult, rather than just a single casting change.

I've kind of wanted to reach out to Gina Carano and sit her down and explain to her in painstaking detail how the things she thinks are stupid and she can't just latch onto moronic and bigoted stuff like that. Really the only reason is to 'rehabilitate' an actress with a formidable body type like that. I'm a retired pro fighter who walks around at about 4'11", 130, with pretty decent ab definition, and like, the average female action star not only doesn't know how to credibly throw her body into a punch or kick, but also is like, a foot taller than me, and 30 lbs lighter.

I don't think Carano's a TERRIBLE actress, but she's a limited one. She can be really effective in particular roles, but asking her to do something outside of that niche in terms of acting is going to come off as awkward.

[caractacus]

Good luck to her, hopefully she can make the role her own. I liked the casting of Brigette so for me I would have been interested to see someone of todays world of similar physical stature like Gwendoline Christie.

[Polyxo]

I'm not sure what a Red Sonja is.. it goes right over my head. I can tell it's a female superhero. To be honest, I probably will not have much interest in this movie. That doesn't mean other people will not be interested. They would need to make a big impression (trailer) for me to even look into it further.



These are pretty much my sentiments. I'm tired of the control, repression and stigma. I really detest seeing it in our entertainment, more so our video games. I am an advocate supporter of letting females wear what they want to wear. Not what other people deem as appropriate. I have come across numerous articles stating that dress codes are in place to reinforce systemic violence. That are ultimately enforced unequally.

Dress codes has made a value judgment about which sorts of clothes and behaviours are appropriate, and which are not. And often, these value judgments create oppressive and discriminatory frameworks that further marginalize certain groups.

Policing what people wear, instead of teaching them to be respectful and consensual with others, assumes that certain outfits will protect you from sexual assault while others will make you vulnerable. This is a myth. This is victim blaming.


Looking at the history of the bikini. Sources are taken from the website: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bikini




The article goes into detail of human civilization with the Precursors in the West and Social resistance. I find this to be appalling behavior. Women were forced to dress and wear what was classified as appropriate or what other individuals wanted them to wear. Corsets in the Victorian era come to mind. There were many critiques of the corset later who believed that corsets were not merely a fashion dress but a tool to oppress women.

I also find it appalling that a huge controversy came in about overly sexualize female characters. From probably a mass majority of females that don't even touch video games or not interested in fantasy. I don't want or need repression, oppression or control from any gender.

Overall my point is they should let women be what they want to be. Some might argue it was influential but regardless it is that individuals choice. I am supportive of every different type of individual getting the proper representation. This includes some women that prefer pants and armor. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, but they don't need to be judgemental, controlling, enforcing violent, and ostracizing behavior.

They managed to let Wonder woman keep her costume. I'm not sure if this will be the case with Red Sonja. I know I keep wanting better mogs for female characters in video games. Including World of Warcraft. Which this game has roots of having clothing for every type of gamer. Instead of preaching intolerance and shoving a poncho on Sylvanas. (mid-riff controversy) I would advise if anyone has intolerance towards this to maybe then to not subject their children to this behaviour. As the game that has had a lot more mature content than a belly button showing. . .

If we're talking about actual practicality, the chainmail bikini is really stupid. I don't honestly wear a whole lot more in the weight room than the women in the mosaic, but I'm definitely going to want to be having something thick and solid on my tummy if someone is trying to stab it. Leg coverings would be cool too.

There is a way around it, I think someone later mentions this, but like, if they presented the lack of clothing as bravado, that's plausible. It's kind of a real thing that happened. There are credible reports of Gauls showing up to battle and being like "fuck you, im naked".