Shadowlands could be amazing if...

[Jinpachi]

This is just my personal opinion, but I feel like Shadowlands had the potential to be amazing. Terrible time gating, zones and characters i couldn't give a shit less about, and awful drop percentages has really taken away its shine. That being said, i absolutely love the new dungeons and raiding. Some new and inventive boss fights, along with Castle Nathria's excellent design and music made for some of the most memorable fights i'd taken place in in a long time. Hopefully they get the shit closer to right with the next patch onward.

[Osmeric]

... if it weren't Shadowlands.

[NineSpine]

This is just my personal opinion, but I feel like Shadowlands had the potential to be amazing. Terrible time gating, zones and characters i couldn't give a shit less about, and awful drop percentages has really taken away its shine. That being said, i absolutely love the new dungeons and raiding. Some new and inventive boss fights, along with Castle Nathria's excellent design and music made for some of the most memorable fights i'd taken place in in a long time. Hopefully they get the shit closer to right with the next patch onward.

It’s almost like iterating on existing, successful systems is a better way to design the game than constantly reinventing the wheel and throwing shit at the wall until it sticks.

The reason the zones seem so lame is because you primarily engage with them in randomized world quests, rather than any kind of crafted experience. The story and characters are lame because following more important people around and watching them do things isn’t an engaging way to tell a story in an interactive medium.

[D3athsting]

It’s almost like iterating on existing, successful systems is a better way to design the game than constantly reinventing the wheel and throwing shit at the wall until it sticks.

The reason the zones seem so lame is because you primarily engage with them in randomized world quests, rather than any kind of crafted experience. The story and characters are lame because following more important people around and watching them do things isn’t an engaging way to tell a story in an interactive medium.

Zones are so lame because serve no purpose other than containers for dungeons and raids, honestly comparing sl zones to the majesty of wotlk and pandaria ones is embarassing

[McNeil]

Shadowlands is mostly just BFA but with less content and less grinds. It could have been amazing if they went more towards the TBC/WotLK route instead.

[AkundaMrdal]

Shadowlands is mostly just BFA but with less content and less grinds. It could have been amazing if they went more towards the TBC/WotLK route instead.

SL have more grind than BFA, but luckily most of it is not needed for your char power growth. Just to upgrade covenant and buy everything for anima will take you huge amount of time, and if you want all four covenants completed.... good luck. I gave up few months ago, because I felt like I was wasting too much time, maybe I will finish it in some later patch, when they buff anima income. But than these patches will have another stuff to endlessly grind and cycle will repeat.

[Zyrinx]

The actual zones really are terrible, imo, after the first pass. Travel is really bad as well

Also why are only 50% of the dungeons available for leveling, for alt players this is maybe the worst of it. Sweet Jesus I am sick of those 4 dungeons.

[Stardrift]

Nathria looks cool.. but it's so same-samey. Every boss room just looks the same. There's no clashing and contrasting themes, it's missing a lot.

The dungeons are a massive letdown. Some of the fights are cool, but most of the dungeons are questing areas you've quested through. Nothing unique.

[FuxieDK]

Zones are so lame because serve no purpose other than containers for dungeons and raids, honestly comparing sl zones to the majesty of wotlk and pandaria ones is embarassing

I spend 95% of my time in the zones..

I rarely raid, and spend even less time in dungeons.. However, there is ALWAYS a lot to do in uninstanced world.

[Goat7]

if it was made by any other company.

[NineSpine]

Zones are so lame because serve no purpose other than containers for dungeons and raids, honestly comparing sl zones to the majesty of wotlk and pandaria ones is embarassing

There’s way more content in the zones than you think there is. It’s just all made weirdly pointless and since very little of it sticks together in any way it makes it feel empty.

For example, there’s plenty of world quests, but since they are randomized every day and don’t have any kind of crafted experience, they feel significantly less substantive than any daily hub in BC or Wrath did. In older expansions, you’d go to an area, grab your quests, and then do them all. It would take a little time and you would be doing a few things at once. At certain points, you’d unlock more quests and the experience would change. World quests are more plentiful by any metric, but they aren’t stuck together, don’t have any coherence, and don’t feel like part of something you are working toward.

[Tradu]

If the entire covenant system was just removed. Abilities, soulbinds, conduits. All gone. Legendaries are plenty of borrowed power, better thought out meaningful choices and much better designed (even if they also have flaws). Leave the sanctums, anima, cosmetics and story stuff, that's fine.

[TidalConflux]

If Blizzard figured out an alternative path at end-game besides the main three of Raid/M+/PvP.

[NineSpine]

Zones are so lame because serve no purpose other than containers for dungeons and raids, honestly comparing sl zones to the majesty of wotlk and pandaria ones is embarassing

There’s way more content in the zones than you think there is. It’s just all made weirdly pointless and since very little of it sticks together in any way it makes it feel empty.

For example, there’s plenty of world quests, but since they are randomized every day and don’t have any kind of crafted experience, they feel significantly less substantive than any daily hub in BC or Wrath did. In older expansions, you’d go to an area, grab your quests, and then do them all. It would take a little time and you would be doing a few things at once. At certain points, you’d unlock more quests and the experience would change. World quests are more plentiful by any metric, but they aren’t stuck together, don’t have any coherence, and don’t feel like part of something you are working toward.

[GreenJesus]

There’s way more content in the zones than you think there is. It’s just all made weirdly pointless and since very little of it sticks together in any way it makes it feel empty.

For example, there’s plenty of world quests, but since they are randomized every day and don’t have any kind of crafted experience, they feel significantly less substantive than any daily hub in BC or Wrath did. In older expansions, you’d go to an area, grab your quests, and then do them all. It would take a little time and you would be doing a few things at once. At certain points, you’d unlock more quests and the experience would change. World quests are more plentiful by any metric, but they aren’t stuck together, don’t have any coherence, and don’t feel like part of something you are working toward.

Well they definitely failed the "randomized" part. Since it feels like its the same quests every single day. But yeh world quests fail in that they don't feel like you are advancing a campaign. Its just playing whack a mole on a map with a daily timer. World quests are more convenient i guess, but they miss the role-playing aspect of getting assigned a mission to advance a cause.

[Mojo03]

If Blizzard figured out an alternative path at end-game besides the main three of Raid/M+/PvP.

With this priority system.

Raid >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> M+ >>>>>> Rbg >> Everything else

[Nyel]

... if it weren't Shadowlands.

Yeah pretty much this. As much as I dig the setting, it's not Warcraft. And then all the other stuff on top of it...

[TidalConflux]

With this priority system.

Raid >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> M+ >>>>>> Rbg >> Everything else

I agree. Raid should be the paramount.

[froschhure]

they readd bonusrolls, wf /tf and Essences with new ones to play with. ~joy, corruptions were also fun
they could give everyone the options for more skills, but those with wm on and for pvp content
great vault feels like trash vault

[Dracullus]

If Blizzard figured out an alternative path at end-game besides the main three of Raid/M+/PvP.

Actually we have 5: 5 man PVE content, 10-30 (20 for hardcore) PVE content, 2v2 PVP arena, 3v3 PVP arena, 10v10 PVP battleground.

What that 'alternative path' for MMO game should be? Fishing? World quests? You can't give best gear through solo content, there is no need to coordinate here, it would have to be ridicolously hard, harder than Mage Tower during 7.2 (before Tomb opened).

(And of course we have even more 'alternative paths at end-game' if we go beyond player power. There is RP and huuuuuge collection game that grow almost faster than people can catch up to this.)