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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    You think soloing a random elite in the maw is the same as a mythic raid boss - I wouldn't question anyone else if I was you. This has been mentioned many times, in almost all of these "I want more loot" threads, and it always become very apparent who has and has not done any form of challenging raid content. Comparing a random elite in the maw to a mythic raid boss is pretty far out there even for the typically ill-informed non-raiders.
    You still believe they can be convinced?
    That at the end of the say there can be some sort of revelation for them? It is just a numbers game to them.
    The content honestly doesn't matter to them... they just want to see their numbers go up.

    If you suggest that anything else could matter they will immediately dismiss it.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    Well that leaves us to you being wrong, quite obviously. How many world elites require a hundred+ pulls, the very best consumables, highly elaborate strategies covering multiple phases and a dozen abilities, and the best available gear to down? And why would you solo them when getting a group to stomp any Maw elite in the game into the ground takes a press of two buttons? Raids have a fixed size and you can't just bring in more bodies to trivialize anything. Your comparison is entirely off-base.

    I mean unless you're trying to be clever and saying that downing a World Boss solo is hard- which obviously it is next to impossible because it's meant to be a raid boss killed by a group. I could also be clever and say downing Mythic solo is 100% completely impossible and thus harder than your Maw elites, but again that would be arguing in circles and I've no idea where you're going with this brand of... logic.
    Combat is combat. If you're fighting something that can kill you if you make a mistake, then that would be classified under "difficult" content.
    Arguing in circles is all this forum site is good for and frankly, it's exhausting.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    Combat is combat. If you're fighting something that can kill you if you make a mistake, then that would be classified under "difficult" content.
    Arguing in circles is all this forum site is good for and frankly, it's exhausting.
    That seems like saying a relaxing hiking trip and an Olympic marathon are equally difficult, because after all both have the potential to make you tired. You're reducing the argument to an absurd extreme in order to avoid being wrong. I don't believe you when you said previously you did top end raiding, not when you then turn around and say PvE is lolez and Maw elites are the same as Mythic raiding because both can technically kill you.

    I also don't believe you warrant any more of my time or attention. Good day.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    That seems like saying a relaxing hiking trip and an Olympic marathon are equally difficult, because after all both have the potential to make you tired. You're reducing the argument to an absurd extreme in order to avoid being wrong. I don't believe you when you said previously you did top end raiding, not when you then turn around and say PvE is lolez and Maw elites are the same as Mythic raiding because both can technically kill you.

    I also don't believe you warrant any more of my time or attention. Good day.
    I'm not interested in whether you believe me or not. It's not relevant to the discussion.

    People are so dug into their belief system of how they think the game should work and shouldn't change so they take zero time to try and understand what other people with different opinions are even trying to convey. I get it, most of you who have replied do not want to see good gear in the hands of people who refuse to do group content. It's as simple as that. Hopefully Blizz gets it eventually and creates a gear system that works better for all players.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Advent View Post
    Just want to say I certainly haven't found any new single player rpgs with any longevity coming out in the past several years. They're quite rare in my experience.
    Well yeah because single player games are not about longevity. They are about a great limited experience. You play it for 40-50h and finsih it. Maybe come back 2 years later and try a different path (Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Witcher, Cyberpunk, Baldurs Gate, Assasins Credd etcpp)

    If you want a stroy focused SP MMO go play Swtor and ESO or even FF14. They have story you can play alone. Progression is basically guaranteed as you will not really be challenged anywhere or rely on anyone. Granted FF14 is more like wow than the other two in regard to playerattitude.

  6. #106
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    I tried explaining this, but now @Clash the DK is suggesting Mythic raiding shouldnt reward loot at all. They all eventually show their true colours.
    He's right it shouldn't. The upshot of this is that if it was handled correctly you could raid log and not have to worry about ever leaving your mythic raiding bubble.
    Last edited by Glorious Leader; 2021-05-16 at 08:11 PM.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    He's right it shouldn't. The upshot of this is that if it was handled correctly you could raid on and not have to worry about ever leaving your mythic raiding bubble.
    So you guys want to fundamentally change the core progression system of a 17 year old game, and get frustrated that people dont agree with you - mindblowing stuff.
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    Any sane person would see your a moron.

  8. #108
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    So you guys want to fundamentally change the core progression system of a 17 year old game, and get frustrated that people dont agree with you - mindblowing stuff.
    Nothing about mythic raiding is fundamental to the game. Actually nothing about raiding is fundamental to the game either as it was basically never on most people's raider. And actually for those it was it was for a very long time only one difficulty and quite frankly piss easy.

    All of this is to say that for most people if they removed mythic raiding for the game nothing would change and no one would care and nothing would be lost.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    So you guys want to fundamentally change the core progression system of a 17 year old game, and get frustrated that people dont agree with you - mindblowing stuff.


    I feel this video sums up the general attitude when it comes to the thought of trying to help players like this..

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    And actually for those it was it was for a very long time only one difficulty and quite frankly piss easy.
    After Vanilla, wow has had 8 expansions - seven of them have had multiple difficulties. Since day 1 - the hardest content has rewarded the highest quality loot, with a few unintentional exceptions over a decade+.
    Last edited by arkanon; 2021-05-16 at 08:34 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    Any sane person would see your a moron.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    You overestimate your point of view.

    World content is basically the only place where you can feel those power gains from ilvl. It's the base part of the game that is an extension of the leveling process. We are talking about the core essence of RPGs. You can queque up for group content in multiple games whether it be for PvE or PvP. But the MMORPG should consist of a legitimate and rewarding progression system within the world all the way to endgame.

    Content that revolves around challenges doesn't technically require gear rewards. See: Torghast Endless Layers. You could add a stat template (like they did for PvP in the past) and that content would still function the same. But I'm not calling for a design where you don't receive gear from Raids, etc. I don't get my kicks from dictating what other people find fun. I'm just saying that gear progression is more important to world content and most definitely should not be dismissed because that content is considered easier.
    No it shouldn't. You are thinking of single player games. Gear is not more important for world content because gear doesn't matter for world content. You are thinking of single player games again.

    All through this thread you have said that world players, also known is single game players, should have some sort of progression. And to have this progression they have to have the highest gear.
    WRONG.
    The single players progression is leveling. Finished leveling? Find a group or quit. Those are you're two options.

    No one takes you seriously. Especially when you say stuff like "people who do group content shouldn't get gear. It's about the challenge" while also saying nonsense like "world content needs the best gear because that's where it matters most". People are literally laughing at you. My friend is texting me right now laughing at you. Wow isnt for you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    You have no clue what you are talking about. PvE is not hard. Attack, dodge, interrupt this or that, stay out of the fire, etc... It's the same mechanics in all aspects of the game. The only difficult thing about more "challenging" PvE content is finding enough people to stay awake while beating up the mobile target dummy. And I'm not going to flash my credentials to prove my point to some rando if that's what you're after. I've done top end raiding for multiple expansions and I've really had enough of your trolling.
    No you haven't. You have never set foot inside LFR let alone any other raids. At this point I do not acknowledge Classic raiding as raiding. Retail LFR is harder than Classic Naxx. Thinking some elite in the maw is harder than raid bosses proves it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by munkeyinorbit View Post
    No it shouldn't. You are thinking of single player games. Gear is not more important for world content because gear doesn't matter for world content. You are thinking of single player games again.

    All through this thread you have said that world players, also known is single game players, should have some sort of progression. And to have this progression they have to have the highest gear.
    WRONG.
    The single players progression is leveling. Finished leveling? Find a group or quit. Those are you're two options.

    No one takes you seriously. Especially when you say stuff like "people who do group content shouldn't get gear. It's about the challenge" while also saying nonsense like "world content needs the best gear because that's where it matters most". People are literally laughing at you. My friend is texting me right now laughing at you. Wow isnt for you.

    - - - Updated - - -



    No you haven't. You have never set foot inside LFR let alone any other raids. At this point I do not acknowledge Classic raiding as raiding. Retail LFR is harder than Classic Naxx. Thinking some elite in the maw is harder than raid bosses proves it.
    First, making presumptions about people that you do not know makes you look like an idiot. Not sure if anyone has told you that before.

    Second, people tend to hate/dismiss things they do not understand. That applies to most who keep trolling this thread.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    I'm not interested in whether you believe me or not. It's not relevant to the discussion.

    People are so dug into their belief system of how they think the game should work and shouldn't change so they take zero time to try and understand what other people with different opinions are even trying to convey. I get it, most of you who have replied do not want to see good gear in the hands of people who refuse to do group content. It's as simple as that. Hopefully Blizz gets it eventually and creates a gear system that works better for all players.
    It kinda is. Your whole argument is based on a lie, which means it can be dismissed.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Pohut View Post
    It kinda is. Your whole argument is based on a lie, which means it can be dismissed.
    WTF are you talking about?

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    First, making presumptions about people that you do not know makes you look like an idiot. Not sure if anyone has told you that before.

    Second, people tend to hate/dismiss things they do not understand. That applies to most who keep trolling this thread.
    I am not making presumptions, I am deducing. There is a difference. I am basing my conclusions solely in what you have said here in this thread. What you say is nonsense. Mobs in the maw being harder than raid bosses. You obviously do not know about raid bosses, because you think they are easier than maw elites therefore you have never raided.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    I would argue that soloing some elites in the Maw is just as difficult as anything you find in a Raid. So where does that leave us?
    You heard it here boys, soloing a maw elite = killing Mythic Denathrius , and then you wonder why no one (blizz included) takes you seriously.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    WTF are you talking about?
    You claim that you've done "high end raiding". Your examples show that you didn't even do LFR.

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    First, making presumptions about people that you do not know makes you look like an idiot. Not sure if anyone has told you that before.

    Second, people tend to hate/dismiss things they do not understand.
    Its not an assumption, when you put a maw elite and raiding on the same level, you basically tell everyone that you either dont raid at all or your raiding experience is poor af aka LFR tier, maybe normal and im being really generous here, its just laughable.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    I've done top end raiding for multiple expansions and I've really had enough of your trolling.
    I cured cancer and won the olympics in my dreams too.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Clash the DK View Post
    WTF are you talking about?
    You said soloing mobs in the maw is equal to mythic raiding. As I'm sure anyone who has done even normal would agree, this shows you are either delusional, or more likely, being completely dishonest about your "raid experience".

    This is why Blizzard don't "listen" to you - you are completely confused.
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    Any sane person would see your a moron.

  20. #120
    Killian @ Proudmoore

    There ya go. Eat it up. It changes nothing. When you can't debate the point, you attack people's credentials. And it's pathetic.

    Have none of you even tried soloing elites in the Maw with a full Eye?

    You say Raiding is hard. What a bunch of bullshit. Please don't try PvP because it would make you cry.

    Finally, congratulations on completely derailing the thread. Troll elsewhere.

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