WoW Desperately Needs Some Kind of a Roundtable Between Devs and Players

[ImpalerEU]

It's hilarious how no one realizes this game started going down the drain when the developers started listening to the cabbies on social media.

[Soon-TM]

God no. Players are absolutely unable to provide professional feedback and objective, construcitve criticism.

But professionals probably aren't playing the game in the first place, and if they ever are, they are a VERY small % of the overall population. Would you listen to the sub 5% of professional players and leave everyone else out in the cold? Well, by the looks of SL, it seems to have happened already. Furthermore, who decides what is "constructive" criticism and what isn't? You?

[Lolites]

Wouldn't matter. The current development team would take a ton of notes and then thank the players for their input, then tell them politely that they know better than they do.

and, judging by the forums, they would be absolutely right...

[Stardrift]

"everyone everywhere"
hmmm... few people on forums (and yes, compared to size of playerbase its few) and some streamers who somehow after hating on game for years still havent quit... i wonder why if they hate it so much... almost like they bitch and whine only bcs that will bring them more clicks...

i understand if you agree with OP you take even him alone as "Everyone" but you are completely out of reality... absolute majority of people dont even use forums, so saying everyone hate the game based on less than 1000 people going on MMO-C is incredibly stupid...

I've seen nothing but complaints everywhere. Even coworkers and friends and family who play.

It is common knowledge the game direction has been aimless. Even devs have come out to say that direction is aimless as there is conflict in what the devs want the game to be. This is coming from Ghostcrawler. If it was a problem before he left, it has clearly only gotten much worse.

[Frolk]

source: dude trust me

Can u say with a straight face u have faith in the dev team? After seeing what we have gotten the past few years?

Me and many do NOT have faith in Blizz to make the game without fucking it up first, adding systems nobody wants, then "fixing it" in x.3.5 of an expansion is not enough.

[Kralljin]

Feedback isn't the secret ingedrient to create a good game, devs with a clear vision and the skills to execute it are.
The whole discussion about "devs aren't listening" is to some extent overblown, the devs first and foremost need to figure out what game they want to create and then build something.
People could give the most objective, concise feedback and it still wouldn't do shit if the devs cannot process it properly.

Imagine giving someone at work the possible advice to their job - it won't do jackshit if the guy doesn't have the necessary skills to do the job in the first place.

And yes, the implication that the current devs (or at least the team as whole) aren't exactly competent is intended.

[Antontein]

...

What do you think? Do you agree? Do we need some hope instilled into us and some initiative taken by the WoW team?

Dude stop creating pointless threads. This is smurf idea. It should never happen.

[Kokolums]

WoW currently feels like an MMO that is written by a team chock full of introverts when an MMO needs a team full of extroverts. That's really the problem. Every new change is about increasing solo play or maybe adding a multiplayer feature but multiplayer is not the same as social.

[Mojo03]

No the devs should cut all communication with the players and design the game that they want. We are awful game designers and the more they listen to us the more the game suffers.

It’s an active multiplayer game being financially supported by an massive community, not a privately funded passion project with a release in the distant future.

The point being, it’s a community driven game and the voices of the community “should” matter.

[Orwell7]

It's hilarious how no one realizes this game started going down the drain when the developers started listening to the cabbies on social media.

What's even more hilarious is that they still desperately trying to implement "predatory" game mechanics which are proven to "hack" our brains with dopamine rushes, etc.
The thing is, WoW's audience has a lot more neckbeards than candy crush saga's, so those are not working here and we are revolting.

But if you see WoW's future as a game where they try to make us spend more time with less dungeons, less zones and more RNG, and you laugh at everyone who cannot see that this is good, well... hilarious too

[Yooginava182]

The problem with this, is that not every customer for blizzard wants the same thing. Theres people who want titanforging and then there is people who dont. So where do you draw the line on with what your customers like and don't like. If you don't like what blizzard is doing, move on to another game. They're not changing and show no signs of changing.

[Houle]

"everyone everywhere"
hmmm... few people on forums (and yes, compared to size of playerbase its few) and some streamers who somehow after hating on game for years still havent quit... i wonder why if they hate it so much... almost like they bitch and whine only bcs that will bring them more clicks...

i understand if you agree with OP you take even him alone as "Everyone" but you are completely out of reality... absolute majority of people dont even use forums, so saying everyone hate the game based on less than 1000 people going on MMO-C is incredibly stupid...

when the majority of people, on the majority of forums (and that is a fact, just look around some of the more popular forums rn) are not liking it, then that indicates that the majority of people doesnt like it.

same principle as with every survey ever: you cant ask EVERYONE, but when most people of a certain number you asked say "no", chances are the majority of all people will also say "no"

[Glorious Leader]

Feedback isn't the secret ingedrient to create a good game, devs with a clear vision and the skills to execute it are.
The whole discussion about "devs aren't listening" is to some extent overblown, the devs first and foremost need to figure out what game they want to create and then build something.
People could give the most objective, concise feedback and it still wouldn't do shit if the devs cannot process it properly.

Imagine giving someone at work the possible advice to their job - it won't do jackshit if the guy doesn't have the necessary skills to do the job in the first place.

And yes, the implication that the current devs (or at least the team as whole) aren't exactly competent is intended.

I dont think thats fair. I think they're actually quite competent just grossly misguided and given far too much freedom.

[Queen of Hamsters]

I've seen how player behaviour and feedback shapes the game.

I prefer it when they do their own thing and say screw the haters, and I miss the times when they didn't just focus on "player engagement" metrics since players are, in general, idiots. Just look at the people burning out on grinds. They burnout, sure, but they leave phat positive metrics of engagement with the content just fine all the same.

[Deneios]

Saying that you don't like a game? Fine.

Saying that you, with zero game design experience, know what the fixes should be? Sorry, that ain't gonna fly.


I liken it to this. If a chef makes something and you don't like it, fine. No one can tell you you have to like it. But if you then start to say "well obviously this is how you cook it better!" with zero cooking experience, why in the hell would anybody listen to you?

The only overarching systems we have to thank "player feedback" for are shit like no flying. Which is an excellent example of why player feedback should be taken with a grain of salt.

You dont need to be a expert to see if things are fubar.
I dont need to know how to fly a helicopter to see if one is upside down on a tree burning to know somebody fucked up.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Things will change drastically soon. In what direction I have no idea but you can't keep taking terrible hits constantly. I would be very surprised to see the next expansion being similar but who knows times will tell.

Going by their official reports throughout BfA and the first report for SL, I wouldn't hold my breath.

[Nalam the Venom]

Looks at the cash shop and token system and then

WoW is far behind other MMO's in terms of cash shop tho,

We need more things in it not less.

[Queen of Hamsters]

You dont need to be a expert to see if things are fubar.
I dont need to know how to fly a helicopter to see if one is upside down on a tree burning to know somebody fucked up.

Comparing it to objective things like a Helicopter being upside down burning atop a tree is rather dishonest.

WoW is entertainment. Outside of WoD, there has scarcely been a single damned thing that's been universally hated to a point where it saw lowered profits for the game.

What you think is fubar about the game, someone else thinks is the shit. I've literally got friends telling me that Torghast and Covenants are amazing, and here I am wanting to projectile vomit at the idea of engaging with either one.

I remember how much people shat on WOTLK, nowadays hailed as this game's pinnacle by many. MoP was haaaaated when it was current, yet as years passed the people who actually experienced it, shaped the opinion and now it never ranks low on top expansion lists.

WoW is not a helicopter that can be flown correctly, or incorrectly with risks of crashing and burning. No matter how much some people (Youtubers mostly) seem to think themselves to be experts on flying an MMORPG.

WoD still made 800k USD on its worst year to boot. The helicopter equivalent would've been for the game to die out and make NO money. And it didn't, because many of us still managed to have fun in that expansion.

[Mojo03]

I've seen how player behaviour and feedback shapes the game.

I prefer it when they do their own thing and say screw the haters, and I miss the times when they didn't just focus on "player engagement" metrics since players are, in general, idiots. Just look at the people burning out on grinds. They burnout, sure, but they leave phat positive metrics of engagement with the content just fine all the same.

MOP development was when ghostcrawler was around and the devs were the most active interacting and communicating with the community they've ever been.

Literally the opposite of what you're saying.

[arkanon]

You dont need to be a expert to see if things are fubar.
I dont need to know how to fly a helicopter to see if one is upside down on a tree burning to know somebody fucked up.

Here is the issue with your analogy though - you havnt seen the helicopter - you are not even sure if it crashed at all, its just some dude on youtube saying "hey so i am pretty sure this helicopter is upside down in a tree somewhere" and some people are taking it as fact and extrapolating numerous causes for a crash they cant even confirm happened.

Now if Blizzard came out and said "hey, so our subs have dropped from A down to B, and played hours is down from A to B, and the numbers completing activities 1, 2, & 3 is down to an all-time low from A down to B" - now we have JUST enough information to start drawing some conclusions and talking about possible problems, and potential solutions.