Power Infusions implementation needs a rethink

[Chaddaddy]

No offence but there is alot of people here who are not qualified to speak on who should and shouldn't receive PI.
PI should never be given out from a disc priest to a dps on fights like hungering destroyer, where having a full 20 man ramp for your shells is a huge deal, you are one of the few classes that can actually impact the miasmas.
Later on in the tier when you have better gear and progress, you also shouldn't need to give out pis, if you are playing in top 200 and its pre any sort of nerf you should absolutely give it away excluding very specific scenarios like mentioned earlier or sire p1.

The misinformation here reminds me of how people have tried to guilt trip me into giving it in my second guild awhile ago when re-progregging Hungering, and it is utter nonsense. Disc keeps it for themselves on Hungering, and Sire p1, and argueably can hold it for far more bosses this late into an expansion, if remembering that there is nuance to healing and sometimes it can be warranted if you are underhealing bosses or the other healers are not holding their own.

[Ragnarohk]

So please rethink this ability.

It's a community issue. I would actually love the opposite. More support abilities and roles. I would gladly play a support class that plays by buffing allies and debuffing foes.

[Relapses]

It's a community issue. I would actually love the opposite. More support abilities and roles. I would gladly play a support class that plays by buffing allies and debuffing foes.

You might, but not all players do. Ironically, full support was SPriest's role up until the end of TBC; but WoW made a very clear turn away from this when they started the "bring the player not the class" philosophy in WotLK. This new PI is a half measure to move back in that direction but if I'm being completely honest I think it's a terrible idea. It's kept me from playing my SPriest altogether this expansion because I can't be arsed to be harassed by others for a buff that I'd rather use on myself.

[Biomega]

PI is just bad design the way it works currently. Too much potential for misery. Restrict PI to self or build in the shared PI legendary. We don't really need even more feelsbad mechanics.

[Lollis]

How come Fire Mage and Aff Locks are top of Mythic Logs? When people are spamming PI on them?

Why are top mythic raiders using all their PI's on Fire Mages and Aff Locks?

It's almost because... they're the best classes to PI.

They definitively aren't the best classes to use it on, they have the highest overall dps and just happen to be getting PI as well. There is a difference between gains that means it is worth MORE on one than it is on another, a high parse doesn't take that into account. You should not be using logs to inform everything about the game.

Fire Mage and Affliction gain ~350 dps from PI whereas MM and Unholy gain around 450. While overall a Fire Mage or Affliction lock will most likely do more TOTAL damage, the PI is worth less to them than it is to the Hunter and DK and therefore less to your overall raid dps.

A Hunter going from 6500 to 6900 is a better use of PI than a Fire Mage going from 6700 to 7000

[Radaney]

they have the highest overall dps

Well I'm glad you figured out why they're the best specs to use it on, why on earth would you give it to a spec that's going to do less damage than someone else with it? Total damage is all that actually matters in an actual raiding scenario lol.

Glad we're on the same page.

[Lollis]

Well I'm glad you figured out why they're the best specs to use it on, why on earth would you give it to a spec that's going to do less damage than someone else with it? Total damage is all that actually matters in an actual raiding scenario lol.

Glad we're on the same page.

If you actually read my post it would probably help you understand.

[Relapses]

They definitively aren't the best classes to use it on, they have the highest overall dps and just happen to be getting PI as well. There is a difference between gains that means it is worth MORE on one than it is on another, a high parse doesn't take that into account. You should not be using logs to inform everything about the game.

Fire Mage and Affliction gain ~350 dps from PI whereas MM and Unholy gain around 450. While overall a Fire Mage or Affliction lock will most likely do more TOTAL damage, the PI is worth less to them than it is to the Hunter and DK and therefore less to your overall raid dps.

A Hunter going from 6500 to 6900 is a better use of PI than a Fire Mage going from 6700 to 7000

The main purpose of PI'ing Mages is to help them line up their Combustion windows for certain parts of encounters (ie, pillars on Sludgefist). These are situational nuances that are hard to describe when looking at math on which specs benefit the most from it.

[Erolian]

I think its really just a people/fun problem. I think in some dreamed up scenario PI is an interesting decision. I think in reality it kind of sucks to give away your cooldowns to other players for many people. In reality it kind of sucks to not get PI and compare yourself to others who do in a world where on farm there really isn't anything to do but try to improve your numbers. Its a lot like the phases and mechanics where you have to stop dps or how threat was originally. It sounds interesting on paper but in practice it sucks more fun out of the game than it adds and that is probably the most important reason it shouldn't work the way it does.

[tomten]

Yes, you COULD use power infusion on a tank to help the tank parse, but a) that's dumb, tanks don't benefit from Power Infusion.

You are clueless lol... You literally cant top rank without PI as a tank. Specially as a venthyr prot paladin. (ashen hallow scales with haste....)
Its a huge dps boost...

[Magical Mudcrab]

I've been demanded to offload my PI to help others parse

I'll tell you what I always tell my priest friends: When someone demands you use Power Infusion on them, laugh at them with 25% haste.

[BananaHandsB]

Imagine healer logs omegalul

Imagine thinking dps logs are any more important

[Lollis]

The main purpose of PI'ing Mages is to help them line up their Combustion windows for certain parts of encounters (ie, pillars on Sludgefist). These are situational nuances that are hard to describe when looking at math on which specs benefit the most from it.

Of course, the PI use for Fire Mage is dependant on it being used for Combustion, it's basically worthless for them otherwise. But in most cases (excluding burst phase fights like Sludgefist) it's better used on other specs where it gives more value.

There are two uses for PI in Sludgefist-esque fights when Fire Mages are involved:

• During Combustion for damage (it isn't massively impactful for this because Combustion isn't hugely influenced by haste)
• Outside of CDs for reducing Combustion cooldown faster via Kindling.

The second point can usually be overcome with better gearing on the Mage and since the additional gains are literally a matter of seconds, it makes it a very difficult situation on how you decide the actual overall worth for other fights. I.E. are you going to get enough Combustions out by using PI on a Fire Mage to justify the loss to a class who benefits from it more?

[tomten]

You know how much I give a shit about your top rank? 0. I want the boss dead in the most efficient way possible, your rank isn't helping unless you're the top DPS, and the "venthyr prot paladin" ain't it.

You know how much shit i give about your opinion? 0. Because its irrelevant.
Ranking is pretty much never about doing things the most efficient way, yet again you show how clueless you really are.

[ClassicPeon]

I dont mind PI as much if blizzard choose to do a bunch of support like spells for different classes. PI right now in a vacuum doesnt fit the game and the meta at all.

- - - Updated - - -

I'll tell you what I always tell my priest friends: When someone demands you use Power Infusion on them, laugh at them with 25% haste.

Thats not really how things work though.

If you are in a shitter guild that doesnt give a fuck - sure. If you are progressing on something and people arent shitters? GLHF trolling people with that.

[zenzaliv]

Blessings of the Seasons is never played.

As a Night Fae Paladin, this makes me sad. While they don't have the big hit of Hallow or Toll, the blessings are actually pretty good overall, and on a nice short cooldown.

[Razion]

When PI can go to other people, to solve the negativity some Priests will ask for it to only go to themselves.
When PI only goes to the Priest, other players will campaign for PI to go to others again ("we had no problems with it, it was cool for us"), or some Priests wax nostalgic about "strategizing" by giving it to others. (Completely ignoring the problems other Priests faced with it.)
When PI goes to both, still people beg and trade and play favorites for PI. Toxic play persists. Some Priests ask for it to only go for themselves. Endless cycle.

Yet, if PI gets removed or replaced, people just ask for PI to come back into the toolbox again.
Radically changing PI is also a no-go because people will just wax nostalgic about old PI plays and try to get the old version back.

So freaking, there's no winning with PI. People can't ALL be trusted with PI, and there's no reasonable way to filter out giving PI only to players who would be fair with it, as any customizable build with PI just gets math'd as optimal or not and there would be no choice. There doesn't seem to be ANY damn way to make all camps happy with PI. SOMEONE is going to be unhappy with or without PI.
Power Infusion could turn into a Bloodlust and there'd still be complaining for the old PI to come back.
Freaking, it's like a no-win situation. There's no good way to handle PI.

I think best is try to remove it and hope it stays gone long enough that people forget about it, and then remind people the crap it causes when they ask for it back.
The only way to keep PI dead and gone is to not forget what problems PI keeps bringing back.
Straight-up, PI isn't healthy to all groups when it can be given out - it creates toxicity in some group settings. In its best form it'd be a personal CD, but as long as it exists people will keep asking for it to be given to others.

[Magical Mudcrab]

Thats not really how things work though.

If you are in a shitter guild that doesnt give a fuck - sure. If you are progressing on something and people arent shitters? GLHF trolling people with that.

(As a forward, this post comes off as a little aggressive in retrospect. Just an FYI, it's not meant to be hostile to you, but is a bit more of a severe tone towards guilds with the culture as inferred from the OP's post.)

If you're in a raiding guild and a damage dealer is making demands of you and is overall being an ungrateful shit, you have every right to turn them down or simply use it on someone else. Controversial take, but dps are the least important and most replaceable players in a raid and any raid leader that allows a dps to relentlessly shit on one of their team's healers to the point that they consider quitting the game is a problem. Anyone in that situation should never feel bad for trolling people being toxic.

Regarding whether they're on progression content, dps complaining about parses more-or-less shows that this guild isn't some cutting edge progression guild. I've never been in a mythic guild whose leadership has been enthused about dps trying to parse on progression, and many of them actively discourage pursuing parses as it leads to members tunneling and taking unnecessary risks. The only purpose of logs on progression content should be to help identify mistakes and show which dps are struggling. If your damage is so tight with whatever enrage mechanic that it is a lone PI that is the make or break for a kill, you have bigger problems than the priest not perfectly providing PI.

[EasyE]

I think you missed the part where its farm content, shit is going to die no matter what even if its not used. Progression yes, what he is talking about no, should be able to PI himself with no issues as it was stated it was being given to people purely for parsing.

[Danvash]

I think on progression, you should use PI on whoever gets the most use out of it, and that's usually not a healer outside of situations like mythic Sun King where there's a tight HPS check absent of a DPS check.

But if the raid is on farm and people are demanding it to parse, you have the right to be upset. That's a problem with the guild you're in, not the ability itself.

I play a warlock and hate pugs because I immediately get demands for healthstones and summons when I join even if I'm also flying to the raid. I just leave if it gets excessive. And I recommend you do the same if people are annoying you with incessant begging for PI.