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  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Or it's supposed to show disgust at the behavior of someone else, because that is the most direct and simple definition of it.
    Imagine someone stealing herbs right in front of you and you in turn type /spit, should they now call Blizzard because you bullied them and used /spit "out of context"?

    This is pure nonsense, emotes are completely free game and always have been, if you don't like the emotes of some people /ignore them and move on, if they continue to make Alts in order to specifically spam you with emotes and w/, only then should Blizzard intervene.
    I'm not arguing that it's taken out of context, I would never get upset with a /spit, but it goes both ways in saying that if you don't like the mount, then just ignore it and move on. If the mount disgusts you so much and you can't take seeing it, then take care of your mental health and take a break because reacting so harshly over pixels is unjustified.

  2. #522
    Quote Originally Posted by wizzerdz View Post
    I would never get upset with a /spit, but it goes both ways in saying that if you don't like the mount, then just ignore it and move on. If the mount disgusts you so much and you can't take seeing it, then take care of your mental health and take a break because reacting so harshly over pixels is unjustified.
    You say "it goes both ways", but then you actually don't.

    Because that would mean that those people that actually feel attacked by a /spit should also take care of their mental health because feeling "harassed" by an emote is also unjustified.

  3. #523
    Quote Originally Posted by lagiacrux View Post
    buying glad is not "paying to skip" at all. getting glad is a skillcheck, you cant just invest time into arena games and you will magically get glad. no idea why you would compare those tbh.
    not sure what you mean with "skip to T1"? you mean should there be a way to buy T1 gear from the shop? i dont think so.
    If you invest time into getting better at arena you will get gladiator, it's almost inevitable. It would also most likely take the average person less time /played to get glad than it would to get 60. You are paying to skip the time you would have spent grinding; it is not different than paying for a leveling boost.

    And yes, that's what I meant. Raiding in vanilla WoW is, for the most part again, a time commitment. Being able to purchase objects that boost your gear up to the minimum required level for a raid is, in my eyes, no different from buying a leveling boost.

    I don't see where anyone that defends boosts can draw a line, leveling is an integral part of the game and paying to boost is is the same as paying for gear. Gear is a bi-product of tedious weekly grinds, it does not necessarily require more effort than leveling does, nor does it grant you more power than what leveling does.

    Frankly, I'm starting to question why I bother with forums or even this game. Two people have an argument that comes to some sort of a conclusion and 5 posts later there's someone bringing up the same argument again because they didn't read the previous page.
    Last edited by Zypherz; 2021-05-31 at 04:35 PM.

  4. #524
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    You say "it goes both ways", but then you actually don't.

    Because that would mean that those people that actually feel attacked by a /spit should also take care of their mental health because feeling "harassed" by an emote is also unjustified.
    No, it does go both ways. I never mentioned it because I thought it was obvious. Pretty weak argument on your part.

    EDIT: In case it wasn't clear enough, if you're getting upset irregardless of your position, take a break and go outside. You shouldn't be getting so angry over a game.

  5. #525
    Quote Originally Posted by Detritivores View Post
    The point that I think they were making and that I agree with is that because this wasn't met with strong opposition from the beginning, we are all responsible that it has progressed this far.
    At first we're told it would be only cosmetics and that it won't have any effect in gameplay. Then they slowly brought it up to a boil and now we have boosts and WoW Tokens that are clearly pay to win. Now we're told it was always in the game and we shouldn't be complaining. I say what, I say what in tarnation just happened here?
    I have a very clear memory when the helmets were released of sitting in vent (yes, I'm old) with my guildies and everyone agreeing to deliberately boycott those helmets, both the free one and the purchasable ones. We all felt it was the beginning of a bad thing for our favorite game. And we were not wrong. That is the sentiment I was affirming. Not that it's cool to be mean to people today, but that this is the end result of not revolting hard enough when this process started.
    We should have put a stop to this before it got to this point. We clearly underestimated how many whales have their moms credit cards.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Rageadon View Post
    If you cant handle /spit, then log off the internet
    This right here. If you liked the mount then why do you care what other people think? You did buy it because it looks cool right? Not to impress others with your access to your moms wallet?

  6. #526
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Oh yes, let's equate behavior that causes depression and might lead people to suicide to some random stranger on the Internet typing /spit while having your character selected.
    A modicum of thick skin is required to survive within society, but calling /spit "harassment" is downplaying actual harassment that seriously harms the mental health of people.
    Maybe there are some people that can handle more problematic harassment better than smaller harassment such as this?
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    How the fuck is this trolling?

    Discussing moderation is against the rules. Infracted.

  7. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judgebringer View Post
    At first we're told it would be only cosmetics and that it won't have any effect in gameplay. Then they slowly brought it up to a boil and now we have boosts and WoW Tokens that are clearly pay to win. Now we're told it was always in the game and we shouldn't be complaining. I say what, I say what in tarnation just happened here?

    We should have put a stop to this before it got to this point. We clearly underestimated how many whales have their moms credit cards.

    - - - Updated - - -


    This right here. If you liked the mount then why do you care what other people think? You did buy it because it looks cool right? Not to impress others with your access to your moms wallet?
    Buying a boost is not P2W, and no amounts of bitching about it will make it true. Not on retail and not on classic, not to mention on classic you can only buy one iirc. On retail, the time to level is literally so low that you are probably wasting money instead of levelling normally.

    Then the tokens, oh boy. You can tell someone never played back in the day when they seem to conveniently forget that there were a lot of gold sellers. I personally know a few people who all bought gold from them, and the risk to accounts and security in general is just not worth it. Not to mention, what is the difference with someone playing the auction house and buying carries, or just buying the gold? Do you think the auction house player deserves it just because they didn't buy? They still might lack the skill to actually play, similar to a buyer?

  8. #528
    Quote Originally Posted by Zypherz View Post
    If you invest time into getting better at arena you will get gladiator, it's almost inevitable. It would also most likely take the average person less time /played to get glad than it would to get 60. You are paying to skip the time you would have spent grinding; it is not different than paying for a leveling boost.

    And yes, that's what I meant. Raiding in vanilla WoW is, for the most part again, a time commitment. Being able to purchase objects that boost your gear up to the minimum required level for a raid is, in my eyes, no different from buying a leveling boost.

    I don't see where anyone that defends boosts can draw a line, leveling is an integral part of the game and paying to boost is is the same as paying for gear. Gear is a bi-product of tedious weekly grinds, it does not necessarily require more effort than leveling does, nor does it grant you more power than what leveling does.

    Frankly, I'm starting to question why I bother with forums or even this game. Two people have an argument that comes to some sort of a conclusion and 5 posts later there's someone bringing up the same argument again because they didn't read the previous page.
    You’ve somehow managed to put leveling and raiding/PvP’ing at a competitive level on the same level and I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why.

    Go to the last pages of Raider.io, WCL, wowprogress, or the PvP ladder and explain why people who have put in the same/more time aren’t r1, world first, or competing in MDI.

    It also misses the point that people will generally invest way more time in max level content than leveling content. Selling gear on the store won’t happen and I don’t know why it keeps being referenced.

  9. #529
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsarez View Post
    Sure they can reject me for any reason that they see fit. I can also denounce them for any reason that I see fit. This is generally how a paradigm shift is initiated in a community. Point me to the link where the rules say that I cannot complain about arbitrary measures for group invites?

    I would never dream of rejecting other people who ask me for an invite as long as they meet the level for the dungeon. Unlike toxic, entitled players who believe they only deserve to play with the best of the best players out there, rejecting beginners from low content.
    The difference between the toxic entitlement that you are arguing for and the way Blizzard supports group making is quite simple. Let me repeat it once more:

    Your argument: People have the right/should have the right to join another persons group. You are arguing that it is toxic NOT to invite people. You are trying to guilt-shame other players to invite people that they don't want to play with.

    Blizzard's policy: A person has the right to invite whomever he wants to his group. That person can invite whomever he wants based on his own personal criteria. It is 100% the prerogative of the group creator to invite, manage and kick people from his group.

    I should add that using vile language is against Blizzard's TOS and will result in an infraction. And it doesn't matter if you use such language against people who have bought a boost, people that don't want to play with you or any other reason whatsoever.

    So I am 100% against people harassing people who have bought a boost or ride a particular mount.
    But I 100% support those that don't want to play with people that have bought a boost.

    Personally I don't care either way.

  10. #530
    I hate boosts and IAP.

    Scum of gaming. But the people who buy this crap are the reason why we have TBC. So don't get mad at them. Thank them and get bad at blizzard for allowing people to buy them.

  11. #531
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash The Stampede View Post
    A. Classic has more players than Retail so shut it.
    B. I came from private servers and can go right back. Monetization doesn't keep classic alive, but my desire to play the game does.
    C. If Blizzard didn't bring back classic then they risk losing their copyright, due to private servers. They had no choice but to bring it back.
    A. lulno
    B. "your"
    C. lulno... What are you talking about? Oh right, nothing more

  12. #532
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    The difference between the toxic entitlement that you are arguing for and the way Blizzard supports group making is quite simple. Let me repeat it once more:

    Your argument: People have the right/should have the right to join another persons group. You are arguing that it is toxic NOT to invite people. You are trying to guilt-shame other players to invite people that they don't want to play with.

    Blizzard's policy: A person has the right to invite whomever he wants to his group. That person can invite whomever he wants based on his own personal criteria. It is 100% the prerogative of the group creator to invite, manage and kick people from his group.

    I should add that using vile language is against Blizzard's TOS and will result in an infraction. And it doesn't matter if you use such language against people who have bought a boost, people that don't want to play with you or any other reason whatsoever.

    So I am 100% against people harassing people who have bought a boost or ride a particular mount.
    But I 100% support those that don't want to play with people that have bought a boost.

    Personally I don't care either way.
    I'm saying it's toxic to hate and harass people for buying a 58 boost. The reason for most people I've encountered so far to reject them is because they hate them and want to actively harass them by not giving them the opportunity to participate in the game.

    Mind you that's an anecdote from personal experience based on roughly 1 hour of LFG chat. Instead of being invited to any group, I've been called names, ignored or asked if I was boosted, and then ignored. Seems like this forum is endorsing such behavior, and I call it toxic.

    They can without problem reject me for having a boosted character. I can still continue to denounce them for it, because I think that reasoning is unfair and unjust. It doesn't matter if Blizzard specifically doesn't care about it.
    Last edited by Tsarez; 2021-05-31 at 05:00 PM.

  13. #533
    Quote Originally Posted by Prag View Post
    You’ve somehow managed to put leveling and raiding/PvP’ing at a competitive level on the same level and I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why.

    Go to the last pages of Raider.io, WCL, wowprogress, or the PvP ladder and explain why people who have put in the same/more time aren’t r1, world first, or competing in MDI.

    It also misses the point that people will generally invest way more time in max level content than leveling content. Selling gear on the store won’t happen and I don’t know why it keeps being referenced.
    I didn't reference R1, world first or MDI; I said gladiator. There's a big difference.

    CE, gladiator and KSM is a time commitment and nothing more, you do not need to be some sort of prodigy to reach these levels and nearly anyone can do it in a reasonable time frame. The point that i'm trying to make is that most content, regardless of if it's at max level or not, boils down to time commitment.

    Frankly, I'm surprised more people haven't asked for gear boosts. After all, having gear doesn't mean you can clear the content right? Why do you care if someone else has BIS gear, how does it affect you (/s)? Gear is an inevitability in the same way that max level is if you just play the game. The big difference being that having 60 levels on a player has much more impact than having a few item levels does.

    I also disagree that many people will spend more time at max level than leveling on vanilla versions of the game, don't the majority of players not even hit level cap?

    I just don't see the difference between an item level boost and a leveling boost. I don't see it at all.
    Last edited by Zypherz; 2021-05-31 at 04:57 PM.

  14. #534
    Quote Originally Posted by wizzerdz View Post
    In case it wasn't clear enough, if you're getting upset irregardless of your position, take a break and go outside. You shouldn't be getting so angry over a game.
    Feel free to explain that to the people that equate "X spits on you" to actual harassment on the internet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Usernameforforums View Post
    Maybe there are some people that can handle more problematic harassment better than smaller harassment such as this?
    If you struggle to handle smaller harassment, you still might have certain issues.

    Imagine someone cuts in line and the reaction of one person is to call the police, that's not exactly behavior that most people consider reasonable.
    Of course, the person that cut the line is extremely rude and inpolite, but the response from the other person should be adequate to the offense, struggling with that implies that is unfortunately not a good sign.

  15. #535
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Feel free to explain that to the people that equate "X spits on you" to actual harassment on the internet.

    If you struggle to handle smaller harassment, you still might have certain issues.

    Imagine someone cuts in line and the reaction of one person is to call the police, that's not exactly behavior that most people consider reasonable.
    Of course, the person that cut the line is extremely rude and inpolite, but the response from the other person should be adequate to the offense, struggling with that implies that is unfortunately not a good sign.
    Damn a person with a modicum of logic in here. I ll treasure this rare moment

  16. #536
    Quote Originally Posted by Zypherz View Post
    If you invest time into getting better at arena you will get gladiator, it's almost inevitable. It would also most likely take the average person less time /played to get glad than it would to get 60.
    This is the dumbest shit I've ever heard lmao. The "average" player literally can't get gladiator by definition. The average player would be around the top 50%. Gladiator goes to the top 1%. Literal nonsense.

  17. #537
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    This is the dumbest shit I've ever heard lmao. The "average" player literally can't get gladiator by definition. The average player would be around the top 50%. Gladiator goes to the top 1%. Literal nonsense.
    Gladiator is 2400 rating and 50 wins, unless you're talking about TBC, which I'm not. It was never 1% either, it was 0.5%, but it is fun for me to read someone discuss something with such conviction when they have no clue about it.
    Last edited by Zypherz; 2021-05-31 at 05:11 PM.

  18. #538
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash The Stampede View Post
    A. Classic has more players than Retail so shut it.
    B. I came from private servers and can go right back. Monetization doesn't keep classic alive, but my desire to play the game does.
    C. If Blizzard didn't bring back classic then they risk losing their copyright, due to private servers. They had no choice but to bring it back.
    Not even close lmao.

    Blizzard didn't have to bring back classic to maintain their IP rights. They just had to shut down those using their IP.

  19. #539
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Do you seriously want to call /spit bullying?
    By that logic, Blizzard effectively supports bullying because the existence of the emote.

    The difference is that those people quite often go out of their way to bully others, those people spam social media account(s), dox them, etc..
    Putting aside "bullying on the internet" is a general term, someone taking / uploading a very questionable video / picture of yours, which then goes viral is not the same as /spit in WoW, not even fucking close.
    And frankly, those people most of time attack you over personal matters, not over some actions within a virtual world.

    Seriously, if you cannot see the difference, you need to damn chill, because then playing a game about killing others should be an absolute no go for you.
    Thats a lot of text to justify bullying, even adding in an attack at the victims at the end to complete the bullying.

  20. #540
    Quote Originally Posted by Zypherz View Post
    Gladiator is 2400 rating and 50 wins, unless you're talking about TBC, which I'm not.
    This is literally a thread about TBC so why the fuck would I not be talking about TBC. It's factually the top 1% right now in classic TBC, again, the subject of this thread. Pretty sure it's also always been 1% with top .1% being rank 1 titles since they removed battlegroups.

    Regardless, 2400 rating in arena is still no where close to the 50% mark. The average player does not make it to 2400 and will not make it. Saying if they put enough time into it they will make it would mean they are not an "average" player.

    You fundamentally do not understand what the word "average" means.

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