1. #2841
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Great, so you agree wow is p2w. Thanks for your contributions.
    You think paying gets you an advantage over every player who hasn't paid? That boostees are somehow completing content and getting geared before the boosters taking them through that content?

  2. #2842
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    There's a difference. If a player buys a boost, I can play the game normally and get to the same level. At some point there will be no advantage to the money they spent because potentially we both have the same max power.

    In a pay-2-win game their money will have bought them an advantage beyond what I could get without paying. There character would have a flat 10% damage and health boost or something.
    You couldnt be more wrong. Theres a huuuuge time advantage to the money spent.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  3. #2843
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Fuck you guys are annoying... so what if youre in the world leveling and youre alliance and the booster is horde, trolling low lvl alliance. What choice in the matter is there then?
    Turn warmode off? The same that would happen if a non-boosted character is griefing low level players. Shocking huh?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  4. #2844
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    You think paying gets you an advantage over every player who hasn't paid? That boostees are somehow completing content and getting geared before the boosters taking them through that content?
    See you didnt say every player. You added that now, bc you realize youve been backed into a corner and have to pivot the argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Yes that's what pay-2-win is, you're paying to have an advantage over people who haven't paid.
    Pretty pathetic effort on your part.
    Last edited by Eugenik; 2021-10-10 at 11:20 PM.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  5. #2845
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    So you would dodge the dual like you are dodging the question. Ok, same scenario, but the level 58 is horde, on your realm, on a pvp realm, and he heads to a low lvl zone and starts ganking you. Why would you not just fight him? Is it possibly because...................they have a HUGE advantage?
    Not if a level 60 Alliance character kills him first, and isn't that a scenario that can happen with non-boosted characters? I seem to remember people in Vanilla were perfectly capable of griefing lowbies without having to pay real money.

  6. #2846
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Turn warmode off? The same that would happen if a non-boosted character is griefing low level players. Shocking huh?
    Ohhhhh turning warmode off means the lvl boosted player doesnt have a power advantage. Got it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Not if a level 60 Alliance character kills him first, and isn't that a scenario that can happen with non-boosted characters? I seem to remember people in Vanilla were perfectly capable of griefing lowbies without having to pay real money.
    Right, getting killed by by a 3rd player means the lvl boosted player doesnt have a power advantage on the low lvl player.. Such a brilliant point.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  7. #2847
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    See you didnt say every player. You added that now, bc you realize youve been backed into a corner and have to pivot the argument.
    You said "every player" in the question I was answering...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Do you actually think for WoW to be p2w, the person buying with real money, needs to have an advantage over every other player?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Yes that's what pay-2-win is, you're paying to have an advantage over people who haven't paid. If there are people who haven't paid who you can't get an advantage over with your money then it isn't pay-2-win.
    This isn't a pivot in my argument, this is the point I've been making since I came into this thread.

  8. #2848
    Quote Originally Posted by Ange View Post
    With power level multipliers embeded in timegated raiding, rare raid-drops and timegated gem upgrades and timegates legendary crafting...

    What exactly do you get with getting a BoE drop for 4-10 TOKENS?

    Gearing via vault is time gated, power level modifiers are heavyly time gated - you have to play regularly.

    WoW is as far from P2W as possible the existence of tokens. Gold is not valuable outside of raiding and the expected spending for consumables and BoE's for progression advantages at the beginning of each tier/ilvl jump.

    Even transmog, that could be made fully P2W without big issues, is highly restricted and most demanding items and achievements are moved to FoS and vanity status.
    What you get from tokens is access. You can buy as many boosts as you want.

    You can buy a full mythic raid gear funnel run if you have the cash for gold.
    You can buy a full heroic raid gear funnel run if you have the cash for gold
    You can buy as many mythic 15+ keys as you want if you have the cash for gold
    You can buy arena rating for gear and titles
    You can even buy torghast runs
    You can buy rare mount spawns
    You can buy items of the RMAH

    The game is as P2W as any other game that is P2W if you want to spend the cash

  9. #2849
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    You said "every player" in the question I was answering...





    This isn't a pivot in my argument, this is the point I've been making since I came into this thread.
    Bro, you cant even keep your shit straight..

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Yes that's what pay-2-win is, you're paying to have an advantage over people who haven't paid.
    You can do this right now in WoW. Youre delussional if you think otherwise. If you wernt so blind, youd realize that youre making the argument that WoW is p2w, but somehow youre on the opposite side lmao
    Last edited by Eugenik; 2021-10-10 at 11:27 PM.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  10. #2850
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Ohhhhh turning warmode off means the lvl boosted player doesnt have a power advantage. Got it.
    I have already told you that level boosts are paying to win. That advantage though is inherent to the level system. A player that plays 24 hours in a week (and focuses on leveling) will be higher then a player that only plays 8 hours. Being a higher level is an advantage to the system. A boost is buying power for that reason even if it is an acceptable form of pay to win because it isn't relevant to end-game.

    Using the advantage of levels in PvP is silly though.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  11. #2851
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Bro, you cant even keep your shit straight..
    That would be you. Dhrizzle has been defining P2W in that correct manner and using it as the basis of their argument the entire time.

  12. #2852
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintminya View Post
    That would be you. Dhrizzle has been defining P2W in that correct manner and using it as the basis of their argument the entire time.
    Right:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Yes that's what pay-2-win is, you're paying to have an advantage over people who haven't paid.
    Exactly what you can do in WoW
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  13. #2853
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Bro, you cant even keep your shit straight..

    You can do this right now in WoW. Youre delussional if you think otherwise.
    Twice now you have quoted one of my posts and deliberately left out half of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Yes that's what pay-2-win is, you're paying to have an advantage over people who haven't paid. If there are people who haven't paid who you can't get an advantage over with your money then it isn't pay-2-win.
    Why bother, do you think I wouldn't noticed you were changing my argument by editing my words?

  14. #2854
    Pay to Win is when a player can gain an advantage/benefit that is either exclusive to those paying real money or would take so long for all non-paying players to earn in-game as to no longer be relevant.
    That is not how WoW works.
    I have enough gold to buy a carry in any content, never purchased a token with my CC.
    Plenty of people clear raids and M+ without ever pulling out their CC.
    Top PvP players are doing the same, no CC needed.
    Level boosts are never sold until well after players have had time to earn max level in current content.
    Oh no! Someone is max level in an expansion that ends in 3 months! Or 10-12 levels below cap in an expansion where plenty of people started in the same or better positions by simply playing the previous expansion.
    Last edited by Mokrath; 2021-10-11 at 12:03 AM. Reason: clarified definition of p2w

  15. #2855
    Dreadlord saintminya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Exactly what you can do in WoW
    You should probably go conduct some research on what constitutes an actual advantage...

  16. #2856
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Twice now you have quoted one of my posts and deliberately left out half of it.



    Why bother, do you think I wouldn't noticed you were changing my argument by editing my words?
    Its cute that you think the rest of your quote helps your point, when it doesnt. Unless you think you can gain a time advantage without paying money, but I already know youre delusional, so I wouldnt be surprised if you do.

    Also, Im not changing your words lol. Im direct quoting you.. it just so happens to not back up your point in any way and kinda makes you look foolish lol.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by saintminya View Post
    You should probably go conduct some research on what constitutes an actual advantage...
    Research? Lmao, I dont think the definition of a word requires "research" lol. Spending real money to spend less time to accomplish something, is by definition an advantage...

    re·search
    the systematic investigation into and study of materials and sources in order to establish facts and reach new conclusions.

    ad·van·tage
    a condition or circumstance that puts one in a favorable or superior position.


    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mokrath View Post
    Pay to Win is when a player can gain an advantage/benefit that is either exclusive to those paying real money or would take so long to earn in-game as to no longer be relevant.
    That is not how WoW works.
    I have enough gold to buy a carry in any content, never purchased a token with my CC.
    Plenty of people clear raids and M+ without ever pulling out their CC.
    Top PvP players are doing the same, no CC needed.
    Level boosts are never sold until well after players have had time to earn max level in current content.
    Oh no! Someone is max level in an expansion that ends in 3 months! Or 10-12 levels below cap in an expansion where plenty of people started in the same or better positions by simply playing the previous expansion.
    My man, a lot of people buying carries, arent able to get gladiator or clear mythic raids on their own, so it fits in perfectly with: would take so long to earn in-game as to no longer be relevant.

    Also, how much gold you have personally, is entirely irrelevant.. No one cares if you have enough money to not buy a token, the fact remains, tokens are sold and that gold buys carries.
    Last edited by Eugenik; 2021-10-11 at 12:00 AM.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  17. #2857
    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    My man, a lot of people buying carries, arent able to get gladiator or clear mythic raids on their own, so it fits in perfectly with: would take so long to earn in-game as to no longer be relevant.
    Sorry, forgot to include "would take so long for all non-paying players to earn..."
    Just because everyone can't clear content on the merits of their own skill doesn't make a raid/M+/PvP carry p2w. Plenty of others can and do clear it without a carry every season, patch and expansion.
    Last edited by Mokrath; 2021-10-11 at 12:03 AM.

  18. #2858
    Banned Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Expansions are the ultimate p2w feature. For £30-40 I get access to 10 levels and content with better gear. No-one can match my character's power unless they pay the same.
    This hyperbole is really really really dumb. When you pay for the expansion, do you immediately hit level cap? Do you get given millions of gold in your bank? Do you have all of the best gear and every expansion mount? No?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    complains about 3rd party goldselling while defending Blizzards token. Nice. How can you call that cancer and not the token?
    Because people don't understand the concept of gold buying being bad no matter who does it. They believe that as long as Blizzard is doing it, it must be fine.

    Cutting Edge carries? Bad if you pay a Chinese company to do it.

    Cutting Edge carries? Good if you buy a WoW token and pay a Chinese gold farmer to carry you!

    That extra step makes it TOTALLY not the same thing.

  19. #2859
    Scarab Lord Eugenik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mokrath View Post
    Just because everyone can't clear content on the merits of their own skill doesn't make a raid/M+/PvP carry p2w. Plenty of others can and do clear it without a carry every season, patch and expansion.
    Right, but when you buy a token to buy a carry it becomes p2w . I dont think buying carries with farmed/earned gold is p2w.
    Let's look at the test results. You are a horrible person. It says right here, you're a horrible person. We weren't even testing that. Don't let the horrible person thing get you down though. Science justified your parents choice to abandon you.

  20. #2860
    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Cutting Edge carries? Bad if you pay a Chinese company to do it. Cutting Edge carries? Good if you buy a WoW token and pay a Chinese gold farmer to carry you! That extra step makes it TOTALLY not the same thing.
    The difference between a Blizzard approved and a non-Blizzard approved is one is against the TOS and one is not. Things that are not approved by the TOS/EULA are bad. The extra step does make all the difference, why wouldn't it?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Eugenik View Post
    Right, but when you buy a token to buy a carry it becomes p2w . I dont think buying carries with farmed/earned gold is p2w.
    But it is the same action, same gold. When you buy a token someone else farmed/earned that gold. You are just paying for their effort and not for whatever it is you do with the gold.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

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