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  1. #1521
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    If the win comes from Blizzard why does it require a group of players to carry a person through a raid? If the win comes from Blizzard why does it require a raid to have got a BoE trash drop and an individual to decide to list it on the Auction House? The win comes from players. Blizzard does not supply the win or even the gold. Gold is not a currency specifically set up to be Pay to Win. An example of a currency set up to be pay to win would be coins in PokemonGo. You can get those for free but at a slow trickle per day.

    No amount of buying tokens will give you a win if players are not willing to provide a win.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Pretty much everyone in the game instantly gets more gold then a level 1 new player. So the game is built on unfair advantages and doesn't mean obtaining gold is winning at anything.
    Again. Spend real life money on a currency that buys you power? Pay to win. Fact is fact.

  2. #1522
    Pay2win is explicitly buying power and advantages like gear straight from the developer. Which in WoW you cannot do. Buying a token to turn into gold to then buy a carry from a group in game is NOT and will never be pay2win because you can do the same thing without a token by playing the AH or farming gold. There is nothing you can buy with actual money from Blizzard to make your character better. So it fails literally the first test of a pay2win scenario.

  3. #1523
    Dreadlord Necrosaro123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    The gold comes from a player and not Blizzard. The win comes from a player and not Blizzard. That player doesn't care if you paid real money. Gold is Gold and they will boost you for gold.
    That doesnt matter, the gold was sold by Blizzard, using the work of another player = Pay to Win. You paid cash, you received an advantage = Pay to Win

  4. #1524
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    You win a currency that allows you to purchase whatever you want that's purchaseable. Skipping the process of earning that currency. How is that not P2W? Again. Purchase with real money -> receive currency -> buy items and carries
    Because you win no power by simply having a lot of gold. You win the ability to do things but do not directly win anything. The process of earning gold is not skipped because the gold had to be earned by a player. If something is pay to win through indirect links then you must also count effort through indirect links. Right? Or is this about double standards because of feelings?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  5. #1525
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    If you don't think getting piles of gold just for spending $20 isn't a huge advantage then you definitely don't play WoW.
    Back in BFA I could've just purchased a mythic Jaina run and got the mount, skipping the process of having to farm for it in later expansions. Or skipping the process of progressing through BOD mythic for it.

  6. #1526
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    You use your Credit Card, to get gold = Pay to Win
    So is subscribing to the game pay to win? I use my credit card to get everything in game.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  7. #1527
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Pay2win is explicitly buying power and advantages like gear straight from the developer. Which in WoW you cannot do. Buying a token to turn into gold to then buy a carry from a group in game is NOT and will never be pay2win because you can do the same thing without a token by playing the AH or farming gold. There is nothing you can buy with actual money from Blizzard to make your character better. So it fails literally the first test of a pay2win scenario.
    You buy gold that would take months to farm for any other player. You get an unfair advantage = Pay to Win

    You pay cash in order to skip 50 levels while other players who doesnt pay for it would take them days = Pay to Win

  8. #1528
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    If you don't think getting piles of gold just for spending $20 isn't a huge advantage then you definitely don't play WoW.
    Piles of gold have benefits regardless of the source. It still isn't a form of power being bought. It is a micro transaction. Nothing more. Nothing less.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  9. #1529
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So is subscribing to the game pay to win? I use my credit card to get everything in game.
    You pay Cash, you receive access to the server = Service
    You pay Cash, you receive an unfair advantage over other players = Pay to Win

  10. #1530
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Again. Spend real life money on a currency that buys you power? Pay to win. Fact is fact.
    Pay for Currency. The win is not guaranteed by buying gold.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  11. #1531
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Because you win no power by simply having a lot of gold. You win the ability to do things but do not directly win anything.
    So with this logic, I win but then I don't win but I still won?

    "The process of earning gold is not skipped because the gold had to be earned by a player"

    So you mean I pay Blizzard to give me another player's gold so that I can win with it?

  12. #1532
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Piles of gold have benefits regardless of the source. It still isn't a form of power being bought. It is a micro transaction. Nothing more. Nothing less.
    You paid Blizzard for a token = Microtransaction = You get ingame currency that other people would take them days to get = Pay to win

  13. #1533
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Piles of gold have benefits regardless of the source. It still isn't a form of power being bought. It is a micro transaction. Nothing more. Nothing less.
    It's a microtransaction that provides a HUGE advantage. what are you not understanding about that?

  14. #1534
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    That doesnt matter, the gold was sold by Blizzard, using the work of another player = Pay to Win. You paid cash, you received an advantage = Pay to Win
    So now another player gaining gold makes it pay to win? It is weird how you keep moving the goal posts based on the argument of the moment.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  15. #1535
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Pay for Currency. The win is not guaranteed by buying gold.
    Loot boxes that offer power aren't guaranteed but still considered P2W.

  16. #1536
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    So with this logic, I win but then I don't win but I still won?

    "The process of earning gold is not skipped because the gold had to be earned by a player"

    So you mean I pay Blizzard to give me another player's gold so that I can win with it?
    That sounds like a Pay to Win scheme. One way or another. Even if other player farmed the gold. Is an unfair advantage by just using your Credit Card = Pay to Win

  17. #1537
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    So you mean I pay Blizzard to give me another player's gold so that I can win with it?
    You don't have to win with it though. Because gold can be used for anything gold can be used for. The act of using that gold is not part of the real money transaction.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  18. #1538
    Quote Originally Posted by Stardrift View Post
    Back in BFA I could've just purchased a mythic Jaina run and got the mount, skipping the process of having to farm for it in later expansions. Or skipping the process of progressing through BOD mythic for it.
    Yup exactly. As you said, people like rhorle are why Ubisoft get away with microtransactions even in single player games.

  19. #1539
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So now another player gaining gold makes it pay to win? It is weird how you keep moving the goal posts based on the argument of the moment.
    You pay Cash = You get gold = Is Pay to Win

  20. #1540
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Pay2win is explicitly buying power and advantages like gear straight from the developer. Which in WoW you cannot do. Buying a token to turn into gold to then buy a carry from a group in game is NOT and will never be pay2win because you can do the same thing without a token by playing the AH or farming gold. There is nothing you can buy with actual money from Blizzard to make your character better. So it fails literally the first test of a pay2win scenario.
    I bought gold with cash. Now I can use this gold to buy carries. Looks like I won

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