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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantazma View Post
    5- Can anyone solve this paradox??
    This thread started with me showing that Hunters will have a skill (Wailing Arrow) that in WoW so far only belongs to Sylvanas (a Dark Ranger).
    If Hunter and Dark Rangers are practically the same class... why Hunters don't have 'WailingArrow' (Sylvanas' skill) since forever??
    Ah, now you will say that "wailing Arrow" is not a Dark Ranger skill. Is a banshee power. So in this case I have another question... If playable Dark Rangers would never have banshee powers... why would Hunters have "wailing arrow"?? hahaha...
    "What now Mr. Watson?"
    "I'm out Mr. Holmes..."
    Hunters are not getting a new spell. They will have access to an item, Sylvanas' bow specifically, that grants hunters access to Wailing Arrow. If you unequip that bow, you will no longer have that ability. It is not an actual hunter spell. It is from equipping an item. The reason the ability shows up under "Hunter Spell Changes" is that the bow only grants that ability to hunters, so that's where they put it. In the spell book. If you've been paying attention, you will also see hunters will have access to a quiver that will proc the ability Withering Fire, also one of Sylvanas' abilities, but tied directly to an equipped item. I really hope you get this. All of this has been known for months. You didn't discover anything. You are not clever.

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  2. #162
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    You complain about me using warriors in my examples, yet you use a priest in your example. Hypocrite much?
    your really gonna call me dishonest and then act like the head priest of Razon who uses his magic and acts with his blessing is completely different then the prelates who use his magic and act with his blessings but also have shields?

    There’s no hypocrisy just your dishonesty so you can avoid admitting there not the same.


    Except you technically did, when you said that "prelates are like shaman/witchdoctor/shadow hunter"
    no I didn’t by any stretch you brought them up and I sighted there similarity’s being how they act with the Loa not any of the magics you listed, again your being dishonest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    ah yes because all of those start and end with there magic types it’s not like they have any thing to do with Loa



    They are wearing the headpiece. Everything else is not shaman gear.
    I miss remembered the belt being the same so fine your right on that it’s only the headpiece.


    It does, because a defining trait of the warrior class, just like the paladin class, is the usage of heavy armor. Of which Garrosh is wearing basically none.
    id argue that warriors aren’t defined by plate in the lore but I’m not going on another tangent. The fact that you can’t give any pally examples after asserting that it define pally’s in the lore speaks for it self.


    And here you basically admit to more dishonesty, as you dismiss information as non-canon because it's vague.
    I didn’t say it was none canon I said it was vague and could mean any thing and that it’s not lore unless you can sight how it’s some how only a dark rangers can do, you can’t do that.

    Because we have three examples in which that happens. So to say that it's not allowed is dishonest.
    I never said you can’t make up fanfic you can make up all the fanfic you want but that doesn’t make it lore which what I asked for and you failed to provide.


    Except yours is unfit because the term "sowing hatred in enemy ranks" does not mean "taunting them". It means causing conflicts within the enemy ranks.
    I’m just as fit as you are as there is no lore to prove either of us right or wrong. You can say it means what ever you want it to but there isn’t any actual lore to back up your view over mine.

    Also, dark rangers do not use pets. The one sole exception to this is Nathanos, but as a VIP NPC he, like many others, such as Anduin and Garrosh, don't follow class rules.
    so dark rangers do use pets as we have an actual example of one doing so in the lore unlike all the things you have asserted they can do with no backing.

    So scratch that earlier bit about us both being equally right/wrong you’ve proven my view has objectively more weight then your own by siting an actual dark rangers in the lore that is closer to what I describe, that’s quite the self own.
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2021-06-08 at 03:12 PM.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    No it's not. Not even close. The story of dark rangers ends with Shadowlands. Period. Dark ranger could be a hunter spec MAYBE but even that is a huge stretch. So you can rant and rave all you want about dark rangers being playable but as others said, if they were going to be added then they would have been added in Shadowlands. But they weren't. And now that hunters get access to what most people call a dark ranger's signature ability, we have concrete proof that dark rangers are literally nothing but undead edgy hunters.
    You are boring. Why do some people simply exist to be a dick and shit on people's completely harmless ideas? RELAX DUDE. If this has you bent out of shape you need to find a new hobby or expend some energy working out or something.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    So you admit to bias, and that you dismiss opinions that don't fit yours, and dismiss evidence when they go against your narrative.


    Except, as per the Warcraft 3 unit, it does have the Charm ability.


    It's not. It's their description.


    One: I never said they are "completely separate from hunters", especially paladins aren't "completely separate from priests". Two: you've dismissed evidence that I provided so far.

    - - - Updated - - -


    You complain about me using warriors in my examples, yet you use a priest in your example. Hypocrite much?


    Except you technically did, when you said that "prelates are like shaman/witchdoctor/shadow hunter"


    They are wearing the headpiece. Everything else is not shaman gear.


    It does, because a defining trait of the warrior class, just like the paladin class, is the usage of heavy armor. Of which Garrosh is wearing basically none.


    And here you basically admit to more dishonesty, as you dismiss information as non-canon because it's vague.


    Because we have three examples in which that happens. So to say that it's not allowed is dishonest.


    Except yours is unfit because the term "sowing hatred in enemy ranks" does not mean "taunting them". It means causing conflicts within the enemy ranks. Also, dark rangers do not use pets. The one sole exception to this is Nathanos, but as a VIP NPC he, like many others, such as Anduin and Garrosh, don't follow class rules.
    I love how when discussing Tinkers, you will write off claw pack because it's nowhere in WoW yet when shown Charm isn't something Dark Rangers have in WoW, you will use the WC3 as evidence. The double standard is aggravating. Also, paladins and priests ARE different and it's explained pretty well in the lore. Meanwhile, there is absolutely nothing in the lore that explains how dark rangers and hunters are different. You've just used the same two sentences over and over again while disregarding the fact that those two sentences are not something the are unique to dark rangers. Because then by using those two sentences you keep using, Valeera and Mathias Shaw are dark rangers.

  5. #165
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    your really gonna call me dishonest and then act like the head priest of Razon who uses his magic and acts with his blessing is completely different then the prelates who use his magic and act with his blessings but also have shields?

    There’s no hypocrisy just your dishonesty so you can avoid admitting there not the same.
    Except we already had zandalari paladins back in MoP who used paladin-like abilities, which reinforced the idea they're paladins, and not "shamans/witchdoctors/shadow hunters". Not to mention that shamans, witch doctors and shadow hunters are not depicted by wearing heavy armor, shields and swords, and using paladin-like abilities.

    no I didn’t by any stretch you brought them up and I sighted there similarity’s being how they act with the Loa not any of the magics you listed, again your being dishonest.
    It's not a stretch. That is basically the extent of what you claimed, considering shamans, witchdoctors and shadow hunters in nothing are related to prelates, other than all of them being troll-related.

    I didn’t say it was none canon I said it was vague and could mean any thing and that it’s not lore unless you can sight how it’s some how only a dark rangers can do, you can’t do that.
    Except you really did just that:
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Im the dishonest one? I’m not the one pointing to a vague description and claiming it to be lore when it isn’t

    I’m just as fit as you are as there is no lore to prove either of us right or wrong. You can say it means what ever you want it to but there isn’t any actual lore to back up your view over mine.
    Except your interpretation is not really a valid one. What you said like saying "passing through a door" is the same thing as "passing by a door".

    so dark rangers do use pets as we have an actual example of one doing so in the lore unlike all the things you have asserted they can do with no backing.
    Except, no, they do not. As far as I know, Nathanos is the sole example of that, and on top of that, through Nathanos' entire existence he did not use pets. Only when he became a "raid boss" that he was given two pets, which further supports the idea that he's the exception, not the norm. Just like Anduin wearing plate does not mean priests can use plate armor. Or that Garrosh drinking in Y'shaarj's blood means warriors can use shadow abilities.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    I love how when discussing Tinkers, you will write off claw pack because it's nowhere in WoW yet when shown Charm isn't something Dark Rangers have in WoW, you will use the WC3 as evidence. The double standard is aggravating.
    Except we do have evidence of Sylvanas apparently being able to alter someone's will, back in Cataclysm and then again in Battle for Azeroth when she stated her plans for Derek Proudmoore.

    Also, paladins and priests ARE different and it's explained pretty well in the lore.
    But they are intrinsically linked, kind of like hunters and dark rangers.

    Meanwhile, there is absolutely nothing in the lore that explains how dark rangers and hunters are different.
    If you dismiss everything in the lore that explains how they're different, of course it's easy to say "there's absolutely nothing in the lore".

    You've just used the same two sentences over and over again
    Because you repeatedly hand-wave them away. Address them and we can move on to different things.
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  6. #166
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Except we already had zandalari paladins back in MoP who used paladin-like abilities, which reinforced the idea they're paladins, and not "shamans/witchdoctors/shadow hunters". Not to mention that shamans, witch doctors and shadow hunters are not depicted by wearing heavy armor, shields and swords, and using paladin-like abilities.
    and even back in mop they used the light of the Loa and talanji shows us what that light looks like in the lore and it’s nothing like the holy light and is closer to the other examples of trolls calling on Loa.

    Unless you want to stick with your dishonest argument that the priest of razon who use his magic and act with his blessings are nothing like the prelates of razon who use his magic and act with his blessing that clearly shows the light of the Loa is unlike the holy light.


    It's not a stretch. That is basically the extent of what you claimed, considering shamans, witchdoctors and shadow hunters in nothing are related to prelates, other than all of them being troll-related.
    again this is pure dishonestly as I’ve already pointed out they are all tied to Loa and act with Loa magics and blessings just like the prelates. You ignore what I’m actually saying In my post to push your own straw man onto me and then knock it down.


    Except you really did just that:
    it not being lore has nothing to do with it being canon or not. It’s a description that could mean any thing in the lore without setting down any actual Lore in of it self.




    Except your interpretation is not really a valid one. What you said like saying "passing through a door" is the same thing as "passing by a door".
    again nothing but baseless assertions from you there is no lore that makes my interpretation less valid then yours, hell mine is more valid then yours as shown by Nathanos.


    Except, no, they do not. As far as I know, Nathanos is the sole example of that, and on top of that, through Nathanos' entire existence he did not use pets. Only when he became a "raid boss" that he was given two pets, which further supports the idea that he's the exception, not the norm. Just like Anduin wearing plate does not mean priests can use plate armor. Or that Garrosh drinking in Y'shaarj's blood means warriors can use shadow abilities.
    Completely incorrect he had pets all the way back in classic and as the only dark rangers of note who who isn’t using banshee powers my views just objectively have more weight then your own as you can’t sight any examples of dark rangers fulfilling your baseless assertions but I can now point to nathanos who is pure dark rangers with no outside influence unlike sylvanas.

    God I bet you regret Dismantling your own argument by bringing him up.

    Nathanos returned to his old home, the Marris Stead in the Eastern Plaguelands, with his pet blighthounds on the banshee queen's orders. There he recruited Horde soldiers to fight against corrupted animals (such as plaguebats), the Scourge, and the Scarlet Crusaders of Tyr's Hand.[11][13]


    He’s not even the only one with pets.

    Dark rangers are seen with domesticated spiders during the Hillsbrad conflict, doing battle with the Bloodfang worgen. They are empowered by Helcular.
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2021-06-08 at 05:10 PM.

  7. #167
    It's amazing how people can accept that a guy in plate with a sword, and a guy in plate with a sword and light powers, and a guy in plate with a sword and necromantic powers can be 3 different classes. But a guy with a bow, and a guy with a bow and necromantic powers are the same thing.
    Probably the same people going "tinker is not a class, it's a profession."

  8. #168
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarba View Post
    It's amazing how people can accept that a guy in plate with a sword, and a guy in plate with a sword and light powers, and a guy in plate with a sword and necromantic powers can be 3 different classes. But a guy with a bow, and a guy with a bow and necromantic powers are the same thing.
    Probably the same people going "tinker is not a class, it's a profession."
    For the record I’m totally fine with dark rangers being a class I’m just showcasing that they are in no way further from hunters then zandalari prelates are from holy light paladins and pointing out the massive holes in every thing Ielenia post to try and claim otherwise.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Except we already had zandalari paladins back in MoP who used paladin-like abilities, which reinforced the idea they're paladins, and not "shamans/witchdoctors/shadow hunters". Not to mention that shamans, witch doctors and shadow hunters are not depicted by wearing heavy armor, shields and swords, and using paladin-like abilities.


    It's not a stretch. That is basically the extent of what you claimed, considering shamans, witchdoctors and shadow hunters in nothing are related to prelates, other than all of them being troll-related.


    Except you really did just that:




    Except your interpretation is not really a valid one. What you said like saying "passing through a door" is the same thing as "passing by a door".


    Except, no, they do not. As far as I know, Nathanos is the sole example of that, and on top of that, through Nathanos' entire existence he did not use pets. Only when he became a "raid boss" that he was given two pets, which further supports the idea that he's the exception, not the norm. Just like Anduin wearing plate does not mean priests can use plate armor. Or that Garrosh drinking in Y'shaarj's blood means warriors can use shadow abilities.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Except we do have evidence of Sylvanas apparently being able to alter someone's will, back in Cataclysm and then again in Battle for Azeroth when she stated her plans for Derek Proudmoore.


    But they are intrinsically linked, kind of like hunters and dark rangers.


    If you dismiss everything in the lore that explains how they're different, of course it's easy to say "there's absolutely nothing in the lore".


    Because you repeatedly hand-wave them away. Address them and we can move on to different things.
    Sylvanas is a banshee. Dark rangers are not. So yeah, she's gonna have different powers. She has also been empowered by the Jailer since Edge of Night apparently. So using her as an example is pretty asinine.

    I haven't dismissed anything. There is absolutely zero lore that separates them. They are quite literally just undead hunters. Their lore states the vast majority of them are forcibly risen Farstrider rangers. And guess what? Farstrider rangers are HUNTERS. So the only person who ignores lore is you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarba View Post
    It's amazing how people can accept that a guy in plate with a sword, and a guy in plate with a sword and light powers, and a guy in plate with a sword and necromantic powers can be 3 different classes. But a guy with a bow, and a guy with a bow and necromantic powers are the same thing.
    Probably the same people going "tinker is not a class, it's a profession."
    Dark rangers have ONE necromancy spell and now hunters are getting it lol

  10. #170
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    and even back in mop they used the light of the Loa and talanji shows us what that light looks like in the lore and it’s nothing like the holy light and is closer to the other examples of trolls calling on Loa.

    Unless you want to stick with your dishonest argument that the priest of razon who use his magic and act with his blessings are nothing like the prelates of razon who use his magic and act with his blessing that clearly shows the light of the Loa is unlike the holy light.

    again this is pure dishonestly as I’ve already pointed out they are all tied to Loa and act with Loa magics and blessings just like the prelates. You ignore what I’m actually saying In my post to push your own straw man onto me and then knock it down.
    And that is irrelevant. Because the dwarf's paladin powers do not come from the elements (or loa), the draenei shaman powers do not come from the light (or loa). What you're doing here is that the dwarf shaman and troll shaman are different classes because the dwarf's shaman powers do not come form the loa. Hell, the orc shaman is not a shaman because its powers don't come from the loa.

    it not being lore has nothing to do with it being canon or not.
    Wow. Just... wow. "It not being lore has nothing to do with it being lore or not". Or "it not being canon has nothing to do with it being canon or not". That is literally what you said. The lore of Warcraft is the canon of Warcraft.

    again nothing but baseless assertions from you there is no lore that makes my interpretation less valid then yours, hell mine is more valid then yours as shown by Nathanos.
    "Baseless assertions" made based on the meaning of the words used.

    Completely incorrect he had let’s all the way back in classic and as the only dark rangers of note who who isn’t using banshee powers my views just objectively have more weight then your own as you can’t sight any examples of dark rangers fulfilling your baseless assertions but I can now point to nathanos who is pure dark rangers with no outside influence unlike sylvanas.

    God I bet you regret Dismantling your own argument by bringing him up.
    I don't, really. He wasn't even considered a "dark ranger" until he was pulled full into Sylvanas' service as her second-in-command. From which point on he was never seen with pets, always alone, as far as I can recall.
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  11. #171
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    And that is irrelevant. Because the dwarf's paladin powers do not come from the elements (or loa), the draenei shaman powers do not come from the light (or loa). What you're doing here is that the dwarf shaman and troll shaman are different classes because the dwarf's shaman powers do not come form the loa. Hell, the orc shaman is not a shaman because its powers don't come from the loa.
    unlike prelates troll shamans don’t get there shamanistic powers from the Loa they still use the elements like all other shamans, they can get other power from Loa but that’s not baseline.

    Paladins on the other hand all get there powers from the holy light excluding sun walkers and prelates who get there power from the sun and Razon respectively. In the prelates case we have a clear example of what that powers look like through there head priest and it’s nothing like the holy light.

    By sighting shamans who all function off the elementals you only further prove that they are not like paladins.




    Wow. Just... wow. "It not being lore has nothing to do with it being lore or not". Or "it not being canon has nothing to do with it being canon or not". That is literally what you said. The lore of Warcraft is the canon of Warcraft.
    lore and cannon are not the same thing we have a ton of lore that is no longer canon but that doesn’t mean it never existed.


    Baseless assertions" made based on the meaning of the words used.
    soly your interpretation with no lore to back them up.


    I don't, really. He wasn't even considered a "dark ranger" until he was pulled full into Sylvanas' service as her second-in-command. From which point on he was never seen with pets, always alone, as far as I can recall.
    why don’t we use the wowpedia description of dark rangers as it’s what you keep going back to.

    Dark rangers are undead archers in service of the Forsaken or Sylvanas Windrunner.
    oh look he was always a dark ranger! It looks like your attempt at moving the goal post from “he never had pets before he was a boss” to “well he wasn't even a dark rangers” was unsuccessful.

    Why do you keep giving me more rope to hang you with why not just admit that your wrong and some dark rangers do have pets like hunters?
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2021-06-08 at 05:52 PM.

  12. #172
    And to think that if one day Blizzard releases Playable Dark Rangers I'll have two things with endless fun:
    1 - Play with my new main-char Dark Ranger.
    2 - This thread.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantazma View Post
    Yes I did.

    Facts:
    1 - Sylvanas is a Dark Ranger.
    2 - In the video below we see Sylvanas (a Dark Hunger) fighting like... a Dark Ranger.
    3 - Literally none of skills we see are present in Hunters today.



    If I have an undead Hunter and "Dark Rangers are just undead Hunters"... I ask you:

    Where's my teleport skill ??
    Where's my Mind Control skill ??
    Where's my dagger throwing ??
    Where is my AOE skill that applies silence ??
    Where are my arrows with shadow damage ??
    Where are ALL my possible Banshee powers ??
    FACT That game isn't WoW.

  14. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by xuros View Post
    FACT That game isn't WoW.
    FACT: That game is WoW:


  15. #175
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Paladins on the other hand all get there powers from the holy light excluding sun walkers and prelates who get there power from the sun and Razon respectively. In the prelates case we have a clear example of what that powers look like through there head priest and it’s nothing like the holy light.
    The source of the power is not important if the function is the same. "The light of the loa" is enough to justify zandalari having access to magic and abilities that resemble holy magic, and therefore allow for priests and paladins.

    lore and cannon are not the same thing we have a ton of lore that is no longer canon but that doesn’t mean it never existed.
    If it's not canon, it's not lore. Also, you have provided literally no evidence that the pieces of lore I presented are not canon, other than your own assertions. Which is amusing considering how many times you've accused me of "having no evidence".

    why don’t we use the wowpedia description of dark rangers as it’s what you keep going back to.
    You mean the WoWPedia description that describes the dark rangers as a separate entity from the playable hunter class concept?

    oh look he was always a dark ranger! It looks like your attempt at moving the goal post from “he never had pets before he was a boss” to “well he wasn't even a dark rangers” was unsuccessful.
    Except, as far as I know, he was never referred to as a dark ranger until the Legion expansion. Which coincidentally also gave him a new model based on the story in which Sylvanas transfers his soul into his own cousin's body and "made him stronger":

    "As the Legion began invading Azeroth, Sylvanas called Nathanos to partake in a ritual meant to make him stronger. He agreed to take part, though not before attempting to provoke her. When he discovered that the ritual would involve the Val'kyr sacrificing his cousin Stephon Marris, he felt no regret, only the duty-bound oath he had made towards Sylvanas. The Val'kyr proceeded to place herself between the human and the undead and began chanting guttural words in an ancient tongue, flashes of blue and gold pulsing from her hands. Nathanos lost his senses for a time, his world exploding in fire and pain. When the Blightcaller's wits returned, he found that he had been transformed to become stronger than before and not be as decayed and withered as he had been."
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  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantazma View Post
    FACT: That game is WoW:

    Comparing a raid boss to what a player might be capable is utterly laughable.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantazma View Post
    And to think that if one day Blizzard releases Playable Dark Rangers I'll have two things with endless fun:
    1 - Play with my new main-char Dark Ranger.
    2 - This thread.
    having a hard time rebutting my response to you? hunters arent getting a new ability. they are getting a new item. an item that will be replaced before the end of the expansion. the reason hunters are "just now getting a dark ranger ability" is that they are gaining it 100% from looting an item from a dark ranger, and they dont learn it. the bow fires the wailing arrow. take off the bow, no wailing arrow. same with heart of azeroth abilities. just because these items are coming into the game doesnt mean they will introduce a new class.

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  18. #178
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    The source of the power is not important if the function is the same. "The light of the loa" is enough to justify zandalari having access to magic and abilities that resemble holy magic, and therefore allow for priests and paladins.
    So we circle back again to twilight hammer being Paladins as there magic resembles the holy light about as much as the light of the Loa show cased by talanji.

    also the Source is absolutely important its why we don't say shamans mages and warlocks are all the same class even though they can all shoot fire.


    If it's not canon, it's not lore.
    I disagree non canon stuff is still lore it's just lore that is no longer taken into account for the purpose of further lore development.

    Also, you have provided literally no evidence that the pieces of lore I presented are not canon, other than your own assertions. Which is amusing considering how many times you've accused me of "having no evidence".
    I never said it wasn't canon.


    You mean the WoWPedia description that describes the dark rangers as a separate entity from the playable hunter class concept?
    The same page has this little tidbit.
    There has been only one recording of a human ranger and subsequent dark ranger. Nathanos Blightcaller's resurrection as one of the Forsaken and service to the Dark Lady has earned him the rank of Champion of the Banshee Queen.

    No where does any of that say that he only became a dark ranger after the Ritual In fact there is no lore in the whole of wow that states he was ever any thing other then a Ranger/dark Ranger.

    Again just admit your wrong and that dark rangers sometimes have pets Nathanos isn't even the only example of it and your desperate squirming to Lock him into Only being a dark Ragner post legion isn't gonna get you any where as nothing backs that up.
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2021-06-09 at 01:00 AM.

  19. #179
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevenantHero View Post
    Comparing a raid boss to what a player might be capable is utterly laughable.
    Why? Death knights got Lich King abilities later in life. They do have Defile, a previously LK-only ability, for example.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    So we circle back again to twilight hammer being Paladins as there magic resembles the holy light about as much as the light of the Loa show cased by talanji.
    I never said the twilight hammer being paladins. And void magic resembling the holy light? That's absurd.

    also the Source is absolutely important its why we don't say shamans mages and warlocks are all the same class even though they can all shoot fire.
    First, that's false equivalence, because you can still have two classes that uses the exact same source of power (hello priests and paladins), and second, that's a wrong comparison because you're talking about just one of the many abilities the classes have.

    I disagree non canon stuff is still lore it's just lore that is no longer taken into account for the purpose of further lore development.
    This isn't a case of "agree to disagree". You're plain wrong, there. That's like saying fanfics are still official lore.

    I never said it wasn't canon.
    Again, you literally did:
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Im the dishonest one? I’m not the one pointing to a vague description and claiming it to be lore when it isn’t

    No where does any of that say that he only became a dark ranger after the Ritual In fact there is no lore in the whole of wow that states he was ever any thing other then a Ranger/dark Ranger.
    That is not what I said. Stop wasting processing power by saying "you're wrong!" and actually read what I write. I said, and I quote: "as far as I know, he was never referred to as a dark ranger until the Legion expansion."
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  20. #180
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I never said the twilight hammer being paladins. And void magic resembling the holy light? That's absurd.
    It's not you saying there Paladins it's that you Minimalize being a Paladin to just the fact that there magic can heal and protect and that they wear plate which also can and does apply to the twilight hammer.

    The Magic talanji showcases resembling the holy light is also absurd that's the whole Point both are nothing like the actual holy light used by other Paladins.

    First, that's false equivalence, because you can still have two classes that uses the exact same source of power (hello priests and paladins), and second, that's a wrong comparison because you're talking about just one of the many abilities the classes have.
    It's not at all a false equivalence as you want to strip away the source and focus only on the function and in the case of warlock/mages/shamans they all have that same end function when it comes to fire and also frost when it comes to shamans/mages.

    Either the source doesn't matter and only function does in which case warlocks/mages/shamans should be all the same class or the classes aren't just defined by function In the lore.

    This isn't a case of "agree to disagree". You're plain wrong, there. That's like saying fanfics are still official lore.
    It's really not as fanfic has never been part of official lore or cannon unlike official lore that has simply been determined to no longer fit into the frame work of the lore making it no longer canon.


    Again, you literally did:
    do you see the word cannon in there? I don't, Not even any mortar's or artillery that could be mistaken for one.




    That is not what I said. Stop wasting processing power by saying "you're wrong!" and actually read what I write. I said, and I quote: "as far as I know, he was never referred to as a dark ranger until the Legion expansion."
    So you admit he's been a dark ranger since he was raised,he has always had pets, Dark rangers do in fact have pets, and all of your previous statements about him were a frivolous waste of every one's time based off of nothing, was that so hard?
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2021-06-09 at 01:34 AM.

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